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05/19/10, 12:25 PM
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#576
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Glass Joe
Night Elf Rogue
Jubei'Thos
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05/19/10, 5:50 PM
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#577
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Glass Joe
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Originally Posted by Nitekoala
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I've tried using Killing Spree a few times after being dropped to no avail. After watching this video, I decided that I was either using KS too early (I used it immediately after the valk dropped me), or there are very situational specifics that must be in play for it to work. The problem with using it immediately after you're dropped is that the valks appear to take a second or two before they start flying back up towards the center of the platform. Perhaps waiting a bit would allow for the delay, as it appears in the video that he had fallen a decent amount before he was popped back up. Alternatively, it could be that the valks just have to be in the right place at the right time, i.e. it works if you're the last person to be picked up of the three valks because you can KS and hit the first one as it's flying back to the center. Either way, it's more of a last resort as opposed to a hunter's disengage or warlock's demonic circle, which is a reliable way to just bypass valk damage all together.
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05/21/10, 11:22 AM
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#578
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Glass Joe
Blood Elf Rogue
Dragonmaw
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Originally Posted by Nik
It was found out by our combat rogue a while ago, that upon doing killing spree after the first tail swipe every ground phase and staying on the spot where the killing spree ends it would greatly increase the chances of the whole raid not being "pulled in" to melee range by her.
This obviously still requires the rogue attempting to do this to pay attention to the fact that if his raid gets "pulled in" still he will have to move out with the rest of the raid or vanish. This allowed us to give our healers those few extra seconds to top up the raid.
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Just wanted to add one more confirmation to this. I did this multiple times Wednesday night in my 25 man raid. Sometimes it prevented the whole raid from being pulled in, sometimes only myself. I believe the one of our raiders ran fraps and has the video, i will double check and if he does, i'll have him put it up and make sure post the link here.
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05/21/10, 2:38 PM
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#579
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Von Kaiser
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I found last night that it is possible to vanish-immune the harvest soul on LK 25m hardmode, but it is not a good idea to do so.
You will not get pulled in to frostmourne, so you wont need heals, but you will be stunned in air outside. The real problem is that this stun is PERMANENT! You will stay in air, stunned, for the rest of the fight.
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05/22/10, 10:39 PM
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#580
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Von Kaiser
Night Elf Rogue
Stormrage
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Originally Posted by Nitekoala
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During ametuer testing (dropping off my drake from 10 yds in the air) it looked like it would take about 1.1 seconds to fall 10 yards and therefore be out of KS range of drakes. While it isn't really practical to count out exactly 1 second after being dropped, the rogue in the video drops a FoK just after being dropped to trigger the 1 second GCD, then spams KS and is therefore able to fall without worry of being out of range. While this still isn't something rogues should count on, it is a lot less of the shot in the dark that many people thought it was without this information.
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05/23/10, 12:40 AM
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#581
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Von Kaiser
Blood Elf Rogue
Jubei'Thos
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Has anyone tried using the Engineering parachute to buy some more time for a killing spree > valk save? If this helps it's the 500th reason to have eng on this fight.
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05/23/10, 1:08 AM
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#582
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Von Kaiser
Night Elf Rogue
Stormrage
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I have used the parachute cloak during wipes where everybody jumps off; it works. I haven't tried it for the valks, but honestly I would see the FoK GCD being a better determination of the perfect time to KS. Unless, of course, your valk is the first or second to pick somebody up, in which case the parachute would help give you as long as possible to try to avoid the RNG of jumping around between 2 other valks that may not have even started yet.
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05/23/10, 2:36 AM
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#583
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Von Kaiser
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Just to clarify whats happening in that video of the rogue KSing the Valk. He's not walking back and gaining distance and making it back, he's just KSing a Valk that is flying back over the ledge which is what brings him back.
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05/23/10, 12:46 PM
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#584
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Von Kaiser
Night Elf Rogue
Stormrage
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Yes, that's why it's worth noting the method of time management he's using for a very specific KS; if he just popped it as soon as he was dropped, he'd end up performing a 2.5s KS before the Siphon Soul cast even starts, and fall right back down 5 yards off the platform. Waiting for them to begin their cast (and get through a certain % of it) helps ensure that he'll do the last hit of his KS when they are already flying back up, very likely already being back above the platform. The one second that is represented by the GCD is his timer to ensure he doesn't fall out of KS range: 10 yards.
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05/24/10, 5:05 AM
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#585
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Banned
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That 1 gcd trick might work in 10 mans where lag is non issue, but in 25 using a steady 30ms cable connection I regularly get random delays between each KS strike sometimes increasing the total Killing Spree length 2 seconds longer than usual.
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05/24/10, 10:19 PM
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#586
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Don Flamenco
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You have 4.5 second killing sprees? That sounds...rather dramatic. Graphical lag from being in a larger raid shouldn't have any bearing on something as hardcoded as killing spree timing, any more than it would cause your dots to do less dps because they were 'lagging.'
In any case killing spree's positioning you should be unrelated to client-side lag. If it did have any effect, it would be beneficial; 2 additional seconds would guarantee you landing on the platform.
