AlphaJew

Earthliving, but we know what you meant and I agree.

As for leaving it at 25%, I see your point on it being very situational. I was thinking about other effects it could have like reducing the healing lost per bounce or making each bounce a guaranteed crit (which offers a nice synergy with Ancestral Healing if you bounce it off all your tanks), but I think the HoT preservation probably gives it the most flavor and usefulness.

Rounced seemed to have had good luck with posting his suggestion to the official forums about changing the Unleashed Rage passive to expertise instead of agility. Do we want one of us to do the same, put this idea out for the devs to possibly see?

 

• Philondra

I've posted several ideas on the official forums, and I know that others have too. We can only hope that they have looked at our reasoning behind why the glyph is very poor and have plans to change it into something that could see at least situational use.

 

Krim

Could you possibly post the links? I don't follow the Oceanic forums much due to the utter tripe some people post, the EU forums are nearly as bad... nearly. Thanks Phil

Personally, haven't been able to get into Ulduar to the EU PTR crashing, login issues and 1001 'fatal errors' - can anyone possibly give feedback on Ulduar's nature to Resto Shaman; so far the fights look like they all involve movement (of a constant nature) which I think hinders the possibility we can raid heal...

 

Daidalos

Ha, ya oops ok I fixed my post. I'll try and post some suggestions as well although I haven't had any luck with bliz doing anything i've suggested so far.

Restoration Shaman calculations:http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?k...IWv3sPmcYnEJUg

 

Ammanas

I can't believe they even bothered to put that riptide glyph into the game, its such complete trash right now. How about "Causes the bonus effect of your riptide to also apply to Healing Wave and Lesser Healing Wave" or "Reduces the cooldown of your Riptide by 1 second".

If we're talking PvP the Hex glyph is also pretty bad. Its a good idea in theory I guess but in practice Hex breaking to damage is hardly ever the problem. Something like a 10 second reduced cooldown or maybe a cast time reduction would have been much better.

Or what would be really nice is the glyph either slows them or makes them unable to move while Hexed.

 

• Philondra

Sure. Here's the thread that I started before we got deep into this discussion. Unfortunately, not too many people contributed with their own ideas:

World of Warcraft - English (NA) Forums -> Glyph of Riptide?

And here are a couple that didn't devolve into flame fests after three posts:

World of Warcraft - English (NA) Forums -> Glyph of Riptide
World of Warcraft - English (NA) Forums -> Making 'Glyph of Riptide' something wanted.

EDIT: With regards to my experiences in Ulduar on the PTR, because of time zone differences my guild was only able to test Iron Council - and only on 10 man, as it was 9 AM Saturday our time when testing started. We attempted a Big > Medium > Small kill order, and nothing in the fight suggested that we would have movement-related issues. We attemped to group the ranged together in the blue rune whenever possible, and the melee was naturally on top of one another, so Chain Heal was still effective. The Big tank could take some very significant spike damage due to Fusion Punch, even on 10 man, so I tried to make sure that I had a Tidal Waves charge up before each heavy spike.

From what little I saw of the fight, the raid damage on 10 man was mainly confined to the Chain Lightning at first, but we were really only able to get Big down in our few attempts. Obviously, if we brought the fight to its logical conclusion and did Small last, movement would become a bit more of an issue. Even then, tanks chain taunting would go a long way to keeping it stable.

I don't want to comment on Hodir without having seen the fight first hand.

 

kronchev

Re: 4th bounce and Earthliving: Does it really matter? My EL is about 800 every 2 seconds. If it's that essential it's not gonna be saving anyone. If anything it might inflate my meters but I don't see any real advantage.

I won't say that the extra bounce isn't worth having if it's gonna be a good amount of AOE damage, but just to keep an EL up, I really disagree there.

Given any general fight, IE not knowing of any special circumstances, I'd go with CH glyph, Earth Shield glyph, and LHW glyph. This gives both the better group healing benefits and the better single target heals.

Longer Riptide doesn't thrill me
Better chance of EL doesn't really seem as valuable as any of those

Elitist Jerks forum: Now work safe, because you don't want to get caught wasting your company's time!

It was a question of how the abilities of the fight are handled. I did not know the answer so I come to the place where I expect to see well formulated, concise and correct answers. Not snotty comments. - eclectic778

Vent is only necessary because of bad players. - ebbv

 

Brgid

Am I the only one here who likes the functionality of the glyph of Healing Wave?

In situations where there are a few people taking heavy damage including myself, the ability to CH (or RT) - HW - HW filling up 2-3 people *and* myself without wasting an extra GCD has been well worth it on enough occasions that I would feel I'd need a lot of persuasion to drop it... admittedly this is more an issue 2-healing a 10-man than with 5-6 healers in a 25 where the other healers will cover you if you dip....

