I was using 3/4/5 SnD/Rupture/Evisc. I keep track of my energy and Cp's to skip the Evisc to keep SnD or Rupture up.

Thanks for the comments on blue gems and OH chant. The gemming is an old habit I am trying to break.

Hello All
Im with EJ as a reader some time but I decided to sign up beacuse I simply doesnt understand lots of numbers You put here in EJ . Im trying to catch up with all things here but still need some time. I got a 80 lev rogue with pretty nice gear but i still got that feeling that i can burn more dps from it.

I got full 5 piece T7.25 gear( havent done maly25 or Obsi with drakes to get gloves, legs or chest ) with Calamity Grasp and Webbed Death.

The World of Warcraft Armory

Im using 7-51-13 build with typical cycle 5ss-5snd-5ss-5r-then Evi if some time left on snd.
Im using DP on MH and WP on off.

and my dps is rather poor when i compare it with other clases. Its generally about 3 k dps on bosses and 3,7 k dps overally on raid because FOK on trash.

I still think I got potential to do a lot more bigger dps .
I ll be thankfull for any advices about build, cycle , stats or gems ?
Can u give me some thoughs, ideas where to look for improvement ?

you can easily do better for both weapon enchants. Mongoose is pretty cheap, and is almost as good as Berserking.

Well, of course I have to clip SND to refresh it, but I understand that you are asking about if I clip too much. I don't think so, but then again I have a problem, so maybe there is something to it. I will pay extra attention to pooling energy during the next raid.

But I am still curious about the general principle: if you have 5cp and suddenly realize there is not enough time left on SND to do full 5r/5v cycle, do you think it is better to do 5r/3v/5r or to skip 1 Rupture and do 5v/5r? I am pretty sure this situations happen even with perfect cycles, for example if you happen to kick and refresh HfB at the same time.

I am using "v" for Eviscerate here, hopefully that is not too irritating? I just wanted to distinguish from Envenom to avoid confusion between IIV and standard Mutilate build, though I see that actually happened.

Well you should be doing alot more than that just assuming you are with the right raid and have the correct buffs. Buffs are very critical to our DPS. Not having a simple buff can severely impact your DPS. Being knew i suggest you check out the pocket guide and also if you have excel check out the roguecraft spreadsheet as it's basically the first thing anybody new to the forums should do. Alot of static information can be found on the first pages if you don't have the time to read everything. The spreadsheet alone makes you a better player so do whatever you can to get it and play around with it.

To repeat what a previous poster said, do not wait for 5 combo points for your finishers. The whole principle of mutilate is 4+, since even at 4 you waste a CP (two if it crits) by mutilating, as well as the energy cost associated with that. Mutilate is there for you to build CPs for your finishers. By doing a 4+ finisher, you're increasing the ratio of finishers to combo moves.

I'm having some problems with my combat rotation. I've been muti until this point but I got cg last night and, as I'm the only rogue, respecced to give savage combat. The spreadsheet said 3s/5r/4e is best for me but I find I'm losing rupture and/or snd. Im
specced the usual 15/51/7 with 4pc set and I'm expertise capped. I'm thinking I should drop
evis glyph for snd, good move?

I wanted to add a P.S. to my above post, but the edit function from my phone is terrible. To elaborate on my question about energy pooling, I don't refresh SnD unless there are less than 8 seconds remaining on it, and I never clip Rupture. Also, I don't get many chances to just balls-to-the-wall DPS due to my raid utility, so there are few fights that give me an accurate reading of my single target DPS. Which target dummy is best for simulating attacking a raid boss while fully raid buffed?

None of them. I tend as combat to not refresh SnD unless there is <3s left on it, and pooling energy gives you a smaller time needed to build back to 5cps for the next finisher. So say your finishers usually take ~11s to build 5cps, with 80 energy pooled it may only take ~7-8s, making your rupture downtime smaller or converting that final eviscerate froma 4cp into a 5cp.

hi, I would like to check how mult rogue dps in OS + 3D.. currently my guild are running OS + 3D and my dps are always lower than expected. I put 2 antiseptic poison on my 2 webbed death to help to dengrage the element. I got to like dps the drake as much as possible, deengrage the elements, move away from fissure/firewall. It is like so many things to do and yet i see some 3D WWS on those rogues, and they are still able to achieve 3k dps.

