I realize this has been more than likely discussed in passing before but I'm curious as to one's thoughts on the matter.
Why do some enhance shamans use the agility meta gem over the straight crit meta gem? Crit should have a higher EP value than agility always, should it not? It benefits spells as well as melee, meaning it helps to benefit Elemental Devastation which in turn boosts your melee crit. So why would one choose the agility meta over the crit meta?
More practically, the Chaotic Skyflare requires 2 blue gems to activate which pretty much knocks it out of consideration.
It is not that easy. If you got the Belt of Dragons and the T8-Warkilt (both with a blue socket and 12 AP bonus. Assuming you are not a JC and you capped hit and expertise) an enchanted tear is the best option for the first blue socket. You have two options for the second blue socket: Ignore the second blue socket and use the 21 agi meta or get the second socket bonus (i.e. with a 16 ap/12 stam gem) and use the 21 crit meta gem. For me both options are almost equal (except the additional 12 stam with the second option).
I was using Rawr to compile an up to date BiS list, mostly done btw, when i came to totem of dancing flame which in Rawr shows to be better than Hex, Dueling, and well honestly other totems outside of PvE. But when ran with enhsim, its lower DPS than Totem of Hex. When i started digging around in Enhsim, i couldnt find where it was calling or getting the modifications the totems do from the totems files.
So i moved back a step and decided to check Rawr for its modification from the totem. When i found it, i was kind of curious if the modifier was being applied right. In Rawr it is written out as:
TotemSSDamage | 155
Now im curious if its being applied correctly because of how its stated in Rawr, and if its done in Enhsim the same way. Is it taking the Stormstrike then adding 155 damage? Just adding 155 damage to the MH because the hit chance is based of your MH hit chance. Is it being applied before, or after 2 peice set bonus from tier 8? How is it applied in game (before 2 piece 20% bonus, or after)? All this for me comes from the exact text of the totem:
Equip: Increases weapon damage when you use Stormstrike by 155.
The wording here is key, "Increases WEAPON damage." By increasing weapon damage weapon damage, does it apply to the minimum and maximum, or one or the other? If it applies to both, its increasing minimum and maximum damage by 155.
This is all me just trying to figure out which totem i should be using prior to 4 peice (i have no doubt totem of hex is better with 4 peice).
Gonna post this on the Rawr thread as well, thanks alot.
~Ciege
PS:
Originally Posted by bengali
It requires an extra blue gem. I personally use it because my own obsessive-compulsive disorder requires me to acquire all socket bonuses.
edit: yikes I was slow.
OCD or not, you only pick up 1 blue socket bonus. When you looking at socket bonuses you have to consider weather or not the socket bonus combined with with the gem(s) is better than just ignoring the socket bonus, and putting a better gem in. Also always grab the socket bonus that has a higher EP value.
While doing some attemping some hardmodes yesterday, a doubt came to me, imagine this situation:
- You have 60 sec to nuke a boss.
- you can time wolfs and BL.
- potion of haste is off cd.
- fire elemental is off cd.
- trinket are passive.
- boss is static aka patchwerk mode.
How is the best way to achieve more dmg. haste pot,dps, then on 43 sec left pop wolfs, fire elemental (dont know if fire elem is buffed by BL) and BL? or save everything to the last 43 sec, pop wolfs, fire elemental and stack haste pot and bl?
I think I read somewhere that with haste pot and bl and some decent amount of haste from gear you could reach a sort off soft haste cap where you wouldn't benefit fully from it.
Fire Elemental is not affected by Bloodlust, so you should pop it immediately. In fact, assuming that combat will end after those 60 seconds, you should probably have popped it 60 seconds earlier in order to get the most use out of the 2 min duration, but you could save it if there's a risk that it'll go chasing off after an add.
There's no reason to save Bloodlust for the last 43 seconds unless the fight gets progressively harder as it goes on. If fight conditions remain constant you should use it early, so that the maximum number of people get the maximum benefit (i.e you don't pop it after people have died or run out of mana).
