Restoration WotLK Talents and Discussion - Page 21

Daidalos · 08/22/08, 5:39 PM

Originally Posted by lrdx

Anyone tested how does Earthliving Weapon scale with healing (spellpower)? Around what % does it get?

Yes I actually posted the coef for that in this thread.. why don't you use the search button and find it?

Originally Posted by Brio

Well, Skyhoof, what does level 70 haste amounts look like at level 80? That could be one deterrent in keeping Sunwell gear. With the way things are looking(changes in shaman healing), haste might not be that good through say Nax and Ulduar. In fact, it might hinder the shaman.

By level 80 the haste needed for the same effect almost doubles so I have been thinking of going with more int/mp5/crit but I haven't really had any hard choices yet..I may replace my sunwell offset and keep my boot belt bracers and chest but I'm not sure yet. I'm still hoping there will be some way to heal in a down rank like way.

lrdx · 08/22/08, 6:53 PM

Originally Posted by Daidalos

Yes I actually posted the coef for that in this thread.. why don't you use the search button and find it?

Did not think it is already known because your first post looks very well maintained and it did not list it, and the search function does not find "living weapon" (as you typed in that post) while searching for "Earthliving", the actual results are irrelevant. Sorry.

Anyway.

How viable is LHW? My >spreadsheet< (with assumptions what I read about Wrath) shows that it is only 5% weaker than Healing Wave in HPS. Considering both spells are the same mana / sec (15% base mana and 1.5 sec vs. 25% base mana and 2.5 sec), and there is a +20% heal for targets with Earth Shield glyph, and 3x Healing Way is hard to keep up without going OOM, not to mention of the smaller quantum of LHW (=less overhealing), is there any point in casting HWs?

Iod · 08/23/08, 12:10 PM

Originally Posted by Skyhoof

I took it to mean that on our healing spells, there would still be a 30% chance we could get pushback but it would be reduced to 0.350 seconds. Am I doing the math wrong? I saw 0.325 in a previous post.

Oops, sorry. Yeah, .35 seconds is 70% of .5... s'what I get for referencing stuff from the paladin forums. There's no chance to resist pushback- if you're hit you're guaranteed the pushback. The talents simply reduce the pushback amount, so if stuff is beating on you you're guaranteed 1 extra second of cast time (0.5s pushback per hit for two hits). The pushback mittigation talents simply reduce that 1 second of pushback (0.7s with Earthield only, down to zero with talents).

Right now the 70% talents have yet to be updated in the tooltip to reflect the new mechanics, but last I remember I was still pushback immune with earthshield on. Of course they might've not really changed it and I was just lucky, but the paladins are reporting that they've got uninterrupted heals going off with concentration aura running, so I'm assuming that mechanics-wise it's fixed, and just not being reported as such.

Skyhoof · 08/25/08, 11:33 AM

Can our beta testers attempt to answer a few questions about Earth Living Weapon? I'll update the first post with the results. Here's what we have posted so far in the thread:

* Earth Living weapon scales with spell power. Daidalos saw a 1.98 co-efficient with Purification talents when he healed himself. Is the co-efficient the same when healing others? Or is it like the current Earth Shield, where the purification talents only work when it's cast on yourself?

* Is there a cooldown? People have posted that there does not appear to be one or it is an extremely short cooldown.

* Can Earth Living Weapon proc on each jump of chain heal. Daidalos and others posted that it can definitely proc on any jump but can it proc on multiple jumps or is there a short cooldown that prevents this from happening?

* I believe someone posted that Earth Shield won't proc Earth Living Weapon. Is this true even when you cast an Earth Shield on yourself?

* Does Nature's Guardian proc Earth Living Weapon?

* For the enhancement shaman, what happens when you apply Earth Living Weapon to both weapons? Does it stack and how does this impact the HoT?

Daidalos · 08/25/08, 6:58 PM

Originally Posted by Skyhoof

Can our beta testers attempt to answer a few questions about Earth Living Weapon? I'll update the first post with the results. Here's what we have posted so far in the thread:

* Earth Living weapon scales with spell power. Daidalos saw a 1.98 co-efficient with Purification talents when he healed himself. Is the co-efficient the same when healing others? Or is it like the current Earth Shield, where the purification talents only work when it's cast on yourself?

* Is there a cooldown? People have posted that there does not appear to be one or it is an extremely short cooldown.

* Can Earth Living Weapon proc on each jump of chain heal. Daidalos and others posted that it can definitely proc on any jump but can it proc on multiple jumps or is there a short cooldown that prevents this from happening?

