koaschten

Yeah exactly that. Can be easily watched with an addon that tracks ICD after a proc, like Procodile on curse. It won't show the triggered ICD on equipping the item though.

 

Ends

Thought this macro I was using might be useful

/equipslot 13 Grim Toll
/script Stopwatch_Play()
/stopwatch 30
/in 35 /sw
/equipslot 13 Darkmoon Card: Greatness

On first use it will equip GT in the first trinket slot and start a stopwatch display with a 30 second countdown it will undo the stopwatch display after 35 seconds. A second click will re-equip DMC:G.

 

orderofmaken

Hi, just wanted some advice on some gear from TOC. Been running my rawr on trying to find which is a better item but getting some wierd results. Currently running ruptureless combat with soft cap arm pen and trinket. Out of these three chests which is more better between 25 heroic jaraxus chest, twins 10 heroic and knightbane crafted. My rawr is saying Knightbane is better out of the three for some reason, and placing the jaraxus chest below it.

Also getting a strange result on my ranged weapon, currently using [Baelgun's Heavy Crossbow] but says that Crimson star is BIS, dunno if its because my expertise is below 26, even though its not really that important for combat.

Also, If anyone has any BIS links for combat ruptureless cycle gear from TOC would be appreciated.

 

Naeramarth

Please don't use Rawr for Rogues. There is a reason that it states the Rogue module is still under development. There are high-quality spreadsheets and simulators available here for both Combat and Mutilate. Use those instead.

 

Tinwhisker

Actually, it would be better to go to the RAWR.Rogue developer with your concerns and talk about any differences you see with RAWR and the other accepted models. This would help RAWRs development for the rogue class.

You're a lot of DPS, you know that? You wanna' earn 14 achievement points the hard way?

 

Bayushi-ko

As stated in this thread on the RAWR discussion forums, there IS no current rogue developer. If someone knowledgeable here wanted to fill said role, I'm sure there are many RAWR users that would be very very happy...

 

ivanbss

Hi,

Im made some spreadsheet simulations today with my gear, and im very suprised with the results. Im curently using (51/18/2), and still got good amout of ArP (around 450, Mjolnir and 2T9 bonus set).

#1 Eviscerate Only + weapon Swap ----> 7715 DPS (Evis Glyph)
#2 Envenom Only + weapon Swap ----> 8601 DPS (Tricks Glyph)
#3 Envenom + Rupture +Weapon Swap ---> 8481 DPS (Rupture Glyph)
#4 Evisc + Rupture + Weapon Swap ----> 7829 DPS (Evisc Glyph)

So, isn´t Envenom a magical damage ? (not influenced by ArP) i was expecting #1 and #4 to be a little higher.

 

tenaki

It is because that Envenom ignores all armor that it is doing more damage than an evis that is only ignoring some armor.
From what I understand, 450 ArPen isn't *that* high (just past the soft cap) and still no where close to the point where you'd be using a rupture-less, evis cycle.
The other thing, is that most 51/x/x specs are talented for increased envenom damage. When you were testing the evis vs envenoms, did you change the talent distribution to imp evis instead? That might make the gap a bit narrower. I doubt the use of evis in an assassination cycle will ever pull past the use of envenom though. (Might be wrong here.)

edit: This will teach me to open my mouth before I speak: Combat (3.2) and Mutilate (3.1) Spreadsheets
So my last sentence seems to be wrong entirely.

 

ivanbss

I´ve changed all spec and glyphs to try thoose simulations. If Evisc is designed to be mitigated by armor, at some point (maybe only on soft cap), if you keep stacking ArP it should do more damage than Envenom, right ?

I will keep running some simulations, to check how much ArP you need for Evisc>Envenon, and if BiS(ArP) gear with Evisc is better than BiS Gear with envenom.

 

azreal4066

It seems to have been overlooked just about everywhere and unless I'm seeing things I seem to have stumbled upon a simple item that, so far, I have not seen any comments on in these forums about it.
[Iron Boot Flask]. This little guy has a brutal cooldown of one hour, but it lasts for 10 min as long as you don't mount up in the middle or die. Which rounds out to a little less than 17% uptime, however much of it you can utilize.

The reason I mention it is because it has a chance on hit to do nature damage 100-150 and I believe it can crit. The actual effect is called Electric Discharge. I've noticed that Recount does not pick it up, however SWStats does. SWStats calls it Shocking Discharge if I remember correctly. Although the damage is somewhat negligible, when you are trying to eek out every .01% more DPS anywhere you can get it, this is a small opportunity to almost set it and forget it.

I first noticed it back when I was raiding Naxx, we were on farm at this point, so for some fun I blew all my cooldowns on the first pull in the spiderwing, Glyphed FoK with an Adrenaline Rush while chain pulling, I took a gander at my damage meter and that Electric Discharge was accounting for 2.6% of my damage. Ever since then I bring it always and use it whenever I can. Besides, it's kind of fun running around as an iron dwarf; I think there is also an achievement oriented with it too.

