The updated PTR 4.0.6 changes mention that Elemental Overload procs of LB and CL will now be able to proc Rolling Thunder. I know it had been almost entirely confirmed in here that it wasn't working that way before, but this is a Blizzard confirmation of the fact I suppose. This should improve how well our damage scales with Mastery, though I'm not sure if SimC modeled Overload LB/CL as having the chance to proc Rolling Thunder already, or if it was modeling them as NOT proccing.

Despite being unable to cast FS after LvB and still get the 100% crit chance, I've noticed that you can in fact cast UE right after LvB and have it gain the 30% extra damage. I only tried it at max range so I'm not certain how close you can get before it stops working. I'm fairly certain that it is because the 30% extra damage comes in the form of a buff on yourself.

(edit) Yeah it was 4am that was just poor testing on my part, the buff was consumed so I assumed it got the benefit. I only tested it with a single LvB and had trinkets on so one may have proc'd off the FS. Upon further examination this morning it's just a waste. (Though I'm not sure if it wouldn't be anyways, because it uses a GCD either way you use it)

When you do UE you get a buff that gets used up when you do a fire attack. So if you cast LvB at max range and UE right after and get the buff before LvB hits but the buff doesn't get used up...I don't think you got the benefit from the 30% damage buff on that LvB.

SimCraft was modeling it not proccing off RT (because we conclusively proved that it didn't before Cata launched.) SimC has already been updated for it proccing off it on the PTR setting though so you can get a good comparison running the EvilTwin setting on it.

One caution however, it looks like they implemented the Lava Burst increase in 4.0.6 incorrectly, it is upping the average damage by much more than the expected value. I can't find the mistake in the code yet to flag them to fix it, but I'm looking.

Correct, you do not gain the increased damage. Just like LVB is not guaranteed to crit if FS is cast after(but hits before) LVB.
It has to be active for the affect to take effect before you cast your LVB in both cases. On the flip side, if you cast an LVB when FS dot runs off it will crit so long as your cast finishes before the dot runs out.

The calculations for your spells are not done when they hit, but when you cast them.

All the changes to Lava Burst in SimC are from the DBC files we get from the game itself.

To compare live versus PTR values:

	Live	PTR
Coeff	.571	.628
Min	1267	1394
Max	1616	1778

Which is a 10% increase in the damage range and the coefficient, which agrees perfectly with the blizzard quote:

I have some concerns about how SimCraft is handling the elemental rotation priorities, but until I can sit down to look at it I'd be dubious about making any changes to rotations based on it.

That said, with my own spreadsheet & T11 2pc UE shows as a 122 dps increase assuming you only use it before FS

If it is that small of a gain with that narrow of criteria, we'd probably be wise not to use it other than when moving, as we'd be trading a slight increase in stationary damage to lose one of our tools while moving, and likely have a net loss in "real fights."

That question has already been answered here and the answer is haste. The 4 piece bonus is irrelevant unless your haste is so high that you risk GCD capping on LB under heroism and EM, and even then, unless you're at risk of GCD capping without those buffs haste is probably still the better choice. It's worth remembering that your other stats scale with haste in a synergistic fashion. More haste means more casts per time period, which means more chances for your mastery or crit to be effective. There may be a point where stacking pure haste would lead to mastery overtaking it in value, but I suspect that you will naturally pick up enough mastery that this will not be an issue, and it is certainly not the case in this content tier.

Even though CL does not have travel time, there is still a small delay between when the damage component hits and the generation of the rolling thunder proc, so this can be used to avoid losing the extra lightning shield stacks on both CL and LB. You basically fire it like a shatter combo, hitting ES immediately before your CL or LB cast finishes.

That said, this is of very minor usefulness, since you should typically be unloading your lightning shield charges at 7+ stacks. The only times I've found this helpful are when I screwed up the rotation, or when using CL/LB spam on multiple adds (Magmaw worms); occasionally you can go from 6 stacks to 9 stacks from a CL cast and already be in the process of casting your next LB when your shield hits 9 stacks (due to the aforementioned delay between the hit and the RT proc, as well as the spell queuing mechanic).

