Elitist Jerks
Register
Blogs
Forums


Go Back   Elitist Jerks » Class Mechanics » Warlocks

Closed Thread
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 10/28/10, 1:35 PM   #241
pfooti
Von Kaiser
 
pfooti's Avatar
 
Gnome Rogue
 
Wyrmrest Accord
That's sort of a simcraft scaling factor question for your particular setup. Keep in mind that a lot of the benefit you'd gain from moving a few spellpower around would likely get lost in the statistical noise anyway.

Another option (one I'm partial to) is reforging for Mastery. If you keep filling your sockets with correct colors, you can reforge your over-cap stats into Mastery, which is often a decent stat as well, giving you the benefits of the socket bonus without the drawbacks. Of course, if (socket bonus + reforged mastery) < (10 int) then that's not a good choice.

http://www.castrandom.com - we're not sure what it's about either.

Offline
Old 10/28/10, 5:33 PM   #242
Bahlshaab
Glass Joe
 
Bahlshaab's Avatar
 
Undead Warlock
 
Steamwheedle Cartel
For [Design: Brilliant Cardinal Ruby] versus [Reckless Ametrine] in a yellow socket, if I'm not missing Int multipliers (5% raid buff accounted for) the scale factors from the SimC OP give:

 DPS from Gems  Min SP Socket Bonus Required
 RubyAmetrine  
Affl92.584877.0004 4.8793 --> 5
Affl_Drain93.235876.4929 5.1293 --> 7
Demo80.560265.4491 5.9799 --> 7
Destro97.393863.1779 10.7584 --> n/a

For this case, keeping the socket bonuses and reforging haste for mastery looks like a straight win for Affl_Drain spec (which has a fairly high scale factor for Mastery) but is dependent on the magnitude of socket bonuses for the other specs.

This is, of course, if your profile matches closely the applicable SimC profile.

Offline
Old 10/28/10, 7:42 PM   #243
SoterioN
Glass Joe
 
Undead Warlock
 
Zul'Jin
I'm sorry if I missed this - did simulations confirm that Glyph of Imp > Glyph of Incin for Destruction spec?

Offline
Old 10/30/10, 3:34 AM   #244
Jmickey
<3 Kitty
 
Jmickey's Avatar
 
Blood Elf Warlock
 
Saurfang
Originally Posted by Asthor View Post
Did some calculating for haste needed to make Dark Arts points optional due to the imp gcd bug.

Haste rating needed for 1.5 sec firebolt with Mind Quickening
Haste ratingDark Arts points
19250
14051
8852
3643

With the haste rating above along with the talent points in Dark Arts associated with it, the imp has the closest cast time to 1.5 as possible.
Was testing this today, and it seems to me like the Imp's GCD is now scaling with your haste? Seemed to be sitting at 1 sec (or less than the cast time of a 1.4 sec firebolt) for me since 4.0.1a.

Edit: I didn't do any extensive testing and didn't properly take into account my lag (300ms), So I'm probably wrong in my above assumption.

Last edited by Jmickey : 10/30/10 at 2:07 PM.

Offline
Old 10/30/10, 10:44 AM   #245
angaroth
Piston Honda
 
Undead Warlock
 
Twisting Nether
For any claims as to pet/guardian cast times - can you please provide links to logs to verify the timings. Tooltips lie.

Canada Offline
Old 10/30/10, 1:40 PM   #246
Chthonios
Glass Joe
 
Human Warlock
 
Darkmoon Faire (EU)
I'm not sure if any demonology macro tips have been posted, but ill give the ones I use, great for solo or dungeon/raid play

button 1 (press it 4 times at the start of a boss fight, refresh as needed. once or twice on solo crap. note how the shorter durations are at the front, given that hand of gul'dan can refresh immolate)
#showtooltip
/petattack
/castsequence reset=target/4 corruption, immolate, bane of doom, curse of the elements
/cast metamorphosis
/use 13
/use 14

button 2
if your destro talents include shadow bolt 'haste' talent, then just use 'Hand of Gul'dan'
if your destro talents are incinerate based then :- (press twice at the start or to refresh shadow bolt debuff, otherwise once)
#showtooltip
/castsequence reset=4 hand of gul'dan, shadow bolt
/cast axe toss
/cast felstorm
/cast metamorphosis
/use 13
/use 14

button 3
Basically incinerate or shadow bolt, your filler. I'll show the incinerate macro to give you an idea
#showtooltip
/cast incinerate
/cast axe toss
/cast felstorm
/cast metamorphosis
/use 13
/use 14

button 4 (execute)
/cast soulburn
/cast soul fire
/cast axe toss
/cast felstorm
/cast metamorphosis
/use 13
/use 14

on button 5 you can happily bung Life Tap.

Hope thats of help to someone.

note that I also macro shadowflame an immo aura together, since i generally use them together, ie
#showtooltip
/castsequence reset=10 shadowflame, immolation aura

Thus if metamorph is not up you just press it once, if meta is up, press it twice. easy peasy.

Last edited by Chthonios : 10/30/10 at 1:46 PM.