Now I have not done any testing on this in several months and there were rumors that it was being changed in 3.0.8. It may do nothing at all anymore and I'm not very good at theorycraft testing. Maybe this could be some food for thought for someone.

 

Furtim

Was pretty sure I had never seen a proc when playing around with it, but just to make sure I just did full 10 minute test on a target dummy and did not see a single proc from it.

 

Vardisk

It's not a proc, you'll just randomly zap hostile targets within range. Won't go off on a training dummy as they are neutral, not hostile.

Had a hilarious occurrence a few months ago when someone with a Boot Flask on zapped General Vezax while we were still prepping for the pull and almost caused a wipe.

 

azreal4066

After fooling around with the flask, you are absolutely right Vardisk. You don't even have to be in combat for it to proc. It seems to be completely random. It does very little damage though Recount does pick it up I've found. It is called Electric Discharge. It's almost exactly like [Stormchops]. It seems to shine in tightly packed AoE groups and even then the damage really is trivial. It's more of a "why not?" type of cooldown item. It can get you into trouble if you're not careful, but so can stealth, tricks of the trade, Fan of Knives, etc. I think it might count only for funness points when raiding.

 

YzeroXY

There is a new list up at MMOC with items which can be bought for Emblems of Frost. This trinket seems pretty good, especially for rogue who's weapon swapping.
Herkuml War Token - Items - Sigrie

 

• Feist-Mok

Eh, it has the same failings that [Fury of the Five Flights]did back when it was being compared against the [Mirror of Truth] - namely, that while it's great for Patchwerks, anytime that you have to move and will lose the stack, the value diminishes significantly, especially if using a throw or meleeing a critter or something to maintain the stack burns the ICD of your second trinket when it isn't useful.

Napkin math values it at somewhere in the 550-650 EP range, depending on your weighting for haste. The lower bound of that is about on par with the normal (245) [Death's Verdict]. Far from bad, but not great considering the downsides of it.

 

Hassam

Whilst the above is very true where concerning a search for some kind of overall BIS trinket I'd like to submit that further discussion as to the merits of the aforementioned trinket's viability on patchwerk-like fights might actually be merited in the event that there is a similar encounter in Icecrown that might call for such an assumption of static positioning to be true. This might be best left until some later time though (e.g when the stats for dropped gear are available as well).

 

Callidus

MMO Champion listed Needle-Encrusted Scorpion as one of the drops from the heroic version of the new 5 man. If the stats and proc are correct, I'm going to assume by its item level and the fact that it procs significantly less armor penetration than either [Mjolnir Runestone] or [Grim Toll] over the same duration that the internal cooldown must be lower than 45 seconds, correct?

 

greenjello

That was my first impression, yet I can't recall very many trinkets (none particularly in WotLK) with shorter than a 45 second cooldown.

 

• Feist-Mok

A more likely explanation is that the trinket has a standard 45-50 second ICD, but is either

1) Bugged and underbudget - expect either the passive stats or proc to increase

or

2) Properly itemized, but trinket ilvl's mean jack shit.

 

Rahdik

Black Bruise kind of scares me.

EDIT: I realize that wasn't very productive, lol.

Either I'm severely underestimating 9% shadow damage or this weapon is lack-luster.

 

Naganuina

It is unproductive to speculate on it's quality with no hard data on the proc rate.

 

Rambaral

It's more of Blizzard's way of leveling the playing field for rogues needing an arp trinket for soft cap gemming.

 

• Aldriana

It depends a lot on proc rate and implementation. If it applies to all direct physical attacks made (i.e. it affects Sinister Strike and Eviscerate and not just autoattacks), and if like Necrosis it's applied to your post-armor physical damage and doesn't benefit from any shadow damage boosting abilities, its uptime would need to be near 100% to be competitive. However, if any of those assumptions don't hold, it will be either better or worse. So, yeah, if it works in the obvious way - 45 second ICD and applies like Necrosis - it's going to suck. A lot. Like, worse than Mirror. But depending on the proc rate and other details, it could also theoretically be quite good. As to which it is... we'll just have to wait till someone gets one, do some testing, and see where it ends up.

Edit: Oops. I was thinking it was a trinket, which it's, of course, not. As a weapon proc, it's actually likely to be decent. It's likely to be at least vaguely competative with conventional weapons of similar ilvl, as opposed to the Ony weapons which are a tier behind.

 

Tholofonos

MMO-Champion has available the stats for rogue t10 in its ilvl251 and 264 incarnations, complete with set bonuses.

 

Hassam

Those are some very interesting setbonuses. It's pretty clear that Blizzard wants rogues to setup their TOTT rotations and get cracking, and the 4-piece bonus combined with Arpen itemization is a clear indicator that they want to see our rotation start off as ruptureless Eviscerate with TOTT and maybe evolve into a TOTT -> SnD -> Evis -> Rupture prioritization.