Maybe using [Masterwork Target Dummy] before the pull might help getting up the stacks (you can get off 3 rank1 earthshocks without killing it)

If you open with FS you only need 2. Good find though.

Why Flame Shock again at all? Get the DoT going, fill the intermediary with ES or FrS on cooldown, whichever offers better DPS, then drop from rotation once stacked.

Stacked in about ~10-12 seconds if I'm doing my mental math right with no loss in FS DPS.

ES has repeatidly been shown to be a dps loss, it has a longer CD (which means it takes longer to stack up) and though I'm not 100% sure on it, I think FS initial hits harder than the ticks (also hits harder than ES last I checked).

The new totem will be great, a solid upgrade from the one we're currently using. Uptime from logs of a few players in a few encounters show an average uptime of about 85% on Electrifying Wind, compared to what should be near 100% of this new one.

I wonder if building the totem up quickly is stronger than letting it come up naturally over time. The estimated loss of damage solely from building up slowly versus quickly using the EP values generated from a reasonably geared ToGC shaman using Simcraft give a rough estimate of 8500 damage difference. If the average lightning bolt now is around 7200 dpsc including average damage from lightning overload and the average shock is 5500 then it seems like building the sucker up as soon as possible is optimal. It's gets a little tricky because you're moving your next spell line back 0.3 seconds which could hurt or help the timing of your following lava burst. It's really hard to tell how that depression will play out, though the worst case would put it as equal to a slow buildup and the best seems to drive it to make the beneficial amount around 14k or a full lava burst.

So the bottom line to me, from my stupid napkin math, is that doing it as soon as possible with frost shock will be better or equal to a slow buildup 99% of the time, and have a benefit range from 0 damage to 13,600 damage.

If you're a complete min/max player the targeting dummy thing would obviously provide the full benefit without any cycling compromises.

Edit: You would clearly use FrS if able and ES if not, rewriting flame shock automatically averages to a loss of 430 damage from resetting the tick duration and it only lands for an average of 3000 without subtracting that anyway. Booming Echoes clearly puts FrS in front of ES, the only downside being the extra threat component.

I use FrS when I haven't got enought time to cast another LB or LvB or to make work [Talisman of Volatile Power] and it only adds 3% extra thread. IMO being elemental aggro never seems to be a problem.

There is no reason to continue to use Frost Shocks in your rotation once the totem is already stacked, unless for some reason you drop the stack.

yes so drop the FrS on the third section. the rotation i wrote there was slightly flawed. exchanging the FS for a LB will set the timer off though and will go over the timer to allow for a LvB to go off right when FS goes off to be reapplied.

revised to FS>LB>LB>Frostshock>LB>LvB>LB>LB>LB>LB>LvB but only works with the proper amount of haste

I think the ideal opener will be something like FS > LvB > LB > LB > FrS > LB > LB > LvB > FrS

With all the 3 stacks, you can continue your own rotation method with only refreshing your FS timer. There is no need to cast FrS if you already got all the 3 stacks, counting with the 30 sec duration of the new totem buff.

Has anyone done any math for what happens when we start climbing over 1049 haste rating with the new totem? It's the point where haste for instants and 1.5 second casts (chain lightning, lava burst) hit the GCD cap. I've heard rumors that depressions below the gcd for non-instants don't allow for the use of the 0.3 sec spell queue, but I haven't seen any tests done with rigor. My current optimal gear for ToGC puts me at 1002 haste, so it's extremely likely we'll be marching into that territory with Icecrown.

Blink's spreadsheet blows up at 1267 haste and I don't know enough about simcraft to know if it models things right. When I ran it with the T9_258_ToW profile + 200 more haste it tossed out:

Shaman_T9_57_14_00_258_ToW Int=0.39 SP=1.78 Hit=0.27 Crit=1.32 Haste=0.62 Lag=0.00

Spell Stats: power=3798|3073(3073) hit=11.09%|11.09%(291) crit=37.88%|31.27%(718) penetration=0|0(0) haste=45.19%|34.25%(1123) mp5=229|197

If this is at all accurate we may have to gear around a second stat cap and have some very ugly gearing decisions to make in Icecrown.

Thank you. I was wondering about this... the FS didn't make sense to me after u stacked it up. You just have to juggle it into the rotation to keep stacks on.

doesnt the totem buff have a 15 second timer? where are you getting 30 seconds?

Edit:didnt read the totem change. ghostcrawler's post changes alot of what ive previously stated

Everyone seems to love the idea of incorporating FrS into our rotation with the new totem that's coming out, but I've always been a bit more skeptical about it. I decided to do some calculations and figure out what was best. Keep in mind I suck at Exel, but I'm decent at math, so I the calculations by hand >.< (It took a lot longer than it should have, but I made sure that all my numbers were right).