* I believe someone posted that Earth Shield won't proc Earth Living Weapon. Is this true even when you cast an Earth Shield on yourself?

* Does Nature's Guardian proc Earth Living Weapon?

* For the enhancement shaman, what happens when you apply Earth Living Weapon to both weapons? Does it stack and how does this impact the HoT?

I'll gather some more data.
Dual wielding does allow the extra healing to stack as well as increases the chance to proc.
After going though about 10 earth shields I got 0 procs so I think its safe to assume earth shield does not proc it.
I don't think nature's guardian does either after 20-30 NG procs 0 ELW procs

As for determining the cooldown if there is one its shorter than 2-3s and healing more often that than over an extended period isn't really an option. I think I've gotten it on back to back LHW but again it doesn't prove much.

The big question is about chain heal but for that I need other people to help me.

Sprout · 08/25/08, 11:23 PM

WoW Forums -> Content Patch Before Wrath of the Lich King

I would love to know how they plan to go live when neither SL nor AA work properly according to all posts I have seen. They have some serious resto fixes to put into place.

madrix · 08/26/08, 3:45 AM

Originally Posted by Sprout

WoW Forums -> Content Patch Before Wrath of the Lich King

I would love to know how they plan to go live when neither SL nor AA work properly according to all posts I have seen. They have some serious resto fixes to put into place.

There is still tons of bugs to work out for multiple classes. The majority of new talents don't work and a good number still are NYI. I would not expect this patch until a few weeks before the release, which is still going to be months away.

October to December, but when is the last time Blizzard released something on time?

Koe · 08/26/08, 12:27 PM

Let's hope they don't lose their nerves with warhammer coming up and rush it

Darian_TruBlade · 08/26/08, 4:36 PM

"In the coming weeks" in Blizzard-speak is quite a long time. All this effectively amounts to is an acknowledgment that it will happen. It's doubtful that a company that built it's reputation and current MMO dominance on taking it's time is going to rush production over the latest in a long line of supposed "WoW-killers". Blizzard didn't go stark raving mad overnight and decide that it was okay to send unimplemented talents live.

Spirit Link and other buggy/NYI talents will be finished well before we see a 3.0 PTR, so sit tight.

Skyhoof · 08/26/08, 4:43 PM

My biggest concern is whether the new content patch will remove the ability to downrank. If so, I'll get my OOM macro ready again. Haven't used that since pre-BC.

Darian_TruBlade · 08/26/08, 4:56 PM

Given the nature of the pre-BC content patch, it seems likely we'll see the downranking change along with the pre-WotLK content patch. This isn't necessarily a bad thing if Blizzard includes the spell/talent support they've alluded. Whatever happens, we'll have at least a week where all healers are effectively newbies again as they adjust (or fail to).

jaredh · 08/26/08, 5:51 PM

Originally Posted by Darian_TruBlade

Given the nature of the pre-BC content patch, it seems likely we'll see the downranking change along with the pre-WotLK content patch. This isn't necessarily a bad thing if Blizzard includes the spell/talent support they've alluded. Whatever happens, we'll have at least a week where all healers are effectively newbies again as they adjust (or fail to).

I can tell you this much, if it comes, you will be seeing the end of TBC endgame raidng.

I consider it impossible to get Illidan phase 2 healed at max rank chain let alone getting 3/4 into a Brutalis fight.

I'll be needing 2 shadow priests for continued Illidan farming in phase 2 I fear.

Originally Posted by Darian_TruBlade

"In the coming weeks" in Blizzard-speak is quite a long time. All this effectively amounts to is an acknowledgment that it will happen. It's doubtful that a company that built it's reputation and current MMO dominance on taking it's time is going to rush production over the latest in a long line of supposed "WoW-killers". Blizzard didn't go stark raving mad overnight and decide that it was okay to send unimplemented talents live.

Spirit Link and other buggy/NYI talents will be finished well before we see a 3.0 PTR, so sit tight.

The common belief in the WoW community that Blizzard is what they have been before is no longer appropriate. They are now part of a publicly traded company and everything changes as soon as that happens. You cannot release it "when it's ready". You release it on the release schedule....referece Warhammer, AoC, and many, many other games before it.

Quality is expected along with a fixed timeline. Such is the case of corporate America.

You should buckle your seatbelts. The PTR is going to be next week or the week after at most with no more than a month in PTR. That leads you to Sept 30 or Oct 7 3.0 launch to Live...and a Retail WotLK in the first 2 weeks of November.

