Rogue: Simple Questions/Simple Answers - Page 3

Imiut · 11/18/08, 2:28 AM

Originally Posted by Aldriana

For Combat:

Stat	EP
Str	1.1
Agi	2.0
Crit	1.5
Exp	1.6
Haste	1.4
ArPen	1.2

Hit is about 1.8 below the yellow hit cap, 1.6 below the poison hit cap, and 1.4 thereafter.

Is there any specific reason expertise for combat is now valued so much lower than agility? Last time I used Sp00n's addition to Vul's spreadsheet I had it on 1.84. Also, thanks for providing the hit values, these are a big help. I reckoned I was going mental when the figures I got were consistently higher than what was posted on page 113 of the WOTLK PVE discussion thread.

Darktangent · 11/18/08, 5:57 AM

Originally Posted by Rambaral

Shadowpanther is still sorting stuff out, and his dagger charts are screwy since he has two of them, and one is still using the old mutilate formula. Other gear he has listed is still questionable in priority since my spreadsheet showed dps loss when equipping one of his "upgrades". His site is still pretty good for gear planning but try spreadsheeting first before making quest reward choices. There are a few where the reward is a fist, sword, or dagger, and the choice is a bit rough unless you know exactly how you're going to spec through 80. His quandary is the difference of specs and the viability of both, combat sword/dagger needs a different oh dagger than a mut build, but one sheet of weapons can't illustrate that, so he's probably going to have to make separate sheets for different specs.

Make no mistake, Blizz wants you to use 1.8 daggers, there are more of them than any other in wotlk.

I got the impression that shadowpanther does not consider weapon dps and speed into his MAEP calculations. I could be wrong though. As for using a dagger OH, I got the impression that you lose dps versus having a sword equipped.

RedOtto · 11/18/08, 9:58 AM

Originally Posted by Vonhinten

Question: Totally naked and untalented, equipping a fist weapon increases critical strike by 5%. Why, and is it a bug that is expected to be corrected soon?

Because you talented fists and that gives a 5% crit increase at a guess

Mitey · 11/18/08, 10:31 AM

I know these might have been answered in the locked thread, but I thought I'd ask them here for easy access purpose.

What are the yellow and poison hit caps where hit rating is worth less?

For combat, what weapon combinations are the best now? Is it sword/sword and fist/sword still? Are there others? What's not good?

Thanks!

Sparticus · 11/18/08, 10:33 AM

I know that expertise is a more highly rated stat than hr (once the yellow and poison cap is met) Can someone explain why this is? Does expertise now help with % miss chance as well as dodge/parry?

Tinwhisker · 11/18/08, 10:56 AM

Originally Posted by Mitey

I know these might have been answered in the locked thread, but I thought I'd ask them here for easy access purpose.

What are the yellow and poison hit caps where hit rating is worth less?

For combat, what weapon combinations are the best now? Is it sword/sword and fist/sword still? Are there others? What's not good?

Thanks!

You can find the hit caps here.

As for combat weapon selection, Fist/Dagger is good, Fist/Fist is good, Sword/Sword is good, and Fist/Sword (with 5/5 CQC and 4/5 in sword spec) is good too. Obviously the first two will leave more talent points open to you but the best advice is to use the best weapons that are available to you.

Playaskillz · 11/18/08, 12:37 PM

I hope I'm posting this in the right place

The Hemo tool tip says "increasing the physical damage dealt to a target by up to..."

For other spells and abilities that "up to" relates to a coefficient doesn't it?
I don't have access to the spreadsheet because I'm at work right now, but I think the spreadsheet counts max hemo damage on each hit.

Does anyone have any idea about this? I don't even know how I could accurately test this. The same sizes would have to be huge to get accurate numbers...

Maybe I'm wrong and it means something else - ideas?

Fold · 11/18/08, 2:37 PM

Originally Posted by Sparticus

I know that expertise is a more highly rated stat than hr (once the yellow and poison cap is met) Can someone explain why this is? Does expertise now help with % miss chance as well as dodge/parry?

As I understand it expertise doesn't explicitly add +hit, but it does effectively because it's removing dodge & parry from the combat table.

drumbum · 11/18/08, 3:12 PM

Originally Posted by Sparticus

I know that expertise is a more highly rated stat than hr (once the yellow and poison cap is met) Can someone explain why this is? Does expertise now help with % miss chance as well as dodge/parry?

