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Old 03/13/09, 7:51 PM   #2101
ShadowEric
Piston Honda
 
Human Rogue
 
Terenas
A good rule of thumb is to Envenom as late as possible. That is, before your energy caps out. And that's assuming SnD isn't about to drop. Refreshing HfB at that point isn't a bad idea either if it's getting low and everything else is fine.

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Old 03/13/09, 8:01 PM   #2102
Shazzrah
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Rogue
 
Eldre'Thalas
Originally Posted by ShadowEric View Post
A good rule of thumb is to Envenom as late as possible. That is, before your energy caps out. And that's assuming SnD isn't about to drop. Refreshing HfB at that point isn't a bad idea either if it's getting low and everything else is fine.
Oh ok I will work on doing that. Thanks for the advice!

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Old 03/13/09, 8:30 PM   #2103
chalon
Founder of the Chalonverse
 
Chalon
Night Elf Rogue
 
No WoW Account
If you do an Envenom, you proc Ruthlessness, and your Mutilate crits, you're at 4 CP. If your Rupture timer is fine, then you should wait until your Envenom buff fades, and then Envenom again. As a side effect of that your DP will have stacked a little more, but primarily you should make sure your Envenom buffs don't overlap.

EDIT:

Originally Posted by ShadowEric View Post
A good rule of thumb is to Envenom as late as possible. That is, before your energy caps out. And that's assuming SnD isn't about to drop. Refreshing HfB at that point isn't a bad idea either if it's getting low and everything else is fine.
I dunno, I'd sort of disagree with this. Once your Envenom buff has faded, you'll already be at an Energy level such that you'll fit one Mutilate in prior to the Envenom buff fading again. I don't really see an advantage of pooling further beyond that point -- you're pointlessly increasing your cycle duration.

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Old 03/13/09, 8:43 PM   #2104
ithorien
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Rogue
 
Shattered Hand
Hello!

First off, I apologize if my question has already been answered. I swear I looked through most threads, but since it's Friday, I'm a bit spaced out.

I am currently a Combat spec, 15/51/5 with 5/5 CQC, wielding a CG in MH (Berserking), and Omen of Ruin in OH (Mongoose).

Just a few days ago, Hailstorm dropped for me. I plugged it into spreadsheet, dropping Endurance and Improved Sprint for Sword Spec 4/5. I also changed enchant on OH for Berserking.

The spreadsheet states my DPS will in fact increase, and I trust the spreadsheet. I wanted to know if anyone in a similar scenario has noticed changes, and might have something constructive to add before I splurge on Berserking for OH.

Thank you in advance

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Old 03/13/09, 9:02 PM   #2105
chalon
Founder of the Chalonverse
 
Chalon
Night Elf Rogue
 
No WoW Account
In 3.09, yes, it will be an increase. However, in 3.1 it won't be viable to get dual weapon specs due to the LR change, so that may affect your decision.

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Old 03/13/09, 9:08 PM   #2106
ithorien
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Rogue
 
Shattered Hand
Originally Posted by chalon View Post
In 3.09, yes, it will be an increase. However, in 3.1 it won't be viable to get dual weapon specs due to the LR change, so that may affect your decision.
Well, I would expect Hailstorm to stay up there for OH swords until replaced by something much better. I can always go back to Omen if WD doesn't drop before 3.1 or something better in Ulduar. Thanks for you input, much appreciated.

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Old 03/14/09, 12:59 AM   #2107
grifter27
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Rogue
 
Scarlet Crusade
...

Last edited by grifter27 : 03/16/09 at 9:25 PM.

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Old 03/14/09, 4:46 AM   #2108
Hildegard
Tinker
 
Hildegard's Avatar
 
Gnome Rogue
 
Forscherliga (EU)
* Instant Poison: Redesigned to have its chance to be applied based on the speed of the weapon (frequency-based).
* Wound Poison: Redesigned to have its chance to be applied based on the speed of the weapon (frequency-based).
I am not sure, that I understand the wording correctly. Does frenquency-based mean that poisons are no longer PPM-based and now again favor faster weapons over slower ones ?

Hildegard Sprigglespruxx - Wissenschaftlerin am Institut für Pfuschkunde

http://forscherliga.wikia.com/wiki/Hildegard
Hildes PVP Blog - Vom Stümper zum Gladiator

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Old 03/14/09, 5:08 AM   #2109
saedo
King Hippo
 
Night Elf Rogue
 
Gorgonnash
Originally Posted by Hildegard View Post
I am not sure, that I understand the wording correctly. Does frenquency-based mean that poisons are no longer PPM-based and now again favor faster weapons over slower ones ?
No, that is their wording for what PPM is.

