The Elemental 3.1 PTR thread has become an overwhelming thread to sort through, due to the many changes that the 3.1 PTR brought, the bugs 3.1 presented, and it was meant as a discussion for the PTR and the Changes that ensued. This thread is created to be specific for 3.1 Optimal Gear selection and discussion.
A best in slot item is an item that, when all other factors have been taken into consideration, provides the highest return for its stats. This doesn't mean then that best in slot is the item with the most stats or the highest ilevel. Just as well, best in slot is occasionally confused with direct upgrades. A direct upgrade is an item that increases your DPS regardless of changes to anything else on your character. Sometimes this is useful information, because it allows a player to quickly guage one item over another, whether in the same slot or not.
However, the end result, and the progression to get there, is what I'm interested in showing. Because of this, best in slot is broken down into each notch on the ladder. A set containing best in slot items will be remarkably different for a person who runs only 10-man Ulduar from one who runs 25-man. It will be different for someone who has 'access' to items that are obtained through Hard-Mode encounters.
Many people have problems with BiS lists, as some people are unable to do hard modes, or only run 10 mans, or haven't even stepped foot into Ulduar yet. Some people raid with certain comps and get specific buffs, while others don't. BiS is looked as the end-all be-all of items, and people generally can get upset when their raid cannot meet certain requirements and are unable to obtain the items. Yet, more often than not, people trying to obtain BiS items are min/max'ing, which usually people not in higher end raiding guilds do not try and do.
With the huge onslaught of gear arriving, and the differences between horde and alliance gear, I have removed the BiS listings for now. If we derive a true BiS list, I will update it at that point, but for now, just read the thread and find which set you are looking for.
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"Compendium of Raiding Gear" has moved!
In an effort to make editting easier, and to keep this thread less bulky with all of these links, I have moved the "Compendium of Raiding Gear" to a blog entry.
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I'm running these spreadsheet dps calculations as an Orc shaman without considering Bloodfury. The following stats with trinkets averaged using spellpower*uptime and assuming the player uses healing stream totem to maintain IDS during periods of transition in fight that contains 7 minutes of dps time. Everything else is default on Blink's sheet, so there is no demo lock with >2800 spellpower, or other non-default raid buffs. I used a [Rigid Stormjewel] to get to the hit cap, added [Runed Dragon's Eye] to the three most optimal sockets and assumed that the Treads had a socket bonus equal to or weaker than 5 spellpower. I assumed professions were JC and some source of 38 spellpower.
Stamina: 1147 (+25)
Intellect: 1139 (+9)
Spellpower:2652 (+26)
Haste: 599 (-35)
Crit: 791 (+49)
Hit: 293 (+4, meaningless except that it makes it easier to compensate if you drop Icewalker for Tuskarr's Vitality)
And came up with 6649 dps without partial resists. I don't know what type of BiS list you're shooting for, but I think the highest dps one will include the items above minus the legendary for a mainhand. You added the Treads to the first list, so I assume you're not making a mail-only list or something to spread out loot competition evenly.
The changes from your first BiS list are Resto Conq Helm -> Ele Conq Helm, Ele Conq Legs -> Leggings of the Enslaved Idol, and Frozen Loop -> Pyrelight Circle.
I think Crit may be overvalued slightly at the moment if Blink hasn't updated his spreadsheet to reflect that Electrified can be partially resisted and doesn't proc/contribute damage on LO crits. That might change what's BiS slightly.
That is part of the reason a BiS list is not the greatest thing to have posted. I was able to skip the [Rigid Stormjewel] due to being alliance picking up more SP and haste in its place.
I do agree with your list (even though getting BiS for most of us, especially with the semi lowered DPS from this "bug" we have going around, is going to be a straight pain in the rear). It seems I didn't really take into account a few things, and as stated in the OP, the list will continually change! I also made the major mistake of not doing my calculations with any of the epic gems from the patch, and only using blue quality gems, so our numbers are way off. Once I get home, I will throw those into my spreadsheets and update the list!