The difference is that expertise rating will help yellow damage since special attacks can still be dodged.

drumbum · 11/18/08, 3:16 PM

Try not to read too much into tooltips because they often are misleading. However, the damage added by the Hemo debuff is affected by armor, which is likely the reason for that wording.

Bues · 11/18/08, 5:00 PM

I was wondering if anyone could offer advice for my current mutilate spec: Mutilate 52/17/2
Armory Link

I've also tried out combat swords and done multiple 5 mans and get more dps with combat swords than mutilate spec. This is my first time I've played anything other than Combat swords (sub for pvp in TBC), so I was wondering I was using a wrong rotation or something else.

Rotation:
-Stack 3 Hunger for Blood
-Get SnD up
-Mutilate
-Envenom when SnD is about to run out
-Refresh Hunger for Blood when needed
- Mutilate

Again, this is my first time trying a mutilate build and this seemed like the right rotation, but I could be wrong.

Feist-Mok · 11/18/08, 5:11 PM

Originally Posted by Bues

I was wondering if anyone could offer advice for my current mutilate spec: Mutilate 52/17/2
Armory Link

I've also tried out combat swords and done multiple 5 mans and get more dps with combat swords than mutilate spec. This is my first time I've played anything other than Combat swords (sub for pvp in TBC), so I was wondering I was using a wrong rotation or something else.

Rotation:
-Stack 3 Hunger for Blood
-Get SnD up
-Mutilate
-Envenom when SnD is about to run out
-Refresh Hunger for Blood when needed
- Mutilate

Again, this is my first time trying a mutilate build and this seemed like the right rotation, but I could be wrong.

Drop Imp. S'n'D, 2 points in CQC, and 1 of your assasination points for 5 points in Relentless Strikes.

Pick up 5 points in Improved Poisons. Quick Reovery, Vigor, and Ruthlessness, and Master Poisoner are good spots to jack points from.

Turn the Tables is better than Master Poisoner, unless you don't run with a Paladin of just about any spec - pick one of the two, don't go partial on either.

The rotation is basically as you described, except rupturing when the option is there in between envenoms.

Kakon · 11/18/08, 5:27 PM

Wondering how to bind TotT to Sinister Strike basicly I want it to work like this

If Tricks of the Trade is up
/cast [target=focus] Tricks of the Trade (also to make it to use it if focus=exisits, dunno how to do that, so its not constatly error messaging when I am soloing)

If Tricks of the Trade is on Cool Down
/cast Sinister Strike (on currently selected target)

Gonna use a simple macro and Grid to choose who my focus is, whether the main tank in the beginning of a boss fight then my rogue buddy and me casting it on eachother for dps, or a "oh shit that resto druid had to go bear for" on a bad trash pull so I need to put threat on him.

Hardest Part for me is that I want it on a single button mash, both abilities are on GCD, TotT is 15 energy, my SS currently 40.

Right now I have it so I focus a target, hit E to use my tricks and have DoTimer watching my CD, would just be nice fora macro so I dont have to have an extra bar on my screen. I just change it by using Grid focus=mouseover macro.

Bues · 11/18/08, 5:39 PM

Originally Posted by Feist-Mok

Drop Imp. S'n'D, 2 points in CQC, and 1 of your assasination points for 5 points in Relentless Strikes.

Pick up 5 points in Improved Poisons. Quick Reovery, Vigor, and Ruthlessness, and Master Poisoner are good spots to jack points from.

Turn the Tables is better than Master Poisoner, unless you don't run with a Paladin of just about any spec - pick one of the two, don't go partial on either.

The rotation is basically as you described, except rupturing when the option is there in between envenoms.

How is this build? No vigor though. 51/13/7

So when I have to refresh SnD, if rupture isn't up, that is when I use it? Otherwise if its up envenom?

Echophantom · 11/18/08, 5:43 PM

Originally Posted by Bues

How is this build? EDIT: Took a build from someone else, but just noticed that they don't have vigor. 51/13/7

So when I have to refresh SnD, if rupture isn't up, that is when I use it? Otherwise if its up envenom?

No. You rupture when SnD doesn't need to be refreshed, but you're still at 5 combo points. More efficient use of the energy than Envenoming again.

EDIT: For the talent spec, I believe Precision gives you better damage than Imp SnD, since your durations should always be the full 21s.