I did Ony 10 man, and 10man TOC and observed a shadowbolt fire and yet no debuff go up and max hp did not change either, so I just assumed they fixed it all. That was on Saturday.

I can confirm the debuff still functioned as described above on both Koralon and Emalon in 10man VoA as of today (tuesday oct 06 4:00 Central time), I can post a couple screenshots in a moment, once I locate where they were saved to.
Mav, is it possible that you were swapping weapons and not waiting long enough for the initial "cooldown"/lockout to expire? Although if that was the case I wouldn't expect the visual to happen either, if you have your combat logs you might check if the shadowbolt was actually doing any damage.

I would assume it's obvious but in case anyone is curious, the effect will proc from FoK.

EDIT:
The effect and damage bolt proced tonight on all 4 mobs in the heroic Northrend Beasts encounter and the debuff and health reduction did not appear on any of them.
I would then hazard a guess it was fixed on a per boss basis, and some were missed.

"lowering all stats by 130 for 30 sec."

I guess that is not only stamina, but also agility, strength, intellect and spirit. If those stats scale in the same weird way as stamina does, what would be the effect of a boss having lower stats ?

A boss with less agility will dodge less. That can cause an increase in melee raid dps.
A boss with less strength will have his melee dps lowered. Tanks will have better survivability. Healers will need to heal less.

If there are bosses, or other mobs in raids, who are still vulnerable to the debuf, there might be more reason to keep using a Ripper during the full duration of those fights.

just wanna share my tests about gutgore ripper.
i used the dagger in toc 25 beasts hardmode and was never able to see the debuff on bosses,however the damage of the bolt was registered by recount on all beasts several times but no debuff at all.
while, on anub'arak 10 hard same thing happened (no curse on anub, only bolt damage) BUT adds (borrowers) had the debuff. raid date was Oct 5th 2009.
i think it got hotfixed bot not on all bosses, may be bosses of 3.2.2 only ?
would be very handy if someone can confirm a list of bosses where debuff proc is guaranteed.

That is assuming that boss actually has agility and by lowering that it lowers the chance for them to dodge. Is there any proof of this being the case as of now?

Closest you can get to testing that is by attacking the heroic dummy for a long time with Gutgore and then doing a test to compare your chance to be dodged. Given the uptime of the curse, it would take a very long time on the dummy to show that. That's assuming that heroic dummy has same conversion of agility into dodge as bosses, even if such conversion exists.

In the absence of Updated COmbat sheets, i've been blowing lots of cash at target dummies recently.

From teh tests, and backed up by damage done in Ulduar25 last night, it seems the threshold where you can break Tier8 4pc for random bits of i245 gear, then reSpec/reGlyph/reRotate is a lot lower than i though, if you are packing either Mojlnir or Grim toll. The i245 Bloodfang Hood and Triumph Gloves are enough for me to swap up. The Runestone really is that good.

With 322 passive ArPen i was able to go from 3500 to 3750 dps on a dummy without using any specials, over a 10 minute test period, and push out some pretty brutal (for me) numbers during the raid. Interestingly, to me at least, the 15/51/5 build destroys 18/51/2 in this environment. the latter was netting around 3200 dps. With both builds, 5s/5e seemed the way to go.

I'm guessing Fights with Very-short burst phases will favour even better, such as Faction Champs, Twins, Yogg, Razorscale.

You realize that without using any specials, and in particular finishers, 18/51/2 is a strictly better spec than 15/51/5 as long as you put some poisons on your weapons. The latter spec gains advantage from relentless strikes which triggers only when you use finishers.

Besides, raid buffs enhance the dps of the two specs slightly differently, for instance curse of elements or equivalents add 13% to poison damage, which favors 18/51/2 more. On the other hand, 15/51/5 enjoys more energy income and therefore has more damage that comes from sinister strikes and eviscerates, so any buffs that favor these abilities and not poisons, such as for instance sunders and faerie fire, will favor 15/51/5 more than 18/51/2. All in all, results froma dummy test can easily be reversed in a raid situation.

Finally, as far as I know both Aldriana's combat spreadsheet and my simsheet are fully updated for 3.2.2. So perhaps you can make better use of one of them instead of blowing cash on target dummies.

If your target (or your target dummy) doesn't have the bleed debuff (mangle/trauma), as few as 2 pieces of new gear can be sufficient to prompt a switchover to an evis-only combat cycle. Of course, if your raid has it but your target dummy doesn't, the target dummy testing is going to be way, way off.

Hi guys. I have a question about weapons.
Are the toc 10 HM Weapons better than the 2200 rating weapons from arena?
The Spreadsheet says the Hardmode Weapons are better.
But the HM Weapons have 196DPS and the 2200 216dps. I dont understand that^^..

Most likely the stats on the weapons because of the Resilience budget.