Just to double check, you are using Bink's 3.1.0.12 sheet, correct? I just want to make sure I'm on the same page as you!
Edit:
My gear selection is coming out a bit closer then what you had come up with, due to the difference in gems. But, after plugging in all the numbers, it still looks like that set of gear is better then what I have listed. Updated the list. Thanks!
I find it kind of sad in the WoW world, when a spirit based item can even be considered as a BiS for Elemental. I did see that, but have not looked at the numbers. It does seem like an interesting possibility. I really wonder what the socket bonus is for it. I would venture to say it would be Spell Power, as that is what most blue sockets come out to, probably in the range of 7-9, which could really end up nice if you used a [Runed Dragon's Eye] to socket it (as the 3rd gem will only gain you 5SP in any of the above gear).
Have you run the numbers on it and came up with anything?
I find it kind of sad in the WoW world, when a spirit based item can even be considered as a BiS for Elemental. I did see that, but have not looked at the numbers. It does seem like an interesting possibility. I really wonder what the socket bonus is for it. I would venture to say it would be Spell Power, as that is what most blue sockets come out to, probably in the range of 7-9, which could really end up nice if you used a [Runed Dragon's Eye] to socket it (as the 3rd gem will only gain you 5SP in any of the above gear).
Have you run the numbers on it and came up with anything?
Well, last tier we had an mp5 weapon being our top. I'm still not surprised.
And from doing a simple EP comparison between the Drape + Soulscribe to the Pennant + Starshard, the latter seems to barely win out (this was assuming no worthwhile socket bonus, treating it as simply another 19 sp from a Runed Scarlet Ruby, with a Reckless in the Drape and a Runed in the Pennant).
IMO it would be a case of whichever you can get your hands on because they are quite close.
There's a high probability that I'm wrong, but I did everything by hand between 3-5 this morning so who knows. I have it set so [Illustration of the Dragon Soul] is pre-loaded to 200 SP, and [Flare of the Heavens] is just base off the crit rating and not the proc. Other then that, seems like a downgrade from the other compositions of gear we came up with.
If you want a true BiS list for Elemental you'd have to add the legendary. If you're good at PvP you can get that weapon for 2nd BiS. If you're awesome at PvE and your guild isn't retarded enough to give a dps caster a Val'anyr over all their healers then Algalon's spirit/hit weapon is BiS for now.
The difference between the Starshard Edge and [Soulscribe] is only 17 dps though, and will undoubtedly be the least upgrade of all dps casters.
Leggings of the Enslaved Idol should not be gemmed with Runed Dragon's Eye because you'd need two of them to get the bonus since there are no useful yellow gems once hit is capped.
9 spellpower divided by 2 prismatics is a 4.5 SP bonus per prismatic.
I suppose you could put a 9 SP 8 haste yellow though, I'll have to recalculate.
Ezareth, Running the math on my spreadsheets, using the following setups:
I came up with these figures: Scenario 2 doing approx. 20-30 more DPS than Scenario 1 (using a straight comparison, legs to legs).
The actual DPS gain/loss would be slightly different, raid buffed, and after you account for the 3rd [Runed Dragon's Eye] out of another item making you lose the 5 Spell Power bonus to replace it with a [Runed Scarlet Ruby], but still. You would gain 4 Spell Power from the higher socket bonus, swap [Runed Scarlet Ruby] for [Reckless Monarch Topaz] (swapping gems, I'm showing a 1-2 DPS loss), and it would give you slightly more DPS (in the range of 1-5) then any other possibility. If you are going for min/max, this seems to be the way to gem.
Assuming you are taking the Dragon's Eye out of your bracer and replacing it with +19 spellpower it ends up being 6 SP vs 8 haste. The 8 haste should be a bit better with BiS gear but it's very close to not mattering
How are you coming up with 6 SP vs 8 Haste? Socket bonus to Socket bonus, its a 4 SP difference. Then, you would lose 9 SP to regem, but gain 8 haste. So wouldnt the difference be -5 SP and 8 Haste?