Basically what I did was calculate the average damage and cast time of each spell at each level of haste (73, 146, 219) assuming hit cap with my gear (3520 SP, 907 haste before totem, 588 crit rating), then I modeled rotations using each of the following three possibilities.
These were the 3 basic rotations that I modeled:
1) No FrS
2) 1 FrS between FSs
3) FrS on CD until 3 stack

The first one is simply letting FS stack up the totem's haste buff naturally. The second is using a single FrS to get the second stack up, and letting FS get the first and third. The third rotation used FrS on cooldown until a 3 stack was up, then continued normally. All of these rotations discontinue the use of FrS after the 3-stack has been established.

Over a 5 minute fight, these were the dps values (excluding FS damage, since the damage from FS would be more or less static regardless of the rotation used):
1) No FrS: 6765.2 dps
2) 1 FrS: 6750.3 dps
3) 2 FrS: 6748.1 dps

Conclusions:
When incorporating FrS into the rotation, you have to sacrifice LB or CL, both of which can proc Lightning Overload, have a higher crit chance from talents, and a better coefficient. Since these spells have a vastly better DPSC, there is a huge dps loss (on the order of +250 in the first 18 seconds) that results from incorporating it into your rotation. Over time, the haste will slowly gain back the lost dps, but you don't see any returns (or even breaking even) at all on a 5-minute fight. A fight would have to be significantly longer for it to be even considerable to do this. However, on short fights the ToEW might be superior, because of the stacking time.

In short, don't use FrS.
PS - I kept my calculations for future reference, but didn't want to post a wall of text.

im curious if the new totem thingy is even gonna matter to us as an elemental/resto shammy i only use ToW when im deeps. But if anyone has and tips let me know

About the new totem, I wonder if the buff it provide would stack with the one provided by electrifying one. Since the new one is 30s and procs 100%, it might be possible (not talking about being worth it yet) to lose 2 GCDs every 30s for putting this new totem on, shocking to refresh, and putting electrifying wind totem back on.

We're better off than Boomkin at least, because while LvB and CL may be 1.5 seconds, at least LB isn't. As a result, the cap for haste probably won't be that hard, since it's still helping the spell we cast most often.

It's also possible that the developers will nerf crit and/or haste in 3.3 like they've done for Dodge and ArPen. That would increase the ratio of haste rating to haste percent. We're not the only class eyeing the haste soft cap, and crit scaling is a problem for others. That's not something to count on at all, but it's possible we'll see a change like that to balance out the hard-mode-induced item-level-inflation.

All of this just makes me anticipate Reforging in Cataclysm more and more. Operating with a hit cap and a haste soft cap in ICC will be a challenge.

They're different buffs, so as long as the buff stays up when you unequip the totem, it's possible.

That said, 2 GCDs every 30 seconds at haste soft cap (1 sec GCDs) is like a 6% DPS loss, and it's a bigger loss the lower your haste. For it to be worth it, 200 haste (assuming 100% ToEW uptime) would have to be a 6% DPS boost

My mistake then. I was only going on knowing that people had previously (3.1 or 3.2) been discussing Libram swapping on Ret Paladins.

Finally, a good mail craftable for elemental shaman..

Lightning-infused Leggings have been given stats in the latest build. A LW recipe which requires revered with the Ashen Verdict.

Stats:
123 stam
123 int
162 spellpower
92 crit
100 haste
3 sockets (1 of each colour)
+9 sp socket bonus

Item level is 264, and it's a pure upgrade from the anub heroic leather legs (Same stat distribution, just more of each)
VS T9 heroic, it has haste instead of hit, and an extra socket.

Mats:
20 Icy Dragonscale
8 Arctic Fur
16 Eternal Air
8 Primordial Saronite (New version of crusader's orbs, i guess)

Let's hope the other datamined craftables include an item as good as this.. Earthsoul Boots are a good candidate, as they use the same mats.

Source.

It always surprises me when they buff Lava Burst's damage because of the reserve expressed about giving any class too much burst which might carry over unfavourably into PvP. One assumes this PTR change is to prevent using high ilevel 4t9 (which will be easier to obtain in tier 10 quality gear) with Icecrown stuff for massive LvB crits. Instead we get a DoT reminiscent of 4t8's Electrified for LB.

I always thought Tier 8's set bonuses were really fun as well as being a nice addition to our DPS, so I like this potential change. Hopefully the DPS value will be equivalent to the current bonus.

[e] Updated tooltip from MMO-Champion reads:
Set: Your Lava Burst spell causes your target to burn for an additonal 20% of your spell's damage over 6 sec.

So it's precisely equivalent, just over 6 seconds instead of frontloaded with the spell.

removed because the person's post above mine now magically contains the same info

Real question about if this is a DPS increase is in where the 20% is calculated into the LvB dps currently.

At a glance it seems like a nerf to me. 20% damage instantly or over 6seconds, I am pretty sure anyone would take instant if given the option. Same amount of damage, yet the dot in some cases might not tick to its full duration, so damage is lost.

If the dot is 6 seconds, and the cooldown on LvB is 8 seconds. I find it hard to find where the dot would get overwritten. In the case that some magical new set/totem/funny bonus we do overwrite it, I can see them doing the same thing as they did with ignite/4pt8 where it makes sure you don't lose the dmg from it procing often.