If anyone is interested in Mutilate BiS excluding T9.258 (heroic) because of accessibility, this is what i came up with thanks to Adriana'S spreadsheet. I made these setups mostly to decide on the slots head/shoulder/chest/gloves/legs, to figure out when to break 4 T8 and to see how bad T9 really is. To avoid Alliance/Horde naming issues i will name items by item level/drop location.

All setups have:
Neck: Heroic 25
Cloak: Heroic 10 Tribute Chest or Heroic 25 Beats (25 Heroic Tributechest is best but hard to get)
Trinkets: Normal 25 & Heroic 25 from Valkyrs
Rings: Normal 25 & Heroic 25 from Faction Champions
Belt: Heroic 25 from Valkyrs
Boots: Heroic 25 from Faction Champions
Weapons: 2x Heroic 25 Daggers
Ranged: Heroic 10 Gun from Valkyrs (25 Heroic Tribute Chest one is better but hard to get)

Even if you use worse items in 1-2 of these slots it will most likely not affect what is best for the other 5 slots. This is the ranking i got as a result:

1. 25 Heroic Beast Legs + 25 Heroic Jaraxxus Chest + 10 Heroic FC Gloves + 2 T9 : 9086 DPS
2. 25 Heroic Beasts Legs + 4 T9 : 8979 DPS
3. 25 Heroic Beasts Legs + 4 T8 : 8931 DPS
4. Bloodfang Hood + 4 T8 : 8887 DPS
5. 25 Normal Beasts Legs + 4 T9 : 8860 DPS
6. 5 T9 : 8846 DPS
7. 25 Normal Beasts Legs + 4 T8 : 8812 DPS

All setups use Rupture Cycle as the spreadsheet won't let me select anything else on OSX. The best T9.245 setup beats the best T8.226 setup by an amazing 68 DPS (0.76%).

/edit
added another gear setup

I got 9204 dps in a config using 258 chest from jaraxxus and 245 gloves from heroic champs10.

Being stuck with the rupture cycle is going to seriously skew your BIS results. Also, that spreadsheet doesn't account for weapon swapping.

Rogue DPS Simulation Spreadsheet

This post pretty much takes care of BiS. Swap out 258 for 245 and it's pretty achievable for everyone.

With weapon swapping, the BiS list for mutilate and combat can be found here. I am sure though that if you wanted to limit yourself to 245ilvl only, the list would change, since some heroic 10man loot is better than regular 25 man alternatives, for instance boots and offhand dagger.

I toyed around a bit with the same basic idea a while back -- thorim hard in particular seemed like a place where, by the time you get to the real fight, the trinkets are very likely already out of sync. (Of course fights with downtime like mimiron or beasts go the other way and tend to bring them back into sync). Interesting to do it manually though, I hadn't thought of that. I edited Aldriana's spreadsheet a bit to try and figure out how good the trinkets would be if they never overlapped at all. With my gear at the time, the answer was that DMC and GT came out to be more or less a wash, though that was sufficiently long ago that I was nowhere near the softcap, so it's plausible that GT would be significantly stronger now.

If you want to play with it directly, it looks like the relevant lines in beta 4 are 97 and 848 -- you just want to set them to 0 in every column. With my current gear (mix of 232 and 245 and an evis cycle) it looks like, if they really never overlapped at all, GT would be about 50 AP stronger than DMC. Of course, the "never overlap" assumption is too strong, and the sheet doesn't account for the minor synergy of MR/DMC being up together, so that's likely to be an overestimate. Still, given that DMC is worth 390, that's a decent chunk.

When choosing trinkets in the simsheet, there is an option to desync a trinket. If double proc of trinkets can push you over the cap, it is usually beneficial to desync the weaker trinket. For instance if you use MR and GT, desync GT and you will see a sizable effect on your dps compared to the case of no desyncing. Same with gemming agility for mutilate and then using death's verdict both normal and heroic versions, which can push you over the crit cap - desync the normal version if both procs push you over the cap. An indicator in the top left corner of the Gear page will tell you if you reach the soft crit cap when all trinkets proc.

Desyncing in the simsheet, equips the trinket 22 seconds before the start of the combat, so it cannot proc in the first 23 seconds (for a trinket with 45 second internal cooldown) of the fight.

I obviously outed myself as rarely using the simsheet. Found the option, worked out to a 0.45% gain in dps in my gear. That's little enough variance for my taste to just stick with MR and DMC:G and take the increased defensive stats from the agilitiy proc on top.

To model this in 1.3 beta 4, open up the calcs sheet and zero out row 846. This will force the uptime periods of GT and MR to be disjoint.

How exactly do you force them to desync? Just wait for one to proc and then stop attacking for a bit? Or do you mean wait and equip it just before you start combat?

The theory is that you reequip one of them 20 seconds before the fight starts, such that the first goes off 5 seconds into the fight as usual, the second comes off cooldown and procs 25 seconds in, and so forth - if timed properly, they will never proc together except on the very longest fights... of if there are interruptions that allow them to resync.