Comparing the two socket bonuses, you would need a socket bonus gain of 2 DPS or more to make it worth it to re-gem. While it being a minimal gain, I'm showing a 4ish DPS gain from the socket bonus difference, so an overall gain of 2ish DPS. While yes, it is a minimal gain, we are still talking a gain. As far as BiS list, its best because its higher. If you are obtaining the pieces and have yet to gem any of them, that would be the preferred way, just trying to get maximum DPS gains from every possibility. 2 DPS is 2 DPS.
Edit: If you were to swap a Runed Scarlet Ruby for a Reckless Monarch Topaz, you would need the following Socket Bonus from a yellow gem to make it equal or better:
An Algalon weapon that has been assigned to the Hodir Hard mode it appears. Due to equivalent crit and significantly higher spell power, I'd assume this would pull ahead of the Soulscribe, despite the latter's haste. The real question comes down to the Constellus vs Starshard Edge, depending on where else your hit is coming from. I do like that this is only a tiny bit behind the Furious weapon and is much more accessible to me since I don't PvP.
But once again, the top PvE, non legendary elemental weapons come down to spirit or mp5.
How are you coming up with 6 SP vs 8 Haste? Socket bonus to Socket bonus, its a 4 SP difference. Then, you would lose 9 SP to regem, but gain 8 haste. So wouldnt the difference be -5 SP and 8 Haste?
Comparing the two socket bonuses, you would need a socket bonus gain of 2 DPS or more to make it worth it to re-gem. While it being a minimal gain, I'm showing a 4ish DPS gain from the socket bonus difference, so an overall gain of 2ish DPS. While yes, it is a minimal gain, we are still talking a gain. As far as BiS list, its best because its higher. If you are obtaining the pieces and have yet to gem any of them, that would be the preferred way, just trying to get maximum DPS gains from every possibility. 2 DPS is 2 DPS.
Edit: If you were to swap a Runed Scarlet Ruby for a Reckless Monarch Topaz, you would need the following Socket Bonus from a yellow gem to make it equal or better:
I was kind of curious about this: Furious Gladiator's Totem of Survival - Item - World of Warcraft the raw spell power buff seems like it might be less than the totem of hex, but with the elemental oath talent do the numbers come out superior as it is raw spell power to all spells?
I was kind of curious about this: Furious Gladiator's Totem of Survival - Item - World of Warcraft the raw spell power buff seems like it might be less than the totem of hex, but with the elemental oath talent do the numbers come out superior as it is raw spell power to all spells?
No, its actually fairly awful.
Even allowing for the bug to Totem of Hex, which knocks around 10% off its value (this may have been fixed in 3.1 but with the LvB rubbish going on I haven't had time to check) the spell forms such a large part of our rotation that the relic is worth in excess of 100 raw spellpower. Not sure what your point is about elemental oath, as the EO/clearcasting buff adds to all our damage, not any one type more than another.
Also, once you allow for the fact the gladiator's totem will have barely more than 50% uptime, its actually pretty dire.
It's not listed on wowhead yet but you'll want to add Conductive Seal to your ring list.
Conductive Seal
Binds when picked up
Unique-Equipped
Finger
+52 Stamina
+48 Intellect
+39 Spirit
Blue Socket
Requires Level 80
Equip: Improves haste rating by 55
Equip: Increases spell power by 75
Aesuga, Hand of the Ardent Champion
Binds when picked upMain Hand Mace
85 - 271 Damage Speed 1.80
(98.9 damage per second)
+23 Stamina
+48 Intellect
Yellow Socket
Socket Bonus: +4 Critical Strike Rating
Durability 105 / 105
Requires Level 80
Equip: Improves critical strike rating by 39 (0.85% @ L80).
Equip: Improves haste rating by 16 (0.49% @ L80).
Equip: Increases spell power by 520.
This item is getting buffed to 232 from 226 which will make it better than Soulscribe, and probably everything but Valynar making it the "True, BIS" which sadly will drop from hard mode General in 10 man making 10 mans a must for Elemental Shaman.
Why would it be better than Soulscribe just because its ilevel is being changed from 226 to 232? You do realize Soulscribe is also ilevel 232. Even if it is "slightly" itemized better I doubt it will out do the 2350 rating weapon or this hard mode mace.
Constellus
Binds when picked up
Main Hand Mace
93 - 298 Damage Speed 1.80
(108.8 damage per second)
+54 Stamina
+55 Intellect
Blue Socket
Socket Bonus: +5 Spell Power
Durability 105 / 105
Requires Level 80
Equip: Improves critical strike rating by 29 (0.63% @ L80).
Equip: Restores 19 mana per 5 sec.
Equip: Increases spell power by 587.
Why would it be better than Soulscribe just because its ilevel is being changed from 226 to 232? You do realize Soulscribe is also ilevel 232. Even if it is "slightly" itemized better I doubt it will out do the 2350 rating weapon or this hard mode mace.
Constellus
Binds when picked up
Main Hand Mace
93 - 298 Damage Speed 1.80
(108.8 damage per second)
+54 Stamina
+55 Intellect
Blue Socket
Socket Bonus: +5 Spell Power
Durability 105 / 105
Requires Level 80
Equip: Improves critical strike rating by 29 (0.63% @ L80).
Equip: Restores 19 mana per 5 sec.
Equip: Increases spell power by 587.
They both will be 550 Spellpower and a 9 SP 8 haste gem will put it at 43 Crit, 24 Haste, 559 SP which is 9 More SP, 15 More crit and 24 less Haste not counting whatever extra haste and crit the upgrade will give it.
The weapon you linked above is still slightly above what I figure Aesuga will come in at but only slightly itself.
Aesuga is still looking to be better than Soulscribe, and 10 man loot to boot. It is kind of retarded our BIS still seems to be a PVP weapon. Here is to hoping for a hard mode Elemental 239 Weapon.
It is kind of retarded our BIS still seems to be a PVP weapon. Here is to hoping for a hard mode Elemental 239 Weapon.
With the appearance of [Wraith Strike] in T7, I'm extremely hopeful that Blizzard will continue to put out caster fists for Elemental Shamans and Balance Druids. Although it wasn't BiS in T7 content, I think that the continuation of posts like these will open Blizzard's eyes to perfectly itemized Shaman loot (or lack thereof). Hopefully by the the time Aesuga and Constellus are released Blizzard will add a 239 caster fist, mace, or dagger that doesn't use points on spirit or Mp5.
I have had one since Day 1 Ulduar 10 and it comes in handy during AoE intensive fights, this stat buff makes me happy in the pants.
If the PTR stats remain as such, it would be a candidate for Pre-Hardmode BiS.
Just by looking at [Voice of Reason] vs Pulsing Spellshield 3.1.2, there is a practically no gap (Pulsing even comes ahead +5 haste vs - 1 SP) between the shields even though the latter is ilvl 219.
Last edited by Ashegorath : 05/18/09 at 4:24 AM.
Reason: ilvl for Pulsing spellshield and Engrish
Has anyone used Rawr much to gauge their gear set-up and to find BiS? I just downloaded it the other day and have been pretty impressed with it's layout, but was unsure if it had any issues anyone knew about.
I also have a question about BiS when it comes to item level. Just because it has a higher item level, it doesn't mean that it is the optimal piece for your spec/set-up, correct?
I ask this because I got the RESTO chest piece from Maly 25 ([Tunic of the Artifact Guardian]), and our soon to be shaman class leader was telling me it was BiS for BOTH specs, even though I have full T7.5 ele. It really isn't bad for ele, but I lose haste from the switch. This is also coming someone that has only played Resto and knows nothing about ele stats and builds, as much as she thinks she does.
I see a theoretic max of 6.6k sustained elem dps. How high is this compared to other classes (assuming they also have their dream gear)? I notice mages have insane burst dps but they are always oom in seconds and begging for mana tides. So i think elems win a lot by having so much sustained mana. Anyone know how we compare to other classes?
05/01/09, 12:44 PM
