Palouff

What is your opinion about Venture Co. Lightning Rod VS Relic Badge

The Hex in Naxx 25 didn't drop...

 

Phatpharm

One of the last few pieces I am waiting on.

I have not heard any TC with reference to the [Venture Co. Lightning Rod] most likely because it is blue, and all the EJ raiders would have had the totem from the Temple of Karabor.

I personally thought it could be good (in absence of Hex) with all the talents / glyphs / set bonuses that modify Lava Burst. It should be an apparent difference in damage.

Has anyone TC the lightning totems, are they added to the base damage or added at the end ?

 

Dhiva

It doesn't suffer because I have control over when I want to use the hyperspeed accelerator. I usually pop it just before a LvB, which they happen every 8 seconds ( 8 x 8 = 64 seconds), and I usally just LB spam on the duration. I don't have more problem on my rotation because I go on a priority system anyway, I don't have a set rotation in stone.

it's not perfect, but it's better than nothing if you want to keep engineering.

 

Limitz

Heres the WWS of our latest Naxx, picked up a few things later in the run.

The World of Warcraft Armory
Wow Web Stats

 

Ezareth

I've mentioned it several times on these forums.

The Lightning Rod is easily better than the Relic Badge.


Should have used your mark of the war Prisoner twice during the fight.

You also need to replace a blue 9SP/12 Stam gem with an 8Hit/12 Stam gem, that lack of 8 hit and the fact that your boomkin was specced Imp FF and never bothered to cast it cost you 2 spells.

comparing your WWS to my last one:
WWS

You had 5 more seconds of damage, and a slightly higher LB crit rate, yet I had 600 more DPS from a few extra spells and a slightly higher average damage.

Should have used your trinket, potion and elemental mastery after the bloodlust not before it.

I'd also use chain lightning occasionally to fit your lava bursts on the rotations you aren't flame shocking, you should have one more lava burst than me since I had one in the air when Patchwerk died on my parse.

In closing I notice you have a 10 spell penetration gem in your helm. Everyone and their mother has told me this has zero effect, yet I notice your % mitigated is markedly lower than mine.

This is something I think everyone here at EJ should test and retest again...it wouldnt surprise me to see Blizzard throw something like making Spell Pen useful into the mix without letting anyone know.

 

Palouff

Ok thanks you ... Hope the Hex drop next naxx run :P

 

Chaser

Interesting.

It's always been said that bosses have a certain amount of resistance you cannot go past. But also, that certain bosses have resistances above that mark that you can take out of the equation with spell pen. For exemple, every boss would have like 36 spell resist to all schools (completely arbitrary number), and no amount of spell pen would lower it. Then, bosses would sometimes have more, and it would be possible to lower it back down to 36 with spell pen. It would be interesting to know for sure, could change the way we do things completely. I never even take a look at the mitigated part because I assume it's just there and doesn't really change much.

Also, I was wondering if people still believe potion of speed > potion of wild magic now that they buffed wild magic by quite a bit (200 sp, 200 sc). Numbers look a lot closer now, and considering the fact we pop pots during heroism/elemental mastery... I am not sure how to math it out.

 

Limitz

@Ez

I didnt have the 7.5helm until after the run, was using the one off 10man Saph with a [Glowing Twilight Opal]

Yea I didnt realize the boomkin wasnt Imp FF at the time

 

Graysun

As you can all tell I am a newbie here. I have been reading these forums for a few months but just recently got the nerve to post. Since they "fixed" eles in the last patch I want to be the best DPS I can be for my raid group as well as bring great utility. Therefore when I see you all doing 5.6k DPS on Patch and I am only doing 3.5k I know I need some work yet.

So here is my WWS: WWS Loading...

My Armory is: The World of Warcraft Armory

I munch on +40 hit fish to get capped as a Draenei. We had both a SP and a Boomkin, and I don't think I ever missed.