 

• Philondra

You aren't the only one: [Resto] Glyph of Healing Wave and Ancestral Awakening Data
In addition to the data I posted there, it's worth noting that in practice GoHW really gains in value if your guild enjoys running with fewer healers to try to push up raid DPS.

 

Vuldunobetra

My rankings for GoHW:
Great! - Heroics (and Heroic Achievements)
Good - 2man healing Naxx10
Meh - 3 man healing Naxx10
Poor - 25man raids

The usefulness of the glyph is directly proportional to the need of big heals on others and yourself. My best memory of GoHW was doing 2-minute Loken. We stood in and took the damage. HW-HW-RT-HW-HW, and the whole group is nearly full health in under 9 seconds. As more healers are added, the more likely someone else will either heal up the target or yourself. In 25's, Recount would put GoHW at ~0.3% of my total healing.

The same goes for GoLHW. With bigger groups and more healers, the less a shaman is needed to heal the MT (where your ES probably is).

 

Skyburn

My guild usually runs with 4 to 4.5 (offspec healer) for 25man Naxx and Maly, and as a resto shaman raiding with 2 priests and 1 druid healer, I find GoHW very helpful. I mostly MT/OT heal and RT+HW+HW keeps me topped up most of the time in addition to getting bigger AA procs.

 

BroodStalker

Hey guys, me again. At the moment i've gemmed my gear with some +16 Intellect and 3x 27 intellect gems from jewel Crafting. Every other gem socket i have i've put in 9SP and 3 mp5 gems. Havnt been OOm once except when we just tried malygos 25man with 19 people for achievment and only 4 healers, was very hard. In that fight i hit 4100 heals per second and was just wondering would it be beneficial to regem some of my gear with 9 SP 8 Int?

Also, what do you believe is best in slot healing gem for Resto shamans?

 

Nebukadnezzar

Hard to say, because it depends very much on the situation (gear, raid setup, task, encounter). Since I'm the only raidhealer most of the time, I prefer mostly +haste.

Yellow -> +16 haste
Red -> +9 sp / +8 haste
Blue -> +8 haste / +3 mp5

(but I guess this isn't related with the topic of the thread very much)

 

Daidalos

This greatly depends on your role in the raid and your raid makeup. First do you want regen or HPS? a mix? Whats your replenishment up time? Are you a CH bot or are you HWing the tank?

You can take a look at my spreadsheet and save ourself your own copy and enter in your own weights and see the outcome of the various stats. As is your question is a little too open ended to answer.


Edit. Just realized this is the wrong thread for this type of question. So I guess I can add, has anyone been able to confirm how the Earth Shield glyph works? I keep looking on the AH for one but so luck so far. I'm assuming its a seperate multiplier at the end but I wanted to confirm.

Restoration Shaman calculations:http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?k...IWv3sPmcYnEJUg

 

• Philondra

If it's available on the PTR, I don't know anyone who is able to make it. I am inscription and have no glyphs left to learn through Northrend research, but trying to learn new glyphs that way yields nothing but scrolls, just like it does on live. Either they are NYI or the recipes are obtainable through some new way.

On a related note, this thread seems to be becoming a bit of a Resto one-stop shop. Should we start a dedicated general restoration discussion thread?

 

Felixalias

I think that a dedicated thread would be a great idea to answer some common questions (although for basic things like gemming, the theorycrafting think tank is already a great resource, as are the resto spreadsheets).

 

Jessamy

Tidal Waves hastes LHW below the gcd, so aside from landing 1/2 a second faster, it's the same cast time as HW. Lesser Healing Wave has a reduced chance to proc IWS. Even on nights when I'm the only resto shaman in a raid, guaranteeing I will have the only Earth Shield up, GoLHW would just encourage bad behavior. In 25-man content, HW is a better spell than LWH.

RT-HW-HW is an effective single target rotation. I have enough haste I could probably squeeze an extra LHW in there, but most fights require me to move at times. I've been taking my hunter alt into Naxx lately, but here's a Patchwerk WWS where I hit 5600 hps with no CH & no LHW:

Wow Web Stats

resto shaman glyph overview

 

• Philondra

Just as a note, Glyph of Earth Shield is available from the Dalaran inscription trainer on the latest PTR. With 2409 spellpower and the glyph, my Earth Shield was healing for 2694-2695 per orb. Without the glyph and with the same amount of spellpower, earth shield was healing for 2246. As Earth Shield's base heal doesn't vary, there is no reason to upload my log for community dissection -- the glyph is a straight +20% healing to earth shield after all talents and spellpower bonuses have been accounted for.