On the topic of that spell queuing mechanic ... With wind shear's already short cooldown being reduced even further by reverberation, I find myself being the designated interrupter on several fights. In the past, I used a /stopcasting macro to make sure my interrupt fired immediately and not at the end of whatever I was casting at the time. I found that this failed several times on a Halfus attempt, unless I double-tapped my interrupt macro. I suspect that this was because there was already something in the spell queue when the /stopcasting macro took effect and that that queued spell prevented the wind shear from firing. Has anyone else seen anything similar?

If you are finding this happening, lower your spell queue latency time. The default time is 400ms which is far greater than should be necessary on a typical connection. The purpose of the queue system is to make it so you can get a spell going earlier, if it is interfering with your reaction times, it isn't serving its purpose.

With regards to the Halfus interrupting, being an elemental shaman on Halfus (and just about every other interrupt fight) is a chore, but also a blessing. One would think that losing 1 GCD per 6 seconds would destroy your dps, however, having been stuck on that job myself recently, I noticed that Halfus will usually cast his ability ~1 second after the cooldown for wind shear finished (so about 6 seconds after being interrupted).

Not to drag this comment into a discussion on Halfus, I too noticed that when I tried to cast WS with /stopcasting attached, I'd have to doubletap it, sometimes even resulting in a failed interrupt.

To fix that, I try to time downtime to coincide with the moment of interrupt. Given values of spell haste, a six second window generally allowed for ~4 spells.

If changing the latency on your spell queue doesn't fix the problem to your satisfaction, you can try to just time your spell casts to finish casting a spell right before or right after the start of his aoe, which lets you cast wind shear in rotation. The only time that this didn't work for me was when Halfus stunned himself or when he stunned the raid with Furious Roar, both times, I just had to adjust the spell rotation to let me use wind shear at the end, since he always cast nova right after.

I noticed that sometimes when I see Lava Surge proc and I switch from spamming LB to LvB it still start casting LB yet I am pretty sure I hit LvB before that, would setting this Custom Lag Tolerance to 0ms help this ow would it most likely lower my DPS?
I know it may not have to do with shamans but I haven't seen it mentioned before by someone so guess I give it a try.

Updated for 4.0.6 and included the full, updated in-depth guide in the third post. Feedback is welcome, although there are likely a few things I missed during the update process that will be fixed over the next few days. Math & Mechanics section coming soon.

A very simple test on a dummy confirms that Elemental Overload procs do not generate Rolling Thunder charges.

Was this test performed after the patch today? From the notes:

Yes. Not more than 15min before I posted.

Edit: Please discount previous information. It is actually procing. Apparently it simply did not like my previous volleys of Lightning Bolts. Most unlucky man on the face of the earth?

In my opinion classifying the Stone Claw totem glyph solely as a pvp glyph is very short sighted. If effectively gives you your only time and mana efficient way of mitigating incoming damage. It effectively buys you 2 global cool downs every time you need to help keep yourself alive.
There are plenty of applications for this glyph in the current encounters; Nefarians Crackles, Chimaerons Enrage Phase, Searing Flames on Atramedes, the focus fire or AOE From Magmatron, the stream of raid damage at Halfus and gravity crushes on the Twilight Ascendant Council on healers.
In all these situations you know exactly when the damage is incoming or when heals will be delayed, this glyph provides you with your only efficient way of helping to keep yourself alive if needed. Having this option is a bigger benefit than the other options we have as major glyphs.

Hi.

with the 4.0.6 patch live i have a problem i cant figure out by myself.

I crafted [Vibrant Alchemist Stone] . I have 2 other good trinkets :[Figurine - Jeweled Serpent] and [Theralion's Mirror]

Figurine + Elemental Mastery in macro is good combination (figurine has a bit longer CD in fight , cca 20sec)
on the other hand
you can turn on Elemental Mastery when Th.Mirror procs.
(Before this patch i used Figurine+El.Mastery right after Th.Mirror proced)

Vindication!