I know I have some blues to swap out yet and some items are not max enchanted (waiting to get BIS or even epics before I max enchant). Yes I know my wep does not have the 63 SP on it, I'm working on it, but I don't think +13 SP is the root of my problems. I also do not have the 4 piece bonus but I have the T7.5 equivalents. I have had spotty luck with drops. We shot down 13 bosses in our run this week, and I got 0 drops.

Basically, I am sure it is a combination of my gear, fat finger rotation, and nerves that are gimping me but I wanted to see if all you TCers could help give a few pointers on how to maximize what DPS I should hit with my current gear. What stats do I need inmprove, etc. What is it you think I should be hitting in my current state?

My rotation is mostly:

FS - LvB - LB till LvB CD is up - LvB - LB till FS is almost up - FS - repeat. I have read mixed reviews on CL, I used to use it but seem to find my DPS is higher when not using it atm. I think I get nervs and use FS too much wanting it to be up all the time, but am not sure.

I tend to forget to use my trinket and EM when they are on CD. I got spoiled with EM being up till use. Now I have to remember to pop it on the pull or I lose it.

With the helm, chest, and pants I have, which do you think I should replace when I get my T7.5? I know I need the 7.5 gloves yet. I am thinking the pants and helm. Pants for the extra hit and helm for the looks. I like the chest I have but am open to whatever. Maybe a noob question, but is the +10% LvB bonus worth some lover stats?

I really appreciate any help here to maximize my gear, rotations, ext. I think I can do well, just need that extra skill that must be escaping me. Thanks for your help!

 

Ezareth

First off ditch the meta gem and get a Chaotic Skyflare diamond. You are losing a bit of DPS from that alone.

Replace the gem in your bracers and both in your legs with 19 spellpower. Forget socket bonuses. You also should get 63 Spellpower to your wraith strike since it is pretty much BIS unless you are considering taking Torch of Holy Fire.

Now onto your parse.

For one you aren't going to touch 5600 DPS without getting a 3 minute or less kill as well as using a speed or wild magic potion.

Your rotation looks fine other than the lack of an occasional chain lightning and a few flame shock clips that lowered your total amount of lava bursts.

Once your guild is killing patch in <3 minutes, and you are using a potion of speed/wild magic, with a few upgrades and adjustments you should break 5K no problem.

 

doogless

From the looks of it, you're just not casting enough spells.

My gear is very similar to yours (armory link to the left), and here's a WWS from my guild's 10-man Patchwerk this week: Wow Web Stats

Ignoring the oddities of our kill (our OT died 30 seconds into the fight which resulted in our melee dying, he then got BRed and we finished the fight - my 1 FS miss came while the Druid was BRing our DK and Imp FF fell off), look at our stats:
You: Wow Web Stats
Me: Wow Web Stats

Turn on the columns for number of crits and average crits. Similar damage on LB and LvB (I was using the Venture Co. totem at the time, which explains my slightly lower LB damage but slightly higher LvB damage). The big difference? The number of Lightning Bolts. In my 4:32 kill I cast 145 LBs. In your 5:34 kill you cast 146 LBs.

That's where your missing DPS is coming from - you're doing something other than casting. Maybe get a better internet connection, or turn off BitTorrent while you play, or just mash your 2 key harder, but the reason your DPS is lacking is that you're just not getting enough spells off.

 

Ezareth

You used a Potion of Speed, and had 2% more haste than him as well as a larger percentage of the fight with bloodlust up. He had a few more flame shocks than he needed and he also dropped his totems after the start of the fight and after he first flame shocked patchwerk which explains the 4 seconds at the start he did nothing and this also lowered his DPS significantly.

 

doogless

Right, I suppose that makes sense. I forgot about the Potion of Speed.

While we're on the subject of potions, I tried to calculate the EP of Potion of Speed vs Potion of Wild Magic (since apparently Wild Magic got buffed this patch and I hadn't noticed). It looks like Bink's spreadsheet calculates the EP of potions when averaged over the whole fight. Using that method, 500 haste is superior for my stats. However, tweaking the stats it uses to reflect what my stats would be with Heroism, EM, and a trinket up, Wild Magic pulls ahead. Is this a correct way to approximate which potion is better to use, and therefore should I be using Wild Magic rather than Speed now?