Offline
Old 10/30/10, 5:12 PM   #247
matornot
Von Kaiser
 
matornot's Avatar
 
Gnome Warlock
 
Hydraxis
Originally Posted by angaroth View Post
For any claims as to pet/guardian cast times - can you please provide links to logs to verify the timings. Tooltips lie.
Tooltips don't lie, people just misinterpret them. The imp's Firebolt can be shortened under 1.5 sec, but his GCD cannot. Unfortunately, there is no tooltip that accurately shows GCD if you're past the cap.

I can confirm that the Imp is still GCD locked at 1.5 sec, as is the Succy.

Offline
Old 11/01/10, 1:12 AM   #248
Kyngston
Glass Joe
 
Gnome Warlock
 
Icecrown
Originally Posted by Chthonios View Post
I'm not sure if any demonology macro tips have been posted, but ill give the ones I use, great for solo or dungeon/raid play
Folks trying to min/max their dps will never reach the full potential of their gear by using /castsequence macros. Your dots and cooldowns have different timers, meaning that after the opening rotation, your cast rotation will almost never match your /castsequence macro. In addition attaching Meta to your filler spells, disregards the opportunities to stack your Meta with procs, bloodlust or decimate.

It's fine for one-button, mindless casual play, but if you're reading these forums on theorycrafting data to squeeze every bit of dps from your gear, you should really avoid /castsequence macros.

In addition, the reset condition in your macros, do not work like how most people try to use it. The reset timer is from the last time you called the macro. It is not a timer from the start of the rotation. This means your cooldowns will not actually match your macro reset timer conditions. see MACRO castsequence - WoWWiki - Your guide to the World of Warcraft.

I think the only /castsequence macro I used when I was demo (3.3.5), was an aoe trash macro, that chained meta, charge, immolate. As destro, I don't have any /castsequence macros.

I do use macros like:
#showtooltip
/cast [nomod] Soulburn
/cast Soul Fire
Which allow me to cast a SB:SF when Soulburn is off CD, or just SF when my imp procs.

And generic multi-purpose filler macros like:
#showtooltip [mod] Chaos Bolt; Incinerate
/use 10
/cast [mod] Chaos Bolt; Incinerate
/cast [@pettarget,exists] Firebolt

But in general macros which attempt to auto-select your spell are going to lower your dps.

Last edited by Kyngston : 11/04/10 at 4:56 PM.

Offline
Old 11/01/10, 3:18 AM   #249
vo1os
Banned
 
Human Warlock
 
Черный Шрам (EU)
"/cast [@pettarget,exists] Firebolt"
Seems to be useless.
Tested 10 min fight with dummy: clear fight and macros+autoclicker. Same amounts of firebolts both.
Conditions: I made a 1.6 sec firebolt cast.

Macros for preSB. Usable as SB button while combat and running. Usable as Harvest button as out of combat + standing:

#showtooltip Soulburn
/cast Soulburn
/cast Soul Harvest

Last edited by vo1os : 11/01/10 at 9:16 AM.

Offline
Old 11/01/10, 10:21 AM   #250
Warlocomotif
Don Flamenco
 
Warlocomotif's Avatar
 
Human Warlock
 
Emerald Dream (EU)
Firebolt is 1 word, I tested it twice- the benefit seems minimal but I can push the cast interval back down to roughly 1.53s when constantly spamming the firebolt macro (and nothing else at all, full time spamming Firebolt). Where-as normally it's at about 1.6s. I'll try retest this tonight to be sure.

The mind is like a parachute. It works best when it's open.

Offline
Old 11/01/10, 1:50 PM   #251
vo1os
Banned
 
Human Warlock
 
Черный Шрам (EU)
Originally Posted by Warlocomotif View Post
Firebolt is 1 word
Yeah, just copied from the post before mine. Macros has a notable animation on imp's FB. I'm testing on RU servers, so the macros differs a bit.

Tested once again:

1 try. Just the imp and the dummy, naked warlock 1 dark arts talent (tooltip shows 2.25 sec cast):
186(H)+50(M)+11(C)=247 firebolts cast
600sec/247=2.429 sec avg cast

2 try. With macros+autoclicker delay 300ms(3.33 hits/sec). Same parameters as 1 try:
192+41+15=248 firebolts cast
600sec/248=2.419 sec avg cast

+/- 1 cast error in calculations

Seems like same with/without macros ((
Ooooh and 2.429-2.25=0.179 cast delay is a huge loss. Sad.

Offline
Old 11/02/10, 12:43 PM   #252
matornot
Von Kaiser
 
matornot's Avatar
 
Gnome Warlock
 
Hydraxis
Originally Posted by vo1os View Post
1 try. Just the imp and the dummy, naked warlock 1 dark arts talent (tooltip shows 2.25 sec cast):
186(H)+50(M)+11(C)=247 firebolts cast
600sec/247=2.429 sec avg cast

2 try. With macros+autoclicker delay 300ms(3.33 hits/sec). Same parameters as 1 try:
192+41+15=248 firebolts cast
600sec/248=2.419 sec avg cast

Seems like same with/without macros ((
Ooooh and 2.429-2.25=0.179 cast delay is a huge loss. Sad.
Since your pets' spells can't be queued up like your own spells can, the effectiveness of the macro relies largely on the rapidity of your clicking. The macro will do nothing if your imp finishes