Pocket Guide to WOTLK (Updated for 3.3) - Page 5

Kumar · 11/27/08, 12:25 AM

Edited.

Wrong thread.

Azsh · 11/27/08, 1:10 AM

Just curious on the mechanics of poisons.

I assume the way things work is that you if you manage to land a hit, you get a chance to proc poison. If it procs, you then get a chance to hit/miss/dodge/parry etc with the poison. If it hits, you get a chance for it to be resisted?

Anyone able to confirm this or show me how it actually works?

Arindelest · 11/27/08, 1:28 AM

Originally Posted by Vulajin

The current update on that is that the sheet is not doing anything screwing with ArP, neither ArP on gear nor procs/trinkets. I thoroughly checked the entire ArP model and everything is in order.

I have not recently checked whether it indicates 15/51/5 or 7/51/13 as being superior.

7/51/13 appears to still be the superior spec, at least with my current setup (mix of Sunwell and Naxx-25 gear).

Edit: To Azsh: The first part of your statement is definitely correct; only attacks that land have a chance to proc poisons. Once the poison procs I would assume it follows the generic spell mechanics (whether this is a one-roll or a two-roll system I do not know). However, the possible results for a spell are a miss (works the same way as physical attacks, can be mitigated by hit rating), a resist (literally getting resisted by your target's resistances, can be mitigated by spell penetration) and a partial resist (which I do not believe can be mitigated).

Leto · 11/27/08, 1:35 AM

Originally Posted by Azsh

Just curious on the mechanics of poisons.

I assume the way things work is that you if you manage to land a hit, you get a chance to proc poison. If it procs, you then get a chance to hit/miss/dodge/parry etc with the poison. If it hits, you get a chance for it to be resisted?

Anyone able to confirm this or show me how it actually works?

Poison procs work exactly like spells. They cannot be dodged/parried/blocked/glanced, and they are not mitigated by armor.

The poison has a chance to hit or miss, and it also has a chance to be partially resisted (25%/50%/75% dmg). The chance for resistance is affected by mob resist (which can be overcome with spell penetration), and an unavoidable resist level based on how much higher level the mob is. Poison procs against a boss have a 6% chance to be partially resisted, which averages out to about a 3.2% loss of dmg.

• Vulajin · 11/27/08, 1:48 AM

Originally Posted by Leto

The poison has a chance to hit or miss, and it also has a chance to be partially resisted (25%/50%/75% dmg). The chance for resistance is affected by mob resist (which can be overcome with spell penetration), and an unavoidable resist level based on how much higher level the mob is. Poison procs against a boss have a 6% chance to be partially resisted, which averages out to about a 3.2% loss of dmg.

Partial resists occur in 10% increments since patch 3.0. Also, from checking out some WWS parses, I've been finding that partial resists occur at something like a 40% rate, reducing your overall damage by roughly 4%.

madman · 11/27/08, 4:49 AM

moved.

Nerevarine · 11/27/08, 5:29 AM

Originally Posted by Ratoon

Untill the mats for berserking become more common mongoose is still decent.

Also Berserking is something a bit two-edged, think about a double procc in a fight you get some physical dmg leaving you with -50% Armor.

Deadaim · 11/27/08, 7:46 AM

I wanted a small detail about the glyph of rupture. Does anyone know if it does the same amount of damage over more time (therefore more ticks with less damage) or does it do more ticks of the same amount of damage?

Aigriculteur · 11/27/08, 8:05 AM

It's easy :

(Base 1500 AP)
Without Glyph: 1906 over 16 seconds (182 + 0.0375 * 1500) * 8 = 1906
With Glyph: 2382.5 over 20 seconds (182 + 0.0375 * 1500) * 10 = 2382.5
Either way you are getting about 119.125 DPS from it.

Romerz · 11/27/08, 8:33 AM

Originally Posted by Bues

What is everyone's opinions on 15/51/5 and 7/51/13 (either combat swords or combat sword/fists)? A few people have told me that 7/51/13 does more damage than 15/51/5 but does the armor pen and increased rupture damage and ignore armor outweigh ruthlessness and lethality?

7/51/13 for me in my current set of T6 and a few 80 bits is at least noticeably higher than 15/51/5. Perhaps it is due to my current lack of crit, but the increased rupture damage is noticable.

Penumbruis · 11/27/08, 9:46 AM

In words, what is deemed to be the best rotation strategy in terms of DPS for Combat Swords?

dotOrion · 11/27/08, 12:18 PM

Originally Posted by Cally

PvE Combat, fast and flawed advice
(....)

Rotation:
* Start up Slice and Dice however you please, really.
1. Sinister Strike to 5 Combo Points.
2. Slice and Dice.
3. Sinister Strike to 5 Combo Points.
4. Rupture.
5. Sinister Strike to 5 Combo Points.
6. Does Slice and Dice have >12 seconds left? If yes, Envenom. If no, Go to Step 2.
7. Go to Step 1.

Seriously, it's right there in the first post.

Anyway, great initiative Cally. Was a very helpful quick reference.

Penumbruis · 11/27/08, 12:51 PM

Apologies, I should have been clearer. I don't believe the strategy in the original post is optimal, does anybody else have a different strategy which they use?

Echophantom · 11/27/08, 2:30 PM

Originally Posted by Penumbruis

Apologies, I should have been clearer. I don't believe the strategy in the original post is optimal, does anybody else have a different strategy which they use?

Just because you don't believe it's optimal doesn't mean it isn't. The thing is, DPS comes down to a numbers game in the end, which is why spreadsheets and models are so useful for us. If the numbers say you are wrong, the end result is that you are wrong, not the other way around.

TheNull · 11/27/08, 2:45 PM

Originally Posted by Penumbruis

Apologies, I should have been clearer. I don't believe the strategy in the original post is optimal, does anybody else have a different strategy which they use?

I'm pretty sure that's as close to a "rotation" that you will get.

Unlike vanilla WoW where you had static energy generation which permitted a set rotation, there are now factors which affect the rotation, such as energy-generating talents and combo-point generating glyphs. Therefore your goal is to prioritize maximum uptime of slice and dice and rupture with the highest combo point finisher possible, while using the highest combo point eviscerate/envenom possible when your combo points/energy/remaining-time on s&d/rupture permit.

It may seem like an obvious answer, but it really is what it is. =)