 

Agash

Graysun,

As well as the comments already made, I would say your time between LvB casts is too high. You cast 31 LvB cast in a 331 sec fight which is about 1 LvB per 11 secs which is very high. Really you should be aiming for less than 10 secs between each LvB. If you are using just LBs then there is nothing whatsoever you can do about this. So I would suggest nipping over to the target dummies and practice getting those CLs into your rotation. If you use CL whenever off CD, you should be able to knock that down to about 10.3 secs between LvB, thereby slipping in 2 extra LvBs during the fight.

 

Blessedblob

Hello, I'm far more of a "lurker", than a poster on these forums, but presently I'm confronted with a gear dilemma. I will acquire Battlemaster's Bravery today (111 passive sp, no useful use), and was contemplating potentially replacing my Mark of the War Prisoner with it. I presently use two rings with no hit, and am gemmed for pure sp in every slot. However, I have the gothik ring sat in my bags/bank, and with a small adjustment to the gems in my plush sash (replacing one sp with rigid autumn's glow) i will still be capped, and will see a huge upgrade in passive sp. So is the Mark's "use" worth keeping, or should i make the switch to my new Battlemaster trinket?

The World of Warcraft Armory (no, i do not raid as 8/11/52 :P)

Regards, Lyd.

Edit: since the armory seems reluctant to update, My present stats are 2223 sp, 271 HR, 481 Haste rating and just shy of 25% crit.

 

Graysun

Thank you all for the very good advice. I did KT, OS+1, and we got Maly to phase 3 for the first time last night. (We are a casual guild that raids 2 nights a week so no noob coments lol) I was able to interject some CL into my rotation and I think I saw a difference but none of them are tank and spank

I don't know about my internet connection. I don't run a file share program but I do share bandwidth with my wife. My lats run around 200-300. My frame rate runs about 30ish. I didn't think to use those special pots but that sounds cool.

I saw on some of your armory pages that you have the chaotic diamond and wondered if I needed that. I will do that, and max enchant. I'll be gemming up SP like you said. I just seem to have an initial aversion to losing the socket bonus when it is something I can use. I just need to do the math I guess.

Three last questions that I was wondering:

#1 When I get the T7.5 pants, head, and legs, which two should I use since I am sporting the equivalents right now that have better stats? I am thinking legs and helm. (sure enough the helm droped last night and I just lost it to a hunter :P)

#2 Is the 4 piece set bonus mandatory considering the minor loss of stats? Or is my math off?

#3 I have the T7 chest but banked it due to the chest I have now. If I get the legs or head, should I pull it back out to get the 4 set bonus till I can replace it with T7.5?

 

LITTLER0TT

I'd say if you are still capped then go for it. The use isn't that amazing and the static SP is nice. I'd say though go for some other pure spellpower trinket that gives something better. But if you manage to get Dying Curse then go back to that because its by far the best trinket, in my opinion. (Baring Dragon soul)

 

Ezareth

I haven't thought much on this yet but I know you don't want to use a potion of speed with bloodlust up as haste has diminishing returns. You get a much larger DPS boost using it when your haste is low.

The same however is true of crit, it too has diminishing returns. With Elemental Mastery up your crit rate is going to pretty much sustain Elemental Focus 100%, Additionaly benefit of 200 more crit rating isnt going to increase your DPS by as much as it would with EM down.

200 spellpower in addition to the crit makes it a bit more difficult choice, but both crit and spellpower stack with haste perfectly.

Personally I'd still stick with the Potion of speed at the start of a fight with Elemental Mastery. Haste requires far less points than crit per % gained and you are comparing a total of 400 points spellpower/crit to 500 of haste.

 

Agash

If we use the stat weightings from Simcraft and the DEP values from SEIC we get the following DPS increases:

Simcraft:

Potion of Speed = 410
Potion of Wild Magic = 344

SEIC:

Potion of Speed = 387
Potion of Wild Magic = 380

So in each case, speed seems to come out on top but not by huge margin. The wife tells me that the mats for the Potion of Speed are much easier to get though so I stick to that one.