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05/25/10, 3:09 AM
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#587
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Glass Joe
Night Elf Rogue
Crushridge
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Originally Posted by Sarvius
You have 4.5 second killing sprees? That sounds...rather dramatic. Graphical lag from being in a larger raid shouldn't have any bearing on something as hardcoded as killing spree timing, any more than it would cause your dots to do less dps because they were 'lagging.'
In any case killing spree's positioning you should be unrelated to client-side lag. If it did have any effect, it would be beneficial; 2 additional seconds would guarantee you landing on the platform.
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With lag it's possible, I've had a killing spree last over 10 seconds on the dreaded tuesdays...
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05/25/10, 3:38 AM
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#588
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Glass Joe
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On our Sunday run, I had attempted turning on my parachute and rockets boots when being dropped off by the Val'kyr.
For the most part this did nothing, however there was one attempt where just as the valk dropped me and I activated rocket boots watching them launch me up in the air letting my parachute get me back on the platform.
This was most likely luck as I wasn't able to replicate this in any other attempt, but the fact still remains that there is the small chance for this can happen and that this can be used to save you.
Definitely wouldn't rely on it though.
- Also I didn't have KS, as I'm a Mutilate rogue
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05/25/10, 8:08 AM
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#589
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Glass Joe
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Yesterday I tried to get back on the platform by using killing spree on the Val'kyr. I made sure to wait at least one second by using fan of knives before using killing spree. However, my Val'kyr was nowhere near done with the life siphon cast when I started the killing spree. It looked to me as if the remainder of the flying time is way too random to incorporate this into your strategy.
Also, my killing spree hits procced blade twisting. Even if I had started later, a 50% slowed Val'kyr takes quite a bit longer to fly back over the platform, so I probably had no chance of survival at all.
Edit: This was on 10-man. I'm not sure if the single Val'kyr behaves differently than the ones on 25.
Last edited by Taffer : 05/25/10 at 10:27 AM.
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05/25/10, 2:45 PM
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#590
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Piston Honda
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They don't behave any differently in 10 vs 25, its just that in 25m, you have many more valks to work with, increasing your chances of targeting a valk that is already over the platform.
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05/25/10, 6:42 PM
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#591
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Glass Joe
Night Elf Rogue
Laughing Skull
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Originally Posted by Jandras
For the most part this did nothing, however there was one attempt where just as the valk dropped me and I activated rocket boots watching them launch me up in the air letting my parachute get me back on the platform.
This was most likely luck as I wasn't able to replicate this in any other attempt, but the fact still remains that there is the small chance for this can happen and that this can be used to save you.
Definitely wouldn't rely on it though.
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That's the rocket boots malfunctioning. It's a low chance to happen, but it's good to know that you can do that.
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05/25/10, 8:46 PM
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#592
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Still alive
Human Rogue
Cenarion Circle
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Originally Posted by thottstation
All this time, I've been using DISMANTLE on Saurfang just before he casts Mark of the Fallen. I was under the impression that it somehow reduced the Mark damage.
Have I been wrong this whole time? I could've sworn I heard it somewhere...
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Saurfang is immune to disarm effects in both normal and heroic versions. I have Deadened set up to to announce certain ability misses, and have seen "Missed Dismantle on Saurfang! (IMMUNE)" more than once. 
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Need a Mumble server? I run MMO-Mumble for all your voice chat needs. | My rogue planning tool: Shadowcraft
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05/25/10, 9:29 PM
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#593
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Still alive
Human Rogue
Cenarion Circle
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Tricks - Not really ICC-specific, but very useful in DPS races. If you have good affliction locks or marks hunters, coordinate with them to give them your first Tricks. They can use it to roll Corruption/Serpent Sting with the 15% bonus for the whole fight. Doesn't apply to heavy target switches or fights where you have to stop casting regularly (Dreamwalker, Sindragosa).
Deathwhisper
* In heroic, burn KSpree and Blade Flurry immediately on every cooldown, assuming there are not mind controlled people in range. She is exceptionally fond of using them in concert if she MCs you, and it is very easy to gib a couple of people, especially since you are immune to most CC during the KSpree.
* Feint reduces damage from ghost explosions. When in doubt, feint.
* On heroic, save CoS for the eventuality that she gets a frostbolt volley off right before ghosts spawn on the melee. You'll need to cloak the snare to get clear quickly enough, likely.
* Cultists can be dismantled, which is a lifesaver if you have a slow tank.
Putricide
* Assuming hardmode positioning (Putricide on the green side of the room all the time), save Blade Flurry for when the green ooze pops. You'll be able to get at least half of the duration with Flurry reflecting onto Putricide if your tank is moving him right.
* Expose Armor the oozes. Even a 1-pointer can produce an appreciable damage increase on them.
Blood Council
* Killing Spree doesn't count as movement for the purposes of Shadow Prison. You can use it as a gap closer on a prince if necessary.
* If you're going to eat an empowered shock vortex anyway, try to position yourself to get launched back onto your target.
* Non-empowered shock vortexes can be used as movement boosters, particularly on a target switch from one side of the room to the other.