Nefarian: Elemental Mastery/Healing Stream Totem
Chimaeron: Healing Stream Totem (rest are trash.) (any spare healing should be spent on the tank, not on yourself) (also, phase two damage prevention against the mocking shadow spell. 2k dps - resistances means, if the fight is done properly, you should survive the entire phase unless you are targeted. if you do find yourself targeted, nothing is going to save you.)
Atramedes: Searing Flames should be moot.
Omnomnomitron: Elemental Mastery/Healing Stream Totem
Halfus: Elemental Mastery/Chain Lightning/Thunder
Ascendant Council: Can you drop Stoneclaw while in the bubble? Never the less, still Elemental Mastery/Healing Stream Totem

Elemental Mastery should nearly always be used. Period. Passive damage mitigation, and mitigates a substantial amount.

Healing Stream in any fight that you have nature damage or have no one else with the buff. In Nefarian's case, you are all on separate pillars and are unable to receive short range buffs.

That aside, the problem with Stoneclaw is that you are a DPS. Not a healer. Yes, 16k absorbs are pretty nice every once and a while, but when it all boils down, it's nothing more than a crappy heal. It's not a defensive cooldown, and will never save your life like something from God. Nefarian's Electrocute, if you're so inclined to help, is much better helped by a Healing Rain in place of that GCD. Against Magmatron it's the exact same thing as a Healing Surge, and to mitigate Halfus you'd just be better off going full heals.


p.s. Follow up to previous conversation: The /stopcast issue seems to have been resolved with the patch. H Halfus with zero double taps this evening.

I do think a 16k on demand absorb, not a heal, is lot nicer than you make it out to be. Raid buffed it's still nearly 13% of my hp , it is use-able while walking and it's available on demand contrary to elemental mastery.
I'm also not claiming it's an awesome "cool down" which will save your life time and time again, I do however think it's one of the better options you have available.

What is the difference between a heal and an absorb? Aside from a few very limited instances, not much. Stoneclaw Totem is a mana efficient 16k personal instant heal with a 20sec CD. And in a 10man environment, woe is the raid when you drop Stoneclaw Totem as 99.9% of the time it means the loss of Stoneskin Totem. Which, of course you can in turn redrop, but then there's two GCDs spent instead of the convenient one. You have one of the extraordinarily lucky raid comps of three paladins and two shamans. Congratulations.

In the previous post of mine, I presented a list of all the fights you suggested Stoneclaw for and glyphed them. For each encounter, can you list me why you would drop Stoneskin Totem instead of the listed glyph.

I have used stoneclaw for a while now and will continue to. Absorbs are different from heals because you can anticipate the damage and essentially give yourself an additional 16k hps. Further more you can drop this while moving and its instant. There have been many occasions where dropping it just before I was about to die has given the slack healers an extra 1/2 seconds to heal me.

I raid 25 man and we always have more than 3 paladins and 2 shamans, always. If for some reason we didn't I would reconsider my glyphs for sure. So I never need to drop a stoneskin totem or use healingstream glyph (Nefarian might be an exception). My general practise is to drop stoneclaw at the same time I refresh searing totem (its on the same GCD so why not?).

As for the EM glyph. I want to use EM in line with my trinkets procing for max dps, not when I'm taking damage. So more than likely it be used when I'm not taking damage, which makes it pointless. So I would probably disagree with you on all those fights you listed. Some examples from the fights you listed for stoneclaw use:

Chimaeron - stoneclaw - drop it as your running in for healing part.
Atramedes - Actually use ghostwolf glyph. Gonging/kiting
Halfus - Stoneclaw - you can drop it right before the stun starts.
Council - Stoneclaw - you can't use it in the bubble, but you can use it as your dropping to mitigate the falling damage. Also if you miss the the correct buff in phase 2 for whatever reason, dropping it before the AE means I don't die.

In conclusion. its not awesome but if your in 25man and don't need the other glyphs / stoneskin there's no reason not to use it. There are few / if any times when EM would be better (apart from pvp obviously)