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Old 03/14/09, 6:19 AM   #2110
dabadguy
Glass Joe
 
Gnome Rogue
 
Destromath
@Grifter.

#1 Go download a spreadsheet.
#2 Plug in your current gear, with the 4 piece bouns.
#3 Note the expected DPS.
#4 Plug in gear with all 3 pieces switched.
#5 Compare DPS to DPS seen in #3. Use whichever is higher.
#6 Use the above 5 troubleshooting steps to help answer any other questions you have about gear.

EDIT:
@Ithorien

You're comparing two gear changes and only asking about one. If you want to know whether Berserking is worth it on the OH, plug your gear into the spreadsheet and just see how much of an increase/loss it would be. Then decide whether the increase in DPS is worth the gold that you would have to spend.

The more interesting question is the one about dual weapon specs. Right now Combat has 4 "fillers" in the middle of its tree that do not directly add DPS. With the change to LR, you're going to only have 1 point that is not going to be in a "taken" talent. I just don't think that 1 point in Sword Spec is going to justify the DPS loss from not getting +5% crit to your OH. Either way, I would want to play around with the specs before going to make any decision.

Last edited by dabadguy : 03/14/09 at 6:29 AM.

Rogue HAT spec:

Now, imagine the wall is my Eviscerate button.

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Old 03/14/09, 12:43 PM   #2111
Mavanas
Great Tiger
 
Night Elf Rogue
 
Lightning's Blade
Does offhand portion of mutilate damage suffer the 50% offhand penalty. Wowwiki suggests that it does not. Can anyone confirm that offhand penalty still applies to offhand mutilate damage?

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Old 03/14/09, 1:03 PM   #2112
saedo
King Hippo
 
Night Elf Rogue
 
Gorgonnash
Originally Posted by Mavanas View Post
Does offhand portion of mutilate damage suffer the 50% offhand penalty. Wowwiki suggests that it does not. Can anyone confirm that offhand penalty still applies to offhand mutilate damage?
It does.

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Old 03/14/09, 2:34 PM   #2113
Danzir
Banned
 
Dwarf Rogue
 
Aggramar
I have a question:

I've been macro'ing in Sinister Revenge's (2x) for FoK trash pulls, and I always thought this was a better way as I remember reading some numbers here that suggested Sinister Revenges were the best weapons for Fok spamming.

I also have at my disposal, Webbed Death and Calamitys Grasp.

Would Calamity's Grasp + Sinister Revenge give me more damage than my current FoK weapons - dual Sinister Revenges?

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Old 03/14/09, 3:07 PM   #2114
songster
Chief Passenger
 
Gnome Rogue
 
Earthen Ring (EU)
Originally Posted by Danzir View Post
I have a question:

I've been macro'ing in Sinister Revenge's (2x) for FoK trash pulls, and I always thought this was a better way as I remember reading some numbers here that suggested Sinister Revenges were the best weapons for Fok spamming.

I also have at my disposal, Webbed Death and Calamitys Grasp.

Would Calamity's Grasp + Sinister Revenge give me more damage than my current FoK weapons - dual Sinister Revenges?
Currently, no. SR is functionally a 2.7 speed weapon for the purposes of FoK: a 1.8 speed weapon with the 1.5x dagger multiplier. Thus, given that it is the same ilvl, it will hit harder than CG, which is a 2.6 speed weapon. Thus, dual SR is currently the optimal choice for FoK.

After the patch, the PPM changes to poisons mean that poisons will proc more frequently from CG. This means that dual CG will be the optimal choice for FoK.

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Old 03/14/09, 3:55 PM   #2115
saedo
King Hippo
 
Night Elf Rogue
 
Gorgonnash
Originally Posted by songster View Post
After the patch, the PPM changes to poisons mean that poisons will proc more frequently from CG. This means that dual CG will be the optimal choice for FoK.
Except CG is MH only. So probably SR still. Or maybe Angry Dread for the OH?