The devs have alot of very long nights ahead of them the next month to get it stable enough for a live rollout. it's going to happen very soon. The suits will be certain of that.

Gormane · 08/27/08, 3:52 AM

Originally Posted by jaredh

I can tell you this much, if it comes, you will be seeing the end of TBC endgame raidng.

I consider it impossible to get Illidan phase 2 healed at max rank chain let alone getting 3/4 into a Brutalis fight.

I'll be needing 2 shadow priests for continued Illidan farming in phase 2 I fear.

I can't comment on Brutallus, since we've just started that fight, but on Illidan phase 2 I have never used anything but max rank Chain Heal, without ever having a shadow priest. It just depends on how quickly you kill the adds, I guess.

What I am fearing more, regarding the Illidan fight, is that with changed warrior spells/talents, Shear will become a real problem, at least when Illidan is enraged. Better start getting those paladin tanks ready for tanking Illidan.

One other thing I've been musing about is whether it would be a good idea to pick up as much elemental crit gear as possible in the coming weeks. In parallel to the pre-TBC patch, I'm half expecting the new spellpower stat to appear with the pre-WotLK patch, making current elemental gear available to resto shamans, and possibly desired as well with WotLK talents.

Kopalec · 08/27/08, 8:26 AM

Sorry to butt into your thread. Have a question about the possible interaction between Spirit Link and Grace stacking. Do you suppose that having all 3 targets of the link stacked with Grace would allow it to "double dip"? As in 12% extra healing/less damage taken to the 2 additional tanks/soaks?

Is it possible to have multiple Resto Shaman use Spirit Link in a loop for the same 3 targets (link from a different begining target) to further abuse the mechanic?

Darian_TruBlade · 08/27/08, 12:56 PM

I highly doubt that you will be able to "loop" Spirit Link. The damage done will probably function much like Seal of Blood's self-damage, ignoring normal damage splitting/immunity mechanisms.

It's tough to tell on double dipping, and it actually applies to a number of buffs and debuffs. They will probably all have to be tested individually when Spirit Link's bugs/implementation are worked out. The first one on the list being linking to a Warrior in Defensive Stance using Shield Wall.

Teewee · 08/27/08, 1:47 PM

Originally Posted by jaredh

I consider it impossible to get Illidan phase 2 healed at max rank chain let alone getting 3/4 into a Brutalis fight.

I've healed every event in TBC while using max rank of all my heals and I never have an spriest. You probably need to hold back on the haste and gear more towards mp5.

• kasik047 · 08/27/08, 2:26 PM

I expect your going to see alot more crit based gearing for shammys like early in TBC (ex shaman t4 and t5 resto sets and itemization in ssc/tk mail healing gear). we are critashammys for 5 mans and haste/chain heal in 25 mans. just how blizzard wanted it from the beginning. giving us versatility for both, something that was lacked at lower gear levels in TBC. now having 2 sets of gear for both is just kill our bagspace

Kirion · 08/27/08, 2:58 PM

Originally Posted by Teewee

I've healed every event in TBC while using max rank of all my heals and I never have an spriest. You probably need to hold back on the haste and gear more towards mp5.

Me too, but using lots and lots of fel mana potions. With only one potion per encounter i have no idea how to heal twins and muru without going oom.

Skyhoof · 08/27/08, 4:21 PM

What specs do you plan on using after the next content patch? Does the Improved Shield talent in the Enhancement tree that gives you 15% more healing from your Earth Shield stack with the Improved Earth Shield talent in the Resto Tree? Or do you spend two talents points to get two extra charges?

Assuming they don't stack (and mana is going to be an issue), I was thinking of going 0-8-53 for the improved Water Shield.
Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft
This build doesn't take Ancestral Awakening or Cleanse and has only 4/5 in Tidal Waves.

I'm sure a straight 61-point resto build will also be popular. You can get all the talents simply by giving up PVP-oriented talents such as Nature's Guardian and Focused Mind. Totemic Focus remains a weak talent that's not worth taking.

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft
I had one point left over which I put in threat reduction but it could go any where.

Daidalos · 08/27/08, 5:03 PM

Originally Posted by Skyhoof

What specs do you plan on using after the next content patch? Does the Improved Shield talent in the Enhancement tree that gives you 15% more healing from your Earth Shield stack with the Improved Earth Shield talent in the Resto Tree? Or do you spend two talents points to get two extra charges?

Assuming they don't stack (and mana is going to be an issue), I was thinking of going 0-8-53 for the improved Water Shield.
Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft
This build doesn't take Ancestral Awakening or Cleanse and has only 4/5 in Tidal Waves.