Would like to ask the experience rogues in here for opinion xD

Get an offset of daggers with anaesthetic poison to swap in for FOK
Move the minimum safe amount to avoid flame wall/void zone. This includes dipping into the lava.
Stack haste buffs with blust on tenebron.

Keeping adds under control is much more important than dps after shadron is down.

I disagree. First, stacking AR together with BF & Heroism is a guaranty to cap your energy. Second, with Vanish, Overkill, Coldblood and Murder you probably out dps everyone in that 6 seconds of FoK spaming.

Is it true that focused attacks can proc from both mainhand component and offhand component of mutilate, thus giving up to 4 energy when both MH and OH crit? Thanks.

Yes, however, FA will not proc off of FoK "offhand" crit attacks.

There are no 4cp finishers in IIV rotation, because this build does not include Ruthlesness. It's either 3 or 5cp.

AR + BF + Heroism isn't anywhere near guaranteed to cap your energy. In the best case, you use say 4 SS and a Finisher every 5 seconds. Assuming the finisher is free, you are looking at spending 30.4 Energy every second. With AR running you are gaining back 25 Energy per second. With a 1.4 Speed offhand, sped up by BF, SnD, and Heroism, you will be attacking at 0.641 Speed, or 1.56 Attacks per second. That means you will get 0.312 Combat Potency Procs every second, for an average of 4.68 Energy. Rounding up to 5, that means that we are spending 30.4 Energy per second and gaining back 30 Energy per second, so it's not going to cap you unless you get really lucky (unlucky?) on CP procs.

Edit: At Wytryszek, what happens if you do a finisher (0 CPs) then do a regular non-crit mutilate (2 CPs), then another regular non-crit mutilate (4 CPs)?

Yes, though it might be noted that a typical raid-buffed rogue has a per-weapon Mutilate crit rate over 65%, thus SF procs 90% of the time on a Mutilate. Hence, the odds of winding up at 4 CP after two is in the neighborhood of 1%. That is, it happens, but it's so rare it's generally not worth discussing in terms of cycles. But yes, in that situation you'd do a 4 point finisher. I usually refer to the nonruthlessness cycle as using "2 Mut" finishers to avoid this confusion.

The only important AoE moment is after Tenebrons death with a couple of welps accompany the elementals. After these are down, at least in my raid, I every once a while pull out 2 FoKs and get back to my target, which is also a dragonkin. We also never used anesthetic poison, because hunters are just the better choice, if needed at all.

Unless you get a dodged/parried SS. Your hypothetical average CP proc is way more spikey in practice. There's also no benefit in popping AR together with haste effects. So why risk capping?

I had a question about FOK spam, specifically when you're 51/13/7 Mutilate.

My rotation is always keep three stacks of HfB up, and auto attack a target, while FOK'ing 2 other mobs (for a minimum of three mobs).

Does anyone else do anything else? Like keep SnD up while auto-attacking a target? I don't because it takes away from our allready limited energy, and the costly FOK ability.

so when my 2 daggers applied anaestheic posion, i can use FOK to denrage the elements, don't have to melee attack them?
can u provide me with the swap weapon macro, after FOK, it will swap back to 2 WD to dps the drake. tried to find the macro using goggle but no luck.

thanks

The easiest way I've found to use weapon swapping for FoK on enraged adds is to download a mod like wardrobe. This will allow you to define sets of gear, one with your normal raid setup and then another with the daggers that have Anesthetic poison on it. You can and should bind these item swaps to keys nearby each other, just one thing to note is that swapping will cost you a global cooldown and reset your swing timer.

I don't have a macro but you can use mods such as outfitter and itemrack for the same result.