 

Kindralas

I think that the HW glyph is more underrated than any other glyph we have, mostly because mid-fight, its effects are somewhat unnoticable. But given situations in which you're taking consistent raid damage including yourself, it allows you to change your field of view to the raid without worrying about healing yourself, which is a pretty good place to be. I don't think it has any real dramatic effect, but most of our glyphs don't, so that's not a huge deal.

 

TeKniciaN

I dug up a WWS from a recent sarth 3d run. My healing breakdown was approximately :
45% Chain Heal
28% LHW
10% Riptide
10% ES
4% AA
3% ELW

I chose this fight because i was healing add tank + Raid, which forces a good mix of chain heal with LHW and RT

Doing some quick and dirty napkin math, i figured that the improved AA would actually double my AA's effective healing. I found this counterintuitive as my LHW overheal was 30% and Riptide was 21%. I may have botched the numbers.

ES Glyph should be relativey linear, pushing it up 20% of the 10% of my overall heals.

Just as a rough approximation I'd say the changes with the Glyph could increase our overall effective healing by up to 5%. Maybe someone could post exact figures. I'll try to post a WWS and analyze it later today if i have the time.

But overall I'm excited, it seems we are getting a substantial buff to our overall heals if I'm even in the right ballpark with my estimations. Hopefully the combined mana/healing totem will give us another small boost as well.




also:
I agree. I use HW glyph instead of Chain Heal in 10 mans, especially sarth10 3D. I do find it lackluster in 25 mans, however.

 

Vuldunobetra

It looks like the mana/healing totem is out. The WoW forum is expecting: Replenishment or raid-wide, but non-stacking with BoW. Both would be a nerf to our mana regen

MMO-Champion BlueTracker - Are the healing and mana totem still merging?
Probably not. We have another idea for the mana totem.

Edit: direct forum link
World of Warcraft - English (NA) Forums -> Are the healing and mana totem still merging?

 

Altsobadoli

Yeah I saw this too. Can you link to the thread on the forums you mentioned? I'd like to see their predictions. It might be useless to speculate at this point, but the original thought about merging the totems was a definite buff, so it follows for me that whatever they do would be a buff. If Blizz really thinks that making the mana totem raid wide and hence unstackable is a buff, then that's pretty inconsiderate, and I would go out of my way to complain about it. I wonder if they will change the nature of the totem altogether--perhaps a flat mp5 buff? Or a max mana bonus buff? That would be a pretty radical change though.

 

Felixalias

Just speculation, but I'm thinking it will likely have something to do with replenishment, and revamping Mana Tide. Ghostcrawler does say 'mana totems', after all, not mana spring specifically. I doubt that the straight mana restoration to the party only will continue as it just feels clunky and out of place of the rest of Wrath's new raid-wide buffs.

A Totem of Wrath-esque Resto totem feels likely (a flat buff), although that still doesn't account for mana spring - it seems like it would be replaced with replenishment as they are both mana restoration per tick, but then again, Replenishment isn't meant to be (and shouldn't be due to current PVP balance) a base ability.

 

Talaus-Mok'Nathal

I really doubt it will be replenishment. It will be a BoW replacement. Goes raidwide, provides a buff (like it used to) increasing mp5 by 91 with Restorative Totems increasing the mp5 by 20%. Won't stack with BoW, and won't ever be used again. Then Mana Tide will become a self-only buff, returning 12% of total mana every 3 seconds for 12 seconds. With their current goal of equallizing healer mana usage/regen, Shaman need a stronger "emergency" regen (like shadow fiend, innervate, divine plea).

 

PDXMarcos

Looking at the shaman class as a whole, I am seeing less and less viability of dropping any totems when it comes to a raid assuming a BoW change to mana spring. I understand that prior to Wrath the shaman totems (and Blust/Hero) brought that raid utility that forced putting a shaman in every group, but we have gone the complete opposite direction in wrath.

Beyond mana totems, none of my totems can provide incremental benefit to the 25-man raid group that our one enhance and one ele shaman can bring to the raid. As a result, I end up dropping one totem for the entire fight and heal continuously. From a design perspective it seems this "iconic" ability is utterly wasted. The question becomes, how do you balance that iconic ability with the new design philosophy of bring the player, not the class?

My solution would be along the lines of Elemental T6 bonus (Set: Whenever you have an air totem, an earth totem, a fire totem, and a water totem active at the same time, you gain 15 mana per 5 sec, 35 spell critical strike rating, and 45 spell power). Whenever you have an air, earth, water, and fire totem active, you receive X personal bonus. This allows for a benefit to dropping totems and using our iconic ability while not providing overtly unique raid utility.