Wolves should be popped directly before Bloodlust, as they benefit from it. I don't believe they benefit from Potion of Speed, so you can pop that right after Bloodlust.
If the fight gets progressively harder during those 60 seconds then you should probably pop Bloodlust when there's 45 second to go, and Wolves directly afterwards, saving Potion of Speed for the final 20 seconds.
I think between us we have nailed the Armour Penetration calcs that were out of whack in v1.7.0 (and the two subsequent patches) The new v1.7.0.3 is producing much better results for Armour Pen that match the formulae determined in the Combat Ratings at 80 thread on EJ.
I understand that Verges should be releasing this new v1.7.0.3 soon and I'd encourage everyone to use it. Whilst on the subject does anyone know of a way to contact Tukez, he hasn't been seen for a month or two so might be busy or just no longer interested in the game. It would be good to know if development on the new branch of EnhSim should continue or not - at least until the Java Group get some actual code written.
Author of ShockAndAweEnhancement Shaman max dps addon
Please use the EnhSim by Ziff & others to simulate what gear, priorities etc are the best dps. You can use ShockAndAwe to export your paperdoll stats to EnhSim.
When running EnhSim v 1.7.0 I am able to Sim my dps correctly, however, when I try to calculate my EP values, it gets to 9/14 and then crashes. Vista gives me an error and tells me the program has shut down. If you let me know what you need to research it, or if i'm making a simple mistake i'll gladly edit this post with the information (i.e. an error log or something, Vista only gives me the generic "program has shut down error" with some numbers at the bottom but i'm not sure if it'd be helpful). This happens no matter what the time period i Sim for is, or what my stats are. It's worked once in the past, and i didn't change anything that I can remember.
this is the last output file:
EnhSim version 1.7.0
Spell hit + EP range goes past cap by 2.35364% (61.7407 hit rating).
Mh expertise + EP range goes past cap by 3.22446 expertise (26.4325 expertise rating).
Oh expertise + EP range goes past cap by 3.22446 expertise (26.4325 expertise rating).
rotation_priority_count 8
rotation_priority1 MW5_LB
rotation_priority2 SW
rotation_priority3 SS
rotation_priority4 ES
rotation_priority5 MT
rotation_priority6 LS
rotation_priority7 LL
rotation_priority8 SR
###############################################################################
### Everything in the section below can be replaced by information obtained ###
### from your paper doll stats or exported by the ShockAndAwe addon ###
###############################################################################
Fire Elemental is not affected by Bloodlust, so you should pop it immediately. In fact, assuming that combat will end after those 60 seconds, you should probably have popped it 60 seconds earlier in order to get the most use out of the 2 min duration, but you could save it if there's a risk that it'll go chasing off after an add.
There's no reason to save Bloodlust for the last 43 seconds unless the fight gets progressively harder as it goes on. If fight conditions remain constant you should use it early, so that the maximum number of people get the maximum benefit (i.e you don't pop it after people have died or run out of mana).
Wolves should be popped directly before Bloodlust, as they benefit from it. I don't believe they benefit from Potion of Speed, so you can pop that right after Bloodlust.
If the fight gets progressively harder during those 60 seconds then you should probably pop Bloodlust when there's 45 second to go, and Wolves directly afterwards, saving Potion of Speed for the final 20 seconds.
Forgot those conditions, no one dies or go oom and fight gets harder toward the end. Cant cast elemental before this. My main question is: what results in greater dmg? stacking haste pot and BL or using them separatly?
Forgot those conditions, no one dies or go oom and fight gets harder toward the end. Cant cast elemental before this. My main question is: what results in greater dmg? stacking haste pot and BL or using them separatly?
Why set up an elaborate scenario if you just want a simple answer?
Regardless, haste stacks multiplicatively. This means that it is very beneficial to stack sources of haste together (ie. pots during Hero/Lust).