 

• Binkenstein

While using stat weightings may be nice, if we do some calculations, Wild Magic comes out ahead. SEIC r7 has been updated to reflect this.

 

Threk

So is 4 piece with gloves and Wanton the accepted BIS?

 

Debby

I wanted to post this question but didn't know the proper thread to chose. Anyway, here it is.

My guild recently let me to switch to my elem (from warlock - I'll edit the info at the right side for armory link) and I am wondering what is your opinion about the future of Elemental. Do you fell that it will scale good enough in the future instances/gear tiers comparing to other classes?

 

Acaila

Just switched from a DK to elemental shaman as my guild had no raiding shamans and an abundance of melee dps.

Was dragged through some of heroic Nax last night:

Full run: Wow Web Stats

Patchwerk: Wow Web Stats

What I'm concerned about is my rotations and spell usage. Specifically DoT uptime and LvB usage.

I'm not to concerned with my gear at the moment (I'll be getting 2-3 upgrades a raid from now on) and I'll be gemming for +hit on all ilvl 200+ gear as I get it till I reach the cap.

Edit'd for clarity

 

Cragen

Yes, I'd say it's the BIS if you're going to drop mail for cloth. I havn't started to go for the Wanton Leggings before now to give cloth casters a chance to get it. But using [Leggings of the Wanton Spellcaster] [Valorous Earthshatter Gloves] over [Benefactor's Gauntlets] [Valorous Earthshatter Kilt] will net you around 70 more spellpower since you won't have to use [Signet of the Malevolent] for hit, nor gem for it except for one spellpower/hit gem.

So it's a choice really, more spellpower, or more crit/haste with the full mail set.

Difference isn't all that big, when I checked it was at around 40-45 dps, but it's a DPS gain so worth going for when you're getting close to perfect gear.

 

Ezareth

I'd like to see the proof on this on something other than a spreadsheet. I'm pretty damn good at guestimating numbers in my head, and much worse at putting them on paper for others to understand.

Lets see the situation where you think Wild Magic comes ahead and I'll tell you if I am in agreement. I just don't see how it is possible right now.

The problem is we have exactly 2 perfectly itemized rings outside of the Ilvl 200 Haste/Spellpower rings. [Signet of Manifested Pain] Pain and [Signet of the Malevolent]

What ring are you going to replace with Signet of the Malevolent to benefit from dropping it?

The Gains are 11 Int, 23 SP, 16 Haste, 56 Hit, and 18 MP5 at the cost of 850 armor, 35 Stam and 97 Crit.

I have two yellow sockets with +16 hit gems and one blue with a +8 gem that I could swap runed cardinals and a 9SP/12 stam which would make it 11 Int, 70 SP, 16 Haste, 16 Hit, 18 MP5 at the cost of 850 Armor, 23 Stam and 97 Crit which is a clear win but you are still going to be over hit cap, if you drop the signet for a SP/Haste ring you can make a few gains.

Going [Band of Channeled Magic] over the signet will net you 7 Int, 32 Spirit, 10 Haste, 19 SP at the cost of 7 Stam, 49 Hit.

Adding everything up again and swapping +hit gems back in to keep your net hit gains to nothing makes it, 18 Int, 51 SP, 26 Haste, -1 Hit, 18 MP5, 32 Spirit, at the cost of 30 Stam, 97 Crit and 850 Armor.

This puts me at a perfect 289 instead of 290, and has some pretty nice gains but it is unfortunate we have to make such a bad trade to take advantage of too much hit on the rings.

We have the same options if we were to try and trade our our neck for a different neck.

Now do you see why at the start of WOTLK when people were crying about not enough hit for shaman why I said this is a non-issue?

As we into ulduar gear we are going with similar itemization choices and so few items being itemized for our stats this is going to become more pronounced. The advantage Dranei have over everyone else right now is going to slowly be reduced to nearly useless once we have no options to drop hit.