I'm sure a straight 61-point resto build will also be popular. You can get all the talents simply by giving up PVP-oriented talents such as Nature's Guardian and Focused Mind. Totemic Focus remains a weak talent that's not worth taking.

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft
I had one point left over which I put in threat reduction but it could go any where.

So many things are bugged or not yet implemented I don't think anyone has to worry about this being in a couple weeks. I'm expecting it still be months off.

personally I'd go with the Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft build you suggested since starting out I will have very little crit meaning I won't gain much from imp shields.

Skyhoof · 08/27/08, 5:25 PM

Well, they did clear the European PTR forums, which is usually a sign they are going to push something onto the PTR soon. It's always hard to know what Blizzard will do. They could push to get this 3.0 content patch out in a few weeks and release WotLK before Christmas. However, they have proven that they don't need Christmas for them to have record sales. They did very well releasing BC in January (if I recall correctly).

personally I'd go with the Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft build you suggested since starting out I will have very little crit meaning I won't gain much from imp shields.

I don't see any crit requirement on the Improved Shield talent in the Enhancement tree. It's the improved water shield talent in the resto tree that relies on crit, which is one reason I was thinking of taking the Enhancement talent. Yes, the talent discussion is a little premature but I find the possibilities very exciting (read: I'm a big geek).

I'll have to look more closely at the Elemental gear to see if any of it might be better than the resto T6 should the spell power change go into effect in the upcoming patch. For the moment, if any T6 tokens are going to rot, I would pick them up if there's no charge or very little cost. It never hurts to have options. However, all the bosses in the game can be beaten with the resto gear we currently have and our current talents. If anything, the content patch should make several bosses easier to kill, perhaps with the exception of Illidan.

Darian_TruBlade · 08/27/08, 6:39 PM

It seems like Blizzard is intent on pushing the 3.0 patch to the PTR before all of the beta talents are complete. It's likely they're trying to increase their tester pool for universal changes without having to deal with testers enamored with the new content.

Though I doubt much useful testing will occur for the entire first week as millions of players crash the servers to try out LK talents.

Daidalos · 08/28/08, 12:07 AM

Originally Posted by Skyhoof

Well, they did clear the European PTR forums, which is usually a sign they are going to push something onto the PTR soon. It's always hard to know what Blizzard will do. They could push to get this 3.0 content patch out in a few weeks and release WotLK before Christmas. However, they have proven that they don't need Christmas for them to have record sales. They did very well releasing BC in January (if I recall correctly).

I don't see any crit requirement on the Improved Shield talent in the Enhancement tree. It's the improved water shield talent in the resto tree that relies on crit, which is one reason I was thinking of taking the Enhancement talent. Yes, the talent discussion is a little premature but I find the possibilities very exciting (read: I'm a big geek).

I'll have to look more closely at the Elemental gear to see if any of it might be better than the resto T6 should the spell power change go into effect in the upcoming patch. For the moment, if any T6 tokens are going to rot, I would pick them up if there's no charge or very little cost. It never hurts to have options. However, all the bosses in the game can be beaten with the resto gear we currently have and our current talents. If anything, the content patch should make several bosses easier to kill, perhaps with the exception of Illidan.

I was just referring to the imp shields benefiting water shield orbs if you went with the imp water shield route.

madrix · 08/28/08, 4:46 AM

Originally Posted by Darian_TruBlade

It seems like Blizzard is intent on pushing the 3.0 patch to the PTR before all of the beta talents are complete. It's likely they're trying to increase their tester pool for universal changes without having to deal with testers enamored with the new content.

Though I doubt much useful testing will occur for the entire first week as millions of players crash the servers to try out LK talents.

It is possible they are looking to have the beta players concentrate on the new content while having the PTR focus on the balancing issues of those classes already in the game. It would be a very long PTR (believe the blue post about it referenced there being previous PTRs lasting 2 months) and given how broken most of the shaman abilities are, it's hard to say what would be the preferred spec since talents are subject to change, but as usual a heavy majority in resto is likely with probably skipping the abilities based on crit assuming resto tier gear is not getting redone.

Havoc12 · 08/28/08, 6:54 AM

I see a lot of worry about the downranking nerf, but I think its premature. All classes get a fair boost to their mana regen mechanisms and we are also getting a TON of damage reduction mechanics. We are also looking at a substatial DPS increase for most DPS classes. Your avearge 6 minute fight is probably going to be cut to under 5. If anything the new talents will make it easier for people to do the TBC raid content.