Forgot those conditions, no one dies or go oom and fight gets harder toward the end. Cant cast elemental before this. My main question is: what results in greater dmg? stacking haste pot and BL or using them separatly?
I think that's a hard one to answer because of how haste benefits each of our skills differently. Melee swings and Flametongue weapon imbue both benefit pretty well from haste. Maelstrom benefits well from haste but with higher Maelstrom procs you get more clashes on your ability cooldowns, assuming those clashes don't become overwhelming haste is good for maelstrom. Windfury weapon levels off as haste gets higher. Increasing haste may get you one or two more procs but there is no guarantee of that because of how the cooldown works.
You can probably contrive a test here by entering the amount of haste equal to Bloodlust in your config and disabling bloodlust casts (is that possible?). That would allow you to sim out haste dps with bloodlust. Then sim out the DPS of bloodlust + haste pot (again by entering the haste amounts manually and disabling the use of bloodlust). Then Sim out the haste potion without any bloodlust. Finally sim out your damage with no haste pot and no haste buff.
Your concern is what is the difference in dps between stacking BL/hast pot and not stacking. Not stacking the two together results in 55 seconds of hasted attack time, so you need to compare that to 55 seconds of attack time with them stacked (ie Normal DPS + stacked BL/Haste pot dps + BL dps time after Haste pot expires). With these numbers you do the following calculations
BL + Hast pot dps score calc. > Non hasted DPS * 15 seconds + BL/Haste Pot DPS * 15 seconds + BL Dps * 25 Seconds
BL with seperate hast pot calc. > Haste potion only DPS * 15 Seconds + BL DPS * 40 Seconds
After doing these two calculations you will know which one results in a higher output of damage overall.
Because if I tell you exactly I want need to know theres good chance you'll tell what I need to know or at least get close to it and not deviate from the question. Damn my english is rusty...
. Btw horac you can sim without BL, just reduce BL casters to 0.
I knew you could reduce the option to 0 in the configuration but was not certain that the program interpreted 0 as a valid value for that option.
My speculation on the subject of which is better is that they will probably be very close to each other in overall damage output and will come down to how well you deal with the stacked haste situation (cooldown clash hell) vs not stacking the haste.
Last edited by Horac : 06/17/09 at 12:35 PM.
Reason: added comment about what I think the results of the test will show.
This version nails down the armor penetration bugs and damage reduction formulas.
Is there a chance of getting the source for this new version, so I can compile for the Mac platform and include in iEnhSim? It seems this branch is where actual development is getting done, so I believe it's best for me to have my project using this engine as well.
My friend asked me this question, and being the curious guy I am, I decided to do some research on it: Boss spell penetration. Now according to a wide variety of websites out there, NPCs have a 2% base resistance to spells per level above you that can not be overcome ( See: Spell penetration - WoWWiki - Your guide to the World of Warcraft ). Additionally, the simulator leaves spell resistance figures set at 0. Isn't this a rather important oversight? I saw spell resistance numbers all the time in a raiding situation in TBC.
If this is the case, what numbers should we be using for spell resistance? Would the standard 8*Lvl work?
Do I have to change something in the config file too? I am a bit confused since Levva said there'd be better results for ArP. I just get an EP-Value of 1.42 after 20k hours calculations and well, this is exactly the same as before, with v1.7.0.0/.1/.2
so I didnt even notice anything, except a dps-loss of about 75.
Is there a chance of getting the source for this new version, so I can compile for the Mac platform and include in iEnhSim? It seems this branch is where actual development is getting done, so I believe it's best for me to have my project using this engine as well.
I'm still seeing a random 20-25 dps increase in overall damage on occasion when running the Sim. Normally it would be very stable to within 2-3 dps no matter how often I ran the sim. Now, I find myself running at least 3-4 sims at 5000 hours each time until I'm satisfied I know the base dps value to pass on to my friend. Is there something wrong with the Sim that needs to be fixed to solve this problem?
06/16/09, 1:40 PM
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