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05/01/09, 12:44 PM
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#1
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Von Kaiser
Draenei Shaman
Cenarion Circle
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[Elemental] Optimal Gear & Item Discussion
[Elemental] Optimal Gear & Item Discussion
The Elemental 3.1 PTR thread has become an overwhelming thread to sort through, due to the many changes that the 3.1 PTR brought, the bugs 3.1 presented, and it was meant as a discussion for the PTR and the Changes that ensued. This thread is created to be specific for 3.1 Optimal Gear selection and discussion.
This is not intended to be a replacement for Bink's Spreadsheet, Lrdx's Spreadsheet or Rawr:Elemental that will determine personal BiS items, but rather a guideline of what items are available.
Originally Posted by Enthorn
What is Best in Slot?
A best in slot item is an item that, when all other factors have been taken into consideration, provides the highest return for its stats. This doesn't mean then that best in slot is the item with the most stats or the highest ilevel. Just as well, best in slot is occasionally confused with direct upgrades. A direct upgrade is an item that increases your DPS regardless of changes to anything else on your character. Sometimes this is useful information, because it allows a player to quickly guage one item over another, whether in the same slot or not.
However, the end result, and the progression to get there, is what I'm interested in showing. Because of this, best in slot is broken down into each notch on the ladder. A set containing best in slot items will be remarkably different for a person who runs only 10-man Ulduar from one who runs 25-man. It will be different for someone who has 'access' to items that are obtained through Hard-Mode encounters.
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Gems, Enchants, Food Buffs, Elixers and Glyphs will not be covered here, as they are already covered in Binkstein's TTT Shaman: Elemental and Bink's Glyph & Totem Blog Entry.
Many people have problems with BiS lists, as some people are unable to do hard modes, or only run 10 mans, or haven't even stepped foot into Ulduar yet. Some people raid with certain comps and get specific buffs, while others don't. BiS is looked as the end-all be-all of items, and people generally can get upset when their raid cannot meet certain requirements and are unable to obtain the items. Yet, more often than not, people trying to obtain BiS items are min/max'ing, which usually people not in higher end raiding guilds do not try and do.
With the huge onslaught of gear arriving, and the differences between horde and alliance gear, I have removed the BiS listings for now. If we derive a true BiS list, I will update it at that point, but for now, just read the thread and find which set you are looking for.
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"Compendium of Raiding Gear" has moved!
In an effort to make editting easier, and to keep this thread less bulky with all of these links, I have moved the "Compendium of Raiding Gear" to a blog entry.
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Elemental Shaman Tier Sets
Tier 10 Elemental Shaman Set (iLvl 277)
Tier 10 Elemental Shaman Set (iLvl 264)
Tier 10 Elemental Shaman Set (iLvl 251)
Tier 9 Elemental Shaman Set (iLvl 258 - Alliance)
Tier 9 Elemental Shaman Set (iLvl 258 - Horde)
Tier 9 Elemental Shaman Set (iLvl 245 - Alliance)
Tier 9 Elemental Shaman Set (iLvl 245 - Horde)
Tier 9 Elemental Shaman Set (iLvl 232 - Alliance)
Tier 9 Elemental Shaman Set (iLvl 232 - Horde)
Tier 8.5 Elemental Shaman Set (Heroic)
Tier 8 Elemental Shaman Set (Normal)
Tier 7.5 Elemental Shaman Set (Heroic)
Tier 7 Elemental Shaman Set (Normal)
Last edited by Zaythi : 01/03/10 at 2:23 PM.
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05/01/09, 3:25 PM
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#2
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Von Kaiser
Souai
Orc Shaman
No WoW Account
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I'm running these spreadsheet dps calculations as an Orc shaman without considering Bloodfury. The following stats with trinkets averaged using spellpower*uptime and assuming the player uses healing stream totem to maintain IDS during periods of transition in fight that contains 7 minutes of dps time. Everything else is default on Blink's sheet, so there is no demo lock with >2800 spellpower, or other non-default raid buffs. I used a [Rigid Stormjewel] to get to the hit cap, added [Runed Dragon's Eye] to the three most optimal sockets and assumed that the Treads had a socket bonus equal to or weaker than 5 spellpower. I assumed professions were JC and some source of 38 spellpower.
Stamina: 1122
Intellect: 1130
Spellpower: 2626
Haste: 634
Crit: 744
Hit: 289
This estimated the DPS of that gearset to 6615 dps without partial resists.
I used the same raid configuration and gem manipulation for best possible stats with a different set of gear:
[Conqueror's Worldbreaker Helm] with [Chaotic Skyflare Diamond], [Reckless Monarch Topaz] and [Arcanum of Burning Mysteries]
[Pendant of Fiery Havoc] with [Reckless Monarch Topaz]
[Conqueror's Worldbreaker Shoulderpads] with [Runed Scarlet Ruby] and [Greater Inscription of the Storm]
[Drape of Mortal Downfall] with [Reckless Monarch Topaz] and Enchant Cloak - Greater Speed
[Conqueror's Worldbreaker Hauberk] with [Reckless Monarch Topaz], [Runed Dragon's Eye] and Enchant Chest - Powerful Stats
[Bindings of Winter Gale] with [Runed Dragon's Eye] and Enchant Bracers - Superior Spellpower
[Conqueror's Worldbreaker Gloves] with [Runed Scarlet Ruby] and Enchant Gloves - Exceptional Spellpower
[Belt of the Fallen Wyrm] with [Eternal Belt Buckle] and [Runed Scarlet Ruby]
[Leggings of the Enslaved Idol] with [Runed Stormjewel], [Reckless Monarch Topaz], [Runed Dragon's Eye] and [Sapphire Spellthread]
Treads of the False Oracle with [Runed Scarlet Ruby], [Runed Scarlet Ruby], and Enchant Boots - Icewalker
[Signet of Manifested Pain]
[Pyrelight Circle]
[Illustration of the Dragon Soul]
[Flare of the Heavens]
[Soulscribe] with Enchant Weapon - Mighty Spellpower
Wisdom's Hold with [Runed Scarlet Ruby] and Enchant Shield - Greater Intellect
[Totem of Hex]
Stamina: 1147 (+25)
Intellect: 1139 (+9)
Spellpower:2652 (+26)
Haste: 599 (-35)
Crit: 791 (+49)
Hit: 293 (+4, meaningless except that it makes it easier to compensate if you drop Icewalker for Tuskarr's Vitality)
And came up with 6649 dps without partial resists. I don't know what type of BiS list you're shooting for, but I think the highest dps one will include the items above minus the legendary for a mainhand. You added the Treads to the first list, so I assume you're not making a mail-only list or something to spread out loot competition evenly.
The changes from your first BiS list are Resto Conq Helm -> Ele Conq Helm, Ele Conq Legs -> Leggings of the Enslaved Idol, and Frozen Loop -> Pyrelight Circle.
I think Crit may be overvalued slightly at the moment if Blink hasn't updated his spreadsheet to reflect that Electrified can be partially resisted and doesn't proc/contribute damage on LO crits. That might change what's BiS slightly. |
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05/01/09, 6:27 PM
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#3
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Von Kaiser
Draenei Shaman
Cenarion Circle
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That is part of the reason a BiS list is not the greatest thing to have posted. I was able to skip the [Rigid Stormjewel] due to being alliance picking up more SP and haste in its place.
I do agree with your list (even though getting BiS for most of us, especially with the semi lowered DPS from this "bug" we have going around, is going to be a straight pain in the rear). It seems I didn't really take into account a few things, and as stated in the OP, the list will continually change! I also made the major mistake of not doing my calculations with any of the epic gems from the patch, and only using blue quality gems, so our numbers are way off. Once I get home, I will throw those into my spreadsheets and update the list!
Just to double check, you are using Bink's 3.1.0.12 sheet, correct? I just want to make sure I'm on the same page as you!
Edit:
My gear selection is coming out a bit closer then what you had come up with, due to the difference in gems. But, after plugging in all the numbers, it still looks like that set of gear is better then what I have listed. Updated the list. Thanks!
Last edited by Zaythi : 05/01/09 at 9:19 PM.
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05/02/09, 8:14 PM
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#4
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Glass Joe
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05/02/09, 8:46 PM
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#5
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Von Kaiser
Draenei Shaman
Cenarion Circle
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Originally Posted by Zomglazerpew
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I find it kind of sad in the WoW world, when a spirit based item can even be considered as a BiS for Elemental. I did see that, but have not looked at the numbers. It does seem like an interesting possibility. I really wonder what the socket bonus is for it. I would venture to say it would be Spell Power, as that is what most blue sockets come out to, probably in the range of 7-9, which could really end up nice if you used a [Runed Dragon's Eye] to socket it (as the 3rd gem will only gain you 5SP in any of the above gear).
Have you run the numbers on it and came up with anything? |
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05/03/09, 2:32 AM
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#6
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Glass Joe
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Originally Posted by Ghli
I find it kind of sad in the WoW world, when a spirit based item can even be considered as a BiS for Elemental. I did see that, but have not looked at the numbers. It does seem like an interesting possibility. I really wonder what the socket bonus is for it. I would venture to say it would be Spell Power, as that is what most blue sockets come out to, probably in the range of 7-9, which could really end up nice if you used a [Runed Dragon's Eye] to socket it (as the 3rd gem will only gain you 5SP in any of the above gear).
Have you run the numbers on it and came up with anything? |
Well, last tier we had an mp5 weapon being our top. I'm still not surprised.
And from doing a simple EP comparison between the Drape + Soulscribe to the Pennant + Starshard, the latter seems to barely win out (this was assuming no worthwhile socket bonus, treating it as simply another 19 sp from a Runed Scarlet Ruby, with a Reckless in the Drape and a Runed in the Pennant).
IMO it would be a case of whichever you can get your hands on because they are quite close. |
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05/05/09, 6:33 PM
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#9
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Von Kaiser
Draenei Shaman
Cenarion Circle
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Originally Posted by Ezareth
Leggings of the Enslaved Idol should not be gemmed with Runed Dragon's Eye because you'd need two of them to get the bonus since there are no useful yellow gems once hit is capped.
9 spellpower divided by 2 prismatics is a 4.5 SP bonus per prismatic.
I suppose you could put a 9 SP 8 haste yellow though, I'll have to recalculate.
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Ezareth, Running the math on my spreadsheets, using the following setups:
Scenario 1
vs.
Scenario 2
I came up with these figures: Scenario 2 doing approx. 20-30 more DPS than Scenario 1 (using a straight comparison, legs to legs).
The actual DPS gain/loss would be slightly different, raid buffed, and after you account for the 3rd [Runed Dragon's Eye] out of another item making you lose the 5 Spell Power bonus to replace it with a [Runed Scarlet Ruby], but still. You would gain 4 Spell Power from the higher socket bonus, swap [Runed Scarlet Ruby] for [Reckless Monarch Topaz] (swapping gems, I'm showing a 1-2 DPS loss), and it would give you slightly more DPS (in the range of 1-5) then any other possibility. If you are going for min/max, this seems to be the way to gem.
Last edited by Zaythi : 05/06/09 at 1:45 PM.
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05/07/09, 4:18 AM
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#10
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Glass Joe
Tauren Shaman
Quel'Thalas (EU)
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Assuming you are taking the Dragon's Eye out of your bracer and replacing it with +19 spellpower it ends up being 6 SP vs 8 haste. The 8 haste should be a bit better with BiS gear but it's very close to not mattering
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05/07/09, 10:03 AM
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#11
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Von Kaiser
Draenei Shaman
Cenarion Circle
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How are you coming up with 6 SP vs 8 Haste? Socket bonus to Socket bonus, its a 4 SP difference. Then, you would lose 9 SP to regem, but gain 8 haste. So wouldnt the difference be -5 SP and 8 Haste?
[Runed Scarlet Ruby] vs [Reckless Monarch Topaz] = 2 more DPS in favor of the Ruby
Comparing the two socket bonuses, you would need a socket bonus gain of 2 DPS or more to make it worth it to re-gem. While it being a minimal gain, I'm showing a 4ish DPS gain from the socket bonus difference, so an overall gain of 2ish DPS. While yes, it is a minimal gain, we are still talking a gain. As far as BiS list, its best because its higher. If you are obtaining the pieces and have yet to gem any of them, that would be the preferred way, just trying to get maximum DPS gains from every possibility. 2 DPS is 2 DPS.
Edit: If you were to swap a Runed Scarlet Ruby for a Reckless Monarch Topaz, you would need the following Socket Bonus from a yellow gem to make it equal or better:
Socket Bonus:
2 Crit Rating
2 Haste
2 Spell Power
6 Intellect
Last edited by Zaythi : 05/07/09 at 10:16 AM.
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05/07/09, 1:19 PM
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#12
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Glass Joe
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Just to toss this out there, we have another weapon candidate.
Constellus
54 Stamina
55 Intellect
1 blue socket (with 5 sp socket bonus)
587 spell power
29 critical rating
19 mp5
http://static.mmo-champion.com/mmoc/...constellus.jpg
An Algalon weapon that has been assigned to the Hodir Hard mode it appears. Due to equivalent crit and significantly higher spell power, I'd assume this would pull ahead of the Soulscribe, despite the latter's haste. The real question comes down to the Constellus vs Starshard Edge, depending on where else your hit is coming from. I do like that this is only a tiny bit behind the Furious weapon and is much more accessible to me since I don't PvP.
But once again, the top PvE, non legendary elemental weapons come down to spirit or mp5. |
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05/07/09, 7:33 PM
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#13
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Glass Joe
Tauren Shaman
Quel'Thalas (EU)
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Originally Posted by Ghli
How are you coming up with 6 SP vs 8 Haste? Socket bonus to Socket bonus, its a 4 SP difference. Then, you would lose 9 SP to regem, but gain 8 haste. So wouldnt the difference be -5 SP and 8 Haste?
[Runed Scarlet Ruby] vs [Reckless Monarch Topaz] = 2 more DPS in favor of the Ruby
Comparing the two socket bonuses, you would need a socket bonus gain of 2 DPS or more to make it worth it to re-gem. While it being a minimal gain, I'm showing a 4ish DPS gain from the socket bonus difference, so an overall gain of 2ish DPS. While yes, it is a minimal gain, we are still talking a gain. As far as BiS list, its best because its higher. If you are obtaining the pieces and have yet to gem any of them, that would be the preferred way, just trying to get maximum DPS gains from every possibility. 2 DPS is 2 DPS.
Edit: If you were to swap a Runed Scarlet Ruby for a Reckless Monarch Topaz, you would need the following Socket Bonus from a yellow gem to make it equal or better:
Socket Bonus:
2 Crit Rating
2 Haste
2 Spell Power
6 Intellect |
Going from 19spellpower to 9 means you loose 10 spellpower  |
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05/11/09, 3:51 PM
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#15
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Piston Honda
Tauren Shaman
Quel'Thalas (EU)
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Originally Posted by Tehshammy2k9
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No, its actually fairly awful.
Even allowing for the bug to Totem of Hex, which knocks around 10% off its value (this may have been fixed in 3.1 but with the LvB rubbish going on I haven't had time to check) the spell forms such a large part of our rotation that the relic is worth in excess of 100 raw spellpower. Not sure what your point is about elemental oath, as the EO/clearcasting buff adds to all our damage, not any one type more than another.
Also, once you allow for the fact the gladiator's totem will have barely more than 50% uptime, its actually pretty dire. |
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