* Blade Flurry and KSpree don't hit shadow orbs. When you're on the shadow Prince, feel free to use them. Given how he likes to stand and then run around, KSpree can be wonderful for maintaining contact time.
Blood Queen
* If a melee was bad and dropped a fire right behind BQL, feint just before you KSpree. You'll end up in the shadowfire, but it won't hurt too badly, and will let you move out safely.
* Feint will let you survive one tick of her enraged AOE pulse, which can buy you a few ten thousand extra damage done and might be enough to put her over the edge if it's a close fight.
Dreamwalker
* Combat can run Mind-Numbing+Crippling for this fight. Mind Numbing on Liches buys you a ton of margin on the frostbolt casts, ensuring that your portal healers never lose their stack due to a frostbolt snare. Crippling lets you shiv zombies as they shamble past, making your kiters' job trivial. You can FoK crippling onto Suppressors as they spawn, giving you a ludicrous amount of time to DPS them down. Your DPS isn't really critically important here anyhow, so improving control is a good thing here.
Sindragosa
* Saving AR + BF for tombs in 25-man lets you put out an obscene amount of damage on them. Very useful if your tomb DPS is generally slow, or if you just want to pad the meters. Be careful to not pop a tomb early, but if you use Blade Flurry as often as possible, you should get full duration out of it for each tomb phase. Assuming your raid is dropping tombs properly you should be able to reach at least 4 with FoK.
* Expose Armor on the Ice Tombs in P3 can be tremendously useful.
Lich King
* In phase 1, with Blade Flurry up, stand right on top of LK and target a ghoul. Spamming FoK will mirror all of the BF damage onto LK, which can give you a truly impressive damage spike and put a dent in the phase time.
* On ledge transitions, Expose Armor the Spirits if they aren't being tanked by a warrior.
* If you have spirits up coming out of the transition, Feint when the tank starts moving them. You can eat their cone nuke and survive easily if the tank gets them pointed the wrong way on the move in.
* In phase 3, you can soak Vile Spirits with Feint. Don't pick up more than 3 at a time, and be ready to hit a healthstone if you do hit 3-4, but you can trivialize them if you're smart.
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Need a Mumble server? I run MMO-Mumble for all your voice chat needs. | My rogue planning tool: Shadowcraft
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05/26/10, 10:01 AM
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#594
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Piston Honda
Gnome Rogue
Darksorrow (EU)
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This might be a stupid question, but does Expose Armor affect Deathwhisper's mana shield?
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05/26/10, 12:34 PM
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#595
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Piston Honda
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As a secondary effect, yes. Mana depleted is a direct correlation to damage taken. So the more damage you deal to DW, the more mane that gets taken away from the shield. Adding Expose (or sunder) will increase the damage she takes.
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05/26/10, 3:21 PM
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#596
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Glass Joe
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Originally Posted by Tumblebeer
I found last night that it is possible to vanish-immune the harvest soul on LK 25m hardmode, but it is not a good idea to do so.
You will not get pulled in to frostmourne, so you wont need heals, but you will be stunned in air outside. The real problem is that this stun is PERMANENT! You will stay in air, stunned, for the rest of the fight.
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Partially correct: You're just stunned up to the next harvest soul.
On the next one you get drained inside again and you're into the fight again.
Just tried it
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05/27/10, 11:23 AM
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#597
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Glass Joe
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In the event you do eat a Malleable Goo in the heroic festergut encounter, would cloaking out of it also get rid of your innoculate stacks?
Thank you in advance.
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05/27/10, 12:07 PM
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#598
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The Titleless
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Edit: inaccurate, deleted.
Last edited by Andeh : 05/27/10 at 2:00 PM.
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05/27/10, 1:33 PM
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#599
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Von Kaiser
Flergh
Orc Rogue
No WoW Account (EU)
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Originally Posted by Andeh
It does. If you manage to do this by accident, hopefully you haven't used Vanish yet, and can just Vanish-immune the third big AOE.
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He does 1 AOE. Pungent Blight after he's inhaled 3 times. When he inhales it does not deal AOE damage. Cloaking the malleable goo does not remove innoculate stacks but if you have Blighted Spores debuff that will be removed which means you won't get the innoculated stack from that particular spore. Feint works just fine to lower the damage of Pungent Blight by the way!
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05/27/10, 2:00 PM
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#600
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The Titleless
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Originally Posted by flergh
He does 1 AOE. Pungent Blight after he's inhaled 3 times. When he inhales it does not deal AOE damage. Cloaking the malleable goo does not remove innoculate stacks but if you have Blighted Spores debuff that will be removed which means you won't get the innoculated stack from that particular spore. Feint works just fine to lower the damage of Pungent Blight by the way!
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Ah, ok. I haven't actually tried Cloaking it, I was just going off what a guildmate said after he got himself killed by Cloaking. However, it should be noted that Cloaking off the Spores by accident along with Goo would be even worse than Cloaking off Innoculated, since you can prevent those around you from getting another stack of Innoculated (and they may not have DR cooldowns like Feint).
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