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Old 03/14/09, 7:50 PM   #2116
Len
Von Kaiser
 
Len's Avatar
 
Undead Rogue
 
Vek'nilash (EU)
Originally Posted by saedo View Post
Except CG is MH only. So probably SR still. Or maybe Angry Dread for the OH?
Silent Crusader, Pride, Angry Dread, and any one-hand Deadly weapons are better choices than SR. At the moment slow OH fist probably the best, as most builds take fist/dagger weaponspec with current itemization. Luckily, you can get one for the cheap cheap price of 50 emblems of heroism from Dalaran vendor.

Edit: After 3.1 patch, of course. Now OH SR is as good as OH CG would be.

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Old 03/14/09, 8:23 PM   #2117
Arnan
Glass Joe
 
Arnan's Avatar
 
Human Rogue
 
Earthen Ring (EU)
I know how hunters with their pets are excellent groupmembers for a HaT rogue, but how does warlocks and Unholy Deathknights compare to this with regards to their pets? I seem to remember Ghouls having relatively few abilities, but an imp would be chain casting firebolt, would that make a warlock a good group mate?

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Old 03/14/09, 10:53 PM   #2118
PSGarak
Bald Bull
 
PSGarak's Avatar
 
Undead Warlock
 
Hyjal
Warlocks don't have much way to boost their pet's crit rate. At best, they inherit 30% of the master's through a demonology talent. Hunters can get much higher crit and a much higher attack rate. Note that imps' firebolt is not the spammity spam it used to be. Fully talenting drops it from 2.5 to 2, not from 2 to 1 like it used to. Felguards have a similar attack speed, with infrequent cleaves. It's still an extra group member generating crits, but it's no hunter pet by a far margin.


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Old 03/15/09, 11:04 AM   #2119
Kugle
Glass Joe
 
Undead Mage
 
Jaedenar (EU)
Is it possible to make a Macro, that uses envenom if you have 4/5 deadly poisons up and eviscerate if less than 4 deadly poisons is up?

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Old 03/15/09, 11:08 AM   #2120
Eredia
Glass Joe
 
Gnome Rogue
 
Stormscale (EU)
Originally Posted by Kugle View Post
Is it possible to make a Macro, that uses envenom if you have 4/5 deadly poisons up and eviscerate if less than 4 deadly poisons is up?
No it's not, Blizzard removed the possibility to make "smart macros" like that in the 2.0 patch that came out right before TBC. Basically because the player should make decisions themselves, and not fall back on a bot/macro.

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Old 03/15/09, 11:42 AM   #2121
Kugle
Glass Joe
 
Undead Mage
 
Jaedenar (EU)
Originally Posted by Eredia View Post
No it's not, Blizzard removed the possibility to make "smart macros" like that in the 2.0 patch that came out right before TBC. Basically because the player should make decisions themselves, and not fall back on a bot/macro.
Aha didnt know

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Old 03/15/09, 12:57 PM   #2122
trrdr
Von Kaiser
 
Orc Hunter
 
Kargath (EU)
If you want just one button for Eviscerate / Envenom you could make a macro like this:

/cast [mod:nomod] Eviscerate; [mod:alt] Envenom

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Old 03/15/09, 1:32 PM   #2123
Kugle
Glass Joe
 
Undead Mage
 
Jaedenar (EU)
Originally Posted by trrdr View Post
If you want just one button for Eviscerate / Envenom you could make a macro like this:

/cast [mod:nomod] Eviscerate; [mod:alt] Envenom
okay so normal 1 = eviscerate and alt +1 = envenom ?

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Old 03/15/09, 4:29 PM   #2124
draelic
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Rogue
 
Malygos
Been scrolling through lots of pages of HaT and my eyes are blurry now. Anyone state the ideal glyphs to go with for HaT (besides evicerate as that is obvious)

*edit* also assume SnD is the 2nd major

Last edited by draelic : 03/15/09 at 5:00 PM.

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Old 03/16/09, 5:03 AM   #2125
Exodist
Banned
 
Night Elf Rogue
 
Thrall
I just unshelfed my rogue this week to get her ready for the next patch wich I hope will have my rogue out performing my DK. But regardless I am having a small issue on rotations to get my DPS up on my rogue.

Should I be going: Mute 3CP, SnD, Mut 4/5CP, Rupture, Mut 4/5CP, Env, Mut 4/5CP, Env, (repeat to Rupt)?
I am glyped for SnD but having a hard time getting Env off after a Rup cycle without SnD just dropping.
I am using the recomened Mutilate spec, but should I move 1 or 2 Talent Point over to Imp SnD or keep the 3 in CQC?

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