Kazgrel

I would be (pleasantly) surprised to see [Pulsing Spellshield] make it to live with the new PTR stats. Spell power, haste, armor, and crit are all a wash with [Voice of Reason], but it has 40 more stam despite being ilvl 219 vs. VoR's 226. I would not be surprised to see a good chunk of stamina removed from the Spellshield, but if it isn't, I foresee myself and many others trying to put together some 10 man Ulduar groups in an attempt to pick one up.

As for [Soulscribe] vs. [Aesuga, Hand of the Ardent Champion] (once the latter is buffed), I'd chalk up the comparison of those two to the old mantra of "Whatever drops first".

 

Shadovv

We have the potential to do a lot more than 6.6k, I pulled just over 6.6k last night on Patchwerk and I am far from dream gear. I didn't even have a flask on.

http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/4...1809214757.jpg

 

• Binkenstein

I think 2 minute 33 kills are an example of skewing DPS figures via cooldown use, especially since you have 4pc T8 already

 

MichaelMcDowell

Hey Ghli, thanks for answering my question, managed to read your answer before it got deleted.

You recommended me [Eye of the Broodmother] over [Scale of Fates] (Note: Still speaking of pre hardmode gear so there won't be any [Flare of the Heavens]).

But considering tufy's answer here
and some more explanations he gave me per PM; and the calcs I did with Binky's Spreadsheet, I came to the conclusion that the [Scale of Fates] is better than the [Eye of the Broodmother] (given you know how to handle an on-use trinket).

With decent pre hard mode gear you have about 2300-2350 spellpower unbuffed roughly estimated.

 

◊ Ghli

Well, actually after thinking about it a bit more and looking into it even deeper, I am still showing the Eye slightly higher then the Scale. Given, that is knowing how to handle the on-use part. I am talking very slightly though, to where it almost wouldn't matter, but could depending on gear and/or length of the fight.

With the recent changes to LO, crit is slightly higher than it was before. I cannot look at your armory so I made an assumption, which was my mistake. [Eye of the Broodmother] will be overall more effective with having 4pT8. While on a shorter fight, and without the 4p bonus, the [Scale of Fates] would be more beneficial.

You are effectively looking at the following when comparing these two trinkets:

[Eye of the Broodmother] Crit Rating - 87 125 Spell Power [Scale of Fates] Haste Rating - 72 125 Spell Power

This is assuming a fight that you cannot use the Scale more than once. Without more knowledge of you gear, and your personal setup for raid comp (ie what kind of DPS you have a group to make fights shorter, etc), it will be a personal decision on which trinket would be better for you personally.

 

Borqueak

Hey everyone, glad to see there is a thread on ele haha, just one question. Is there anyone there that has a "Stat Weight Chart", and if they do can you post it? Just trying to help out a friend of mine with what he should gear towards. Thanks in advance/Thanks anyway, good luck guys and keep up the nice work

Are you an angel? Because I have an erection!

 

◊ Ghli

Check out the first post. At the top of the thread, there are a few links given. Specifically:

Bink's Spreadsheet,
Lrdx's Spreadsheet,
Rawr:Elemental

I would pay specific attention to the Bink's sheet, namely the upper right hand corner, where it says something about WoWHead weighted stats, with and without hit. As with most casters though, its really hard to balance out gear by simply using a weight stat chart. Rawr is great for finding specific items with your current gear, showing what is the greatest upgrade. It does not have the perfect stat weights, nor DEP, but it is close and a great tool if you are just learning about upgrading gear and what stats/items would be best.

 

Plaq

If I might add another tool that can help you weighting stats:
Shaman DPS Sim

In combination with a site like Lootrank you should find some of the best upgrades for your setup.

I would like to open a new thread on the tool, but i have not enough posts and after all the work i put into the app over the last weeks i just can't see/test anything shaman related anymore :P

 

• Binkenstein

I'd recommend you go back and test it then. After trying a couple of times I found the settings to be ambiguous (do you set minutes or seconds for fight time) and clunky (who wants to add armor when doing an elemental test?), not to mention the fact that after setting all the options it won't actually start the sim.

 

Plaq

I can see what you mean. Some fields may appear ambiguous, but those fields have a tooltip to clear things up.
I will disable forcing input on the armor field as it is really annoying if you want to test caster rotations.

The whole program is not elemental shaman specific, it is more like a simulation framework. I'm planning to add enhancement soon and maybe even other classes, so some things may look unnecessary if you see it as a pure elemental shaman simulator.

But you managed to start a simulation run, right? What can you say about the numbers it puts out?

 

• Binkenstein

^^^

 

• Binkenstein

There's an almost perfect hit rating combination, but only for Draenei.

Item	Rating
Set Helm	60
Set Chest	60
Set Legs	60
Set Gloves socket bonus	4
Elemental Focus Stone	108
One Green/Orange gem	8
Total	300

This leaves 41 rating to get, which you can get via Frozen Loop, Mortal Downfall, or Fiery Havoc.

 

Plaq

Well I assumed that you found the run menu and managed to press the start button
It is just not a big form where you enter everything and press ok and then it starts computing. You have to create one profile for the character specific data and one for the character unspecific data(like fight duration, boss level, etc.). Once you have one of each, navigate to Run -> Simulation(s), enter number of fights you want to simulate, press Start button and there you go.
When you are done you can export the profiles as a simple string, save it in a text file, and next time you use the sim just import it.

Don't get me wrong, I don't want to force anyone to use the sim, but I think it can be helpful and the numbers should be quite accurate. It would be a pity if no one even tries it just because of the not so clear menu structure(although it is explained on the site).

Sorry for being kind of offtopic, please move or delete the posts if they bother you too much.

 

• Binkenstein

Yes, I did... The start button simply won't start, or show any indication that something is running.

 

Plaq

Oh well I think I know what happened here..may it be that you entered a really big number in fight duration?
It is intended to work this way: fight duration should be something realistic like 5 minutes. When you start a simulation, you can then choose how many fights should be simulated. To get steady results, e.g. 24000 fights a 5 minutes = 2000h. The progress bar moves on as more fights are done.

If I'm wrong I really don't know why it is not working for you, I tested it on many different platforms and with different browsers, never had any trouble.

 

Arakki

I've also got problems with running the simulation. I entered all the fields with values which didn't turn yellow (no clue what I should put at Spec, tried "57/14/0" and "Elemental", you should really put at least some kind of instructions on stuff like this) and after setting the combat parameters with a fight of 300 seconds I went to "Run -> Simulation" with number of fights set to 1. After seeing that the profiles were loaded, I get a small warning sign-like triangle with an exclamation mark at the right-hand side of the area where it probably should be computing. Pressing "Start" does nothing. I tried setting every irrelevant value (Expertise, AP) >0 and it didn't help.

 

Plaq

Hover your mouse over the spec text field. A tooltip will appear that says the string needed has to be in the official wow talent planer format("55300015032133513223013510050500310000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 000").
With a valid string it should run fine. I hope you entered 5 and not 300 in the fight duration field, as it is in minutes

At least I already learnt one thing: never use tooltips on important fields :P

 

Arakki

Okay, then I'm not getting any tooltips with Opera 9.64 (x86) and Sun Java Runtime Environment version 1.6, running Vista x64 SP1. With the corrected talents I was succesful at running the simulation. Also you should consider changing the fight duration to seconds or at least give a possibility of adding times like 5 minutes 20 seconds or such so we could better use the different programs and spreadsheets in conjunction. You know, standardize the inputs in some way.

 

Plaq

Thanks for the information.

I changed the fight duration unit from minutes to seconds and moved most of the tooltips to the text field labels.

 

• Binkenstein

I would recommended setting up some alternative talent system then, as the official talent calculator is clunky and not very usable. Even then, the fact that you required that string was not implied at all in your sim, so I would re-do your UI to make it easier to use.

PS: can someone please remove the mass of Wowhead links at the start of the thread? It's making the reply window load very slowly.

 

◊ Ghli

I will work on taking out all of the Compendium links. It only seems to bother me when editting or anything with the first post, others seem fine. I'd like to at least keep the links, so it will take me a bit to get it all updated. Sorry there were problems.

 

Arakki

From http://elitistjerks.com/f47/t20914-shaman_elemental/

Sets
T8 4PC ~350 DPS
Effectively an 8% multiplicative bonus to Lightning Bolt. Behaves similarly to the Mage talent, Ignite. Remaining damage from the previous dot is added to the new one to tick through (theoretically, this accounts for spells in-flight as well). More information here.

 

broods

Id say its more like 100-200dps for the 4 set.

 

drock903

agreed. i have had the 4 piece for about 3 weeks and have yet see it add 350 dps. i would say 100-200 dps would be fairly accurate.

 

Arakki

It's still above 26 DPS. If you'd like to contest the numbers, please head to the TTT and post your results, everyone's more than happy to have correct info.

On another note, I'm having a bit of a problem which Rawr nor the Spreadsheet were easily able to solve. The BiS gearset puts you effectively at 16,34% spellhaste. Adding 5% from WoA and 3% from Swift Retribution/imp Moonkin Form would put us at 24,34% haste which is dangerously close to a spot where you have to either push one more LB at the cost of LvB or wait the fraction of an LB cast to get a LvB off effectively.

Does this drop out the possibility of gemming with Spellpower/Haste for worthwhile set bonuses as the 8 Haste rating gives out ~0,244% haste?

[Reckless Monarch Topaz] could at least be used on the head, back and chest (on chest to gain the socket bonus in conjuction with a blue gem for the metagem requirement without JC gems and after the JC nerf patch). This would put us at 25,07% haste raidbuffed, which is listed as unhealthy at the TTT: Shaman: Elemental.