Shaman: Simple Questions thread reboot -- new kinder gentler rule-7-free zone - Page 13

Myranne · 12/14/11, 9:55 PM

Currently EnhSim and Rawr are broken on trinkets, neither is able to run the procs properly for Vial of Shadows or Wrath of Unchanting.

ziff · 12/15/11, 5:24 PM

Originally Posted by Illu

I have a humble question regarding the Starcatcher Compass trinket that I picked up earlier to save from a shard, despite the haste proc. I have rather weak trinkets otherwise (DMC:H and Fluid Death) for this tier, as my shaman has a non-raiding alt history, and when simming this in EnhSim I got this to be about on par on DMC:H. It was confusing enough that I thought I'd seek input here, given the newness of the trinket.

My question is, does this sound accurate? I don't know how updated EnhSim is on this trinket (the icd seems to be different than in the notes for example) and would like to hear a quick opinion.

I know haste is a bit meh but it is a substantial value in this case. Any thoughts, given the trinkets I otherwise have access to?

On the whole, haste is a pretty horrible stat for us so it's not surprising it's valued as low as a nerfed 359 trinket. As to EnhSim, in 2.6.7 the [Starcatcher Compass] trinket is modelled with a 100 sec icd. I've seen reports of the icd of that trinket between 90 to 115 seconds, so I'm not sure how off that is really is. You mentioned some notes about the icd? What notes are you referring to?

Originally Posted by Myranne

Currently EnhSim and Rawr are broken on trinkets, neither is able to run the procs properly for Vial of Shadows or Wrath of Unchanting.

I'm not exactly sure what this you are referring to with EnhSim being broken with these two trinkets. I haven't seen any bug report on this. [Vial of Shadows] is modelled with a 15% chance to proc off of any melee damage with a 25 second icd. The proc is treated as a yellow attack and has the ability to miss, dodge, hit and crit, with it criting at a 200% bonus. Each tier of the trinket has a unique base damage and ap coefficient. For [Wrath of Unchaining], the trinket has a fairly easy model. All melee damage, except for Windfury, will proc a stack with each proc resetting the uptime of the buff to 10 seconds. Each proc will give 78/88/99 agility depending on the tier of the trinket. The proc can stack up to 10 times, after which each proc just resets the buff uptime to 10 seconds. Is there something else on these trinkets that is missing in the sim? These comments all refer to 2.6.7 of EnhSim, btw.

That I know of the only outstanding things with EnhSim for 4.3 is that it looks like [No'Kaled, the Elements of Death] might be able to proc from the Stormstrike debuff application. This doesn't make any sense from the way the way the proc's tooltip is written, but we've seen a triple proc from No'Kaled after a Stormstrike and the only thing that could be doing the third proc is the Stormstrike debuff.

Once again, if you run into any issues with EnhSim, please go over to the EnhSim codeplex site and enter in a ticket. That way I can fix these things quickly.

Illu · 12/15/11, 7:44 PM

Yep I tried with 2.6.7 for clarification

The notes I referred to was from a private forum with a rogue friend that seems to have determined the icd to 115 sec. I'm not sure if this is right or wrong and I'll do a test myself to make sure and edit in the result. However the reason I also put forth the question is that it feels like a haste proc like this would interact really well with the tier 13 2-set bonus which feels hard to model. I guess all there is to do is run dps meters in lfr since the trinket choice won't exactly matter there and check out the results overtime. Thanks for the reply anyway

As for the Stormstrike debuff and No'kaled, it would not be a far-fetched assumption since SS has a history of giving extra proc-chance in the past (as well as some DK debuffs until recently) so it's a definite possibility.

ziff · 12/15/11, 11:38 PM

Originally Posted by Illu

Yep I tried with 2.6.7 for clarification

The notes I referred to was from a private forum with a rogue friend that seems to have determined the icd to 115 sec. I'm not sure if this is right or wrong and I'll do a test myself to make sure and edit in the result. However the reason I also put forth the question is that it feels like a haste proc like this would interact really well with the tier 13 2-set bonus which feels hard to model. I guess all there is to do is run dps meters in lfr since the trinket choice won't exactly matter there and check out the results overtime. Thanks for the reply anyway

As for the Stormstrike debuff and No'kaled, it would not be a far-fetched assumption since SS has a history of giving extra proc-chance in the past (as well as some DK debuffs until recently) so it's a definite possibility.

I just took a scan over on the rogue forums at EJ, and they seem to view the ICD for this trinket as 115 seconds as well. I'll just go ahead and update the trinket ICD to that.

The T13-2P bonus is pretty easy to model honestly. All it does it bump up your LB and CL damage by 20% when there is any MW stacks up. I've modelled it multiplictively, although I haven't seen any true confirmation on that. EnhSim already models the dynamic generation of MW stacks pretty effectively, so this tier bonus fit in quite easily.

Once thing you might want to look into is the Maelstrom Weapon breakdown, specifically check out the effeciency percentage before and after with the trinket. It could be possible that you are wasting MW procs by not having MW5 high enough in the priority list.

Myranne · 12/16/11, 12:38 AM

Ok it could be just the version I have, but even time I try to sim using those two trinkets (Vial and Wrath) I get a Trinket # not found. Perhaps its just a bad version.

ziff · 12/16/11, 12:41 AM

Originally Posted by Myranne

Ok it could be just the version I have, but even time I try to sim using those two trinkets (Vial and Wrath) I get a Trinket # not found. Perhaps its just a bad version.

Check to make sure you are using 2.6.7, they should be in there. If you are still running into a problem, just PM me you config.txt file and I'll see what is going on.

Myranne · 12/16/11, 3:15 AM

Ah its all good now, the autodownload on the site you get sent to is still for 2.6.1 so thats why.

Draniia · 12/24/11, 12:38 AM

I'd like to know the answer to Ntrash's question as well, if you have two weapons of different iLevels which should you use in your MH? the stronger or weaker of the two?

aggixx · 12/24/11, 9:09 AM

Originally Posted by Draniia

I'd like to know the answer to Ntrash's question as well, if you have two weapons of different iLevels which should you use in your MH? the stronger or weaker of the two?

If both items have the same weapon speed, then the higher item level one should go in your Main Hand.

If they have both different item levels and weapon speeds then it's not as straight forward. However, with SP weapons being dead this shouldn't be much of a problem.

Hevnlydivine · 12/26/11, 4:36 AM

I've been discussing haste with elemental for quite some time now. In the ele section it says there are 0 haste breakpoints or target values we should be shooting for ever. But the graph shown in the haste section shows a steady increase in dps that scales with haste. My question is what is it that causes the dps increase? I'm guessing most of this is due to more ticks during flame shock. So I checked out the dot spreadsheet and was thinking maybe I should shoot for certain haste values depending on buffs in there? Any thoughts?

nilshaus · 12/26/11, 8:25 PM

Originally Posted by Hevnlydivine

I've been discussing haste with elemental for quite some time now. In the ele section it says there are 0 haste breakpoints or target values we should be shooting for ever. But the graph shown in the haste section shows a steady increase in dps that scales with haste. My question is what is it that causes the dps increase? I'm guessing most of this is due to more ticks during flame shock. So I checked out the dot spreadsheet and was thinking maybe I should shoot for certain haste values depending on buffs in there? Any thoughts?

You misunderstand the usage of 'breakpoint'. A breakpoint would be a point at which the value of the stat lowers considerably compared to before the haste point (for example, if you had a dot that ticked every 5 seconds, haste wouldn't have a very large effect until you got enough haste to get an additional tick).

This is not the case for elemental shamans. Since haste is one of the better secondaries you can stack it indiscriminately.

hexed · 12/27/11, 6:26 PM

Hi guys.

One question about Resto Shaman.

Better for 10man/25man heroic is going for haste 2005 (thats mean reforge mastery to haste) or just stay on 1000 haste, and rest of that reforge to mastery ? Im FFA healer.

Blayneburner · 01/08/12, 4:53 PM

Sorry if my question wasn't clear. At the time of posting I wasn't sure if the haste break point chart was applicable with 4.3. I didn't delve far enough past it with the earlier post. I am trying to find the best route for resto shams of either to go past hate breakpoints or cut it off at the nearest one and gear towards something else until i reach a next one. I gather from what I read that the haste soft cap is also 12.5 with the 4% buff and was wondering what impact this has on how much haste I should get. I hope this is clearer and any aid would be very welcome.

Hired2Kill · 01/11/12, 3:36 PM

Ok guys I'm pretty confused with the trinkets i should be using. Idk if I should use this setup or another one plz help.

SETUP 1: Matrix Restabilizer(ilvl 384) and Kyroptyric Sigil(ilvl 397 on use proc)

or

Setup 2: Ancient Petrified Seed(ilvl 387 on use proc) and Kyroptyric Sigil(^) two on use trinkets

Im having a hard time to figure out what would be better.

Perka · 01/13/12, 7:16 AM

Right... I guess this goes here.

Havnt played the game since before ICC and picked up playing a few weeks ago. Chose to play Enhancement Shammy this time, otherwise I have mainly used Warrior tank or ranged DPS. So I am a bit confused atm, hoping for you guys to help straighting that up a bit, some I found in other thread but still need some help. Now (after excusing me for being ignorant) questions...

Q1: Concerning wepons, thumb of rule: slow weapon > fast weapon?

Q2: What Totems? Searing Totem seems like a given and Windfury. I use Healing Totem to shut the piehole of your healer, but the earthtotem makes me realy ambivalent :P So, what are the 4 totems to use, generaly?

Edit: Btw Havnt maxed out yet, just about to ding 70.