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Old 06/19/09, 10:31 AM   #16
OnosKT
Piston Honda
 
Tauren Shaman
 
Kel'Thuzad
I saw this explanation today from GC regarding ghost wolf:

My take on it is that if a Shaman were to get Hamstringed while in caster form, then switched to GW, the snares would cease to affect the shaman but would remain on the shaman. If the shaman were to shift out of GW before the duration of Hamstring has expired, then the effect would still be in place, and the shaman would still be snared in caster form.
That is correct. The idea is that if snared, you can still run away (if you're a caster) or chase someone down (if you're Enhancement), but the ability is still more about movement and not a self-dispel.
Without trying to QQ, I do not see how that helps enhance shamans chase someone. The moment I shift out and say SS I am back to being snared, so we get 1-2 hits for every GW usage.

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Old 06/19/09, 11:12 AM   #17
ChaguraED
Von Kaiser
 
Orc Shaman
 
Emerald Dream
Originally Posted by OnosKT View Post
I saw this explanation today from GC regarding ghost wolf:

Without trying to QQ, I do not see how that helps enhance shamans chase someone. The moment I shift out and say SS I am back to being snared, so we get 1-2 hits for every GW usage.
My Guess would be this is more for the Resto Shaman in PvP than Enhancement. We have feral spirit and earthen power in our reach while currently Restoration and Elemental don't have it so lucky.

If I looked at it from a Enhancement standpoint I'd probably drop earthbind totem or frostshock as soon as I caught up to whomever I'm chasing. Also I find that I'll be chasing someone who's also snared, but there's a 10 yard gap between us I can't close. This may help resolve that.

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Old 06/19/09, 11:26 AM   #18
Malan
Mike Tyson
 
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Malan
Tauren Shaman
 
No WoW Account
Originally Posted by Rouncer View Post
As an aside, Malan and I are normally within a percentage point or two of each other so racials really do seem to matter a lot less then just good play in general.
I just play better than you to make up for lack of useful racials.

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Old 06/19/09, 11:52 AM   #19
Rani
Von Kaiser
 
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Troll Shaman
 
Sporeggar (EU)
Originally Posted by Rouncer View Post
I wonder where trolls fit into that ranking and draenai as well since both of their racials are very strong as well. Tauren could definitely use a bit of love in the racial department for raiding but warstomp is a very powerful racial for PvP already.
Assuming EP values of AP=1, SP=1 and Haste=1.6

Blood Fury:
(Level*4)+2 = Attack power gained.
(Level*2)+3 = Spell damage/healing gained.

So that's 322 AP and 163 SP for 15 seconds every 120 seconds.

(322AP+163SP)*0.125 = 60.625EP


Berserking:
1% haste = 32.79 haste rating

Berserking at full health grants 10% haste which is 327.9 haste rating points for 10 seconds every 180 seconds.

327.9H*10/180 = 29.146EP

Berserking at 70% health will grant 20% haste (58.292EP)
Berserking at 55% health will grant 25% haste (72.865EP)
Berserking at 40% health will grant 30% haste (87.438EP)

Last edited by Rani : 06/21/09 at 8:36 AM.

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Old 06/19/09, 12:15 PM   #20
eduin
Glass Joe
 
Draenei Shaman
 
Bronze Dragonflight (EU)
Originally Posted by Photek View Post
I welcome the 1-minute SR with open arms, goodbye to SF and Imp SS, but I'm pretty much dissapointed with the rogue axe change ;( and the change to orc racial is fucking imba, time to reroll orc =/

Expertise and hit capped wolves will be really overpower. Ghost wolf on PvP from no use to little use, better than nothing and <3 the stomping macros dead. I really hope the health increase stop killing me on hard mode combos in Ulduar.
Err, can you please advise me of a Fist Weapon which is slow and equippable in the offhand from Naxxramas, Eye of Eternity, Obsidian Sanctum, Ulduar on normal or hard modes 10 or 25?

Because without an off hand weapon, you either accept your offhand being uncapped or you have to get 140 Expertise anyway.

Last edited by eduin : 06/19/09 at 12:26 PM.

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Old 06/19/09, 12:16 PM   #21
CommandoXXX
Glass Joe
 
Draenei Shaman
 
Neptulon (EU)
Originally Posted by OnosKT View Post
Without trying to QQ, I do not see how that helps enhance shamans chase someone. The moment I shift out and say SS I am back to being snared, so we get 1-2 hits for every GW usage.
Surely the advantage is that for the time you're in GW form they're not putting additional distance between you and them? Add that to the additional range on shocks (not to mention the recent nerf to Paladin's HoF) and the single-GCD totem drop (with Earthbind) and it seems Shamans have a fair buff against kiters.

Sure, it's not perfect, but a buff is a buff.

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Old 06/19/09, 12:19 PM   #22
Aeolian
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Iyosin
Troll Druid
 
No WoW Account
Originally Posted by eduin View Post
Err, can you please advise me of a Fist Weapon which is slow and equippable in the offhand from Naxxramas, Eye of Eternity, Obsidian Sanctum, Ulduar on normal or hard modes 10 or 25?

Because without an off hand weapon, you either accept your offhand being uncapped or you have to get 140 Expertise anyway.

Regards,
Eduin
Touch of Madness, One-Hand Axe from Ulduar. There aren't any Fist Weapons that can be equipped in the Off-Hand slot, but since the racial applies to both Axes and Fist Weapons, there is no need for it.

[Touch of Madness]

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Old 06/19/09, 12:25 PM   #23
eduin
Glass Joe
 
Draenei Shaman
 
Bronze Dragonflight (EU)
Originally Posted by ChaguraED View Post
My Guess would be this is more for the Resto Shaman in PvP than Enhancement. We have feral spirit and earthen power in our reach while currently Restoration and Elemental don't have it so lucky.

Yes but even for a Resto Shaman the change doesn't look particularly useful. The reason that Druids *work* is because while they are running away they can spam their instant cast HoTs on themselves and shapeshift into a form regardless of GCD. If the Resto Shaman wants to actually heal themselves they can :-

1. Pop a Riptide, exposing themselves to the snare for 1.5 seconds (less haste) till they can cast a new GW
2. Pop a Riptide and LHW, explosing themselves to being spelllocked, standing still for the LHW cast time and being snared for 3.0 seconds (less haste) till they can cast a new GW. I just checked WoWhead and it has Ghost Wolf listed as Nature not Physical so you're gonne get locked out of it on that long, nerfed LHW cast time.

Not to mention that 100% footspeed is not going to actually outrun most opponents. Even if you Frost Shock them, plenty of classes will still be able to continue to melee dps you as you run with or without the help of their partner.

YMMV, but to my mind this does not seem useful to a class with such limited ability to use Instant casts *and* GCD shapeshifting in.

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Old 06/19/09, 12:28 PM   #24
eduin
Glass Joe
 
Draenei Shaman
 
Bronze Dragonflight (EU)
Originally Posted by Aeolian View Post
Touch of Madness, One-Hand Axe from Ulduar. There aren't any Fist Weapons that can be equipped in the Off-Hand slot, but since the racial applies to both Axes and Fist Weapons, there is no need for it.

[Touch of Madness]
Yes clearly, you can still use an axe but that wasn't my point. I'm simply pointing out that the utility is actually quite limited due to the restrictive nature of Fist Weapons.

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Old 06/19/09, 12:45 PM   #25
OnosKT
Piston Honda
 
Tauren Shaman
 
Kel'Thuzad
From GC:

The fist weapon change for orcs was specifically a shaman change since shamans can't use many types of weapons already.
The change basically gives orc enh shamans an easier way to use the racial. As of right in Ulduar we get (useful weapons for us - slow):

3 fist weapons (masticator, golden saronite and the mimiron one (can't remember the name))
2 axes (Yogg 10 man hard and non hard)
1 mace (Vul'mir)

So orc shamans can use 5/6 after patch towards the racial versus 2/6 before patch.

Sorry if I forgot any of the weapons, those are off the top of my head.

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Old 06/19/09, 1:09 PM   #26
Ouktaar
Glass Joe
 
Orc Shaman
 
Fenris
Originally Posted by eduin View Post
Yes clearly, you can still use an axe but that wasn't my point. I'm simply pointing out that the utility is actually quite limited due to the restrictive nature of Fist Weapons.
Prior to this, some shamans were using a fist in their main and an axe in their offhand. They would have needed to cap expertise at the full amount, ignoring their racial, because the bonus only applied to the axe in the offhand. In 3.2, it will apply to both hands allowing the orc to take advantage of the racial.

Axe/Axe is the only option on live. Axe/axe, fist/axe, axe/fist, and fist/fist will all be options with the change. I wouldn't call that sort of change "limited".

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Old 06/19/09, 1:18 PM   #27
Ariik
Glass Joe
 
Draenei Shaman
 
Crushridge
Another upcoming change with 3.2 which may or may not have an impact on us:

/cast Lightning Bolt
/stopcasting
"The intent is that macro will not work in 3.2 (for Ret paladins or Enhancement shamans). The intent is that you have to push the button at the right time, not just have the game push the button for you all the time.

Stopcasting a spell in this manner should reset your swing timer (at least for those two classes). We're not 100% sure at this time how the fix will work, but that's the intent or we would not have made this change."

Source: MMO-Champion BlueTracker - Ret is still faceroll

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Old 06/19/09, 1:30 PM   #28
Rouncer
Deeper Shade of Blue
 
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Orc Shaman
 
Mal'Ganis
Originally Posted by Ariik View Post
Another upcoming change with 3.2 which may or may not have an impact on us:



"The intent is that macro will not work in 3.2 (for Ret paladins or Enhancement shamans). The intent is that you have to push the button at the right time, not just have the game push the button for you all the time.

Stopcasting a spell in this manner should reset your swing timer (at least for those two classes). We're not 100% sure at this time how the fix will work, but that's the intent or we would not have made this change."

Source: MMO-Champion BlueTracker - Ret is still faceroll

The only issue with that is that many shaman liked to macro stopcasting onto their lightning bolt just to prevent lag from making them start a long cast when they were trying to just get a single instant cast to fire. (I still have a macro saved that lets me cast LB with stopcasting by holding alt for dealing with crappy server days).

Hopefully they will just do something like making it so that /stopcasting won't work properly/will reset the swingtimer when used in the same macro as /castrandom or /castsequence.

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Old 06/19/09, 2:00 PM   #29
Nevets_69
Piston Honda
 
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Orc Shaman
 
<TG>
Arthas
Originally Posted by Ariik View Post
Another upcoming change with 3.2 which may or may not have an impact on us:



"The intent is that macro will not work in 3.2 (for Ret paladins or Enhancement shamans). The intent is that you have to push the button at the right time, not just have the game push the button for you all the time.

Stopcasting a spell in this manner should reset your swing timer (at least for those two classes). We're not 100% sure at this time how the fix will work, but that's the intent or we would not have made this change."

Source: MMO-Champion BlueTracker - Ret is still faceroll
This fix won't really change things. If you're still interested in mashing that LB button without starting a long cast you can just jump a split second before you start mashing the button (or be moving or whatever). The end result is the same.

The only thing that is unclear is whether or not this would reset your swing timer, but that's something that's easy to check with a slow 2H and 30s on the target dummy.

Elemental Shaman: You're OOM.
Enhancement Shaman: So are you.

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Old 06/19/09, 2:43 PM   #30
Rouncer
Deeper Shade of Blue
 
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Orc Shaman
 
Mal'Ganis
Originally Posted by Rani View Post
Assuming EP values of AP=1, SP=1 and Haste=1.6

Blood Fury:
(Level*4)+2 = Attack power gained.
(Level*2)+3 = Spell damage/healing gained.

So that's 322 AP and 163 SP for 15 seconds every 120 seconds.

(322AP+163SP)*0.125 = 60.625EP


Berserking:
1% haste = 32.79 haste rating

Berserking at full health grants 10% haste which is 327.9 haste rating points for 10 seconds every 180 seconds.

327.9H*10/180 = 29.146EP

Berserking at 70% health will grant 20% haste (58.292EP)
Berserking at 55% health will grant 25% haste (72.865EP)
Berserking at 40% health will grant 30% haste (87.438EP)
Trolls also get 5% more damage to Beasts which would seem to equal out with Command and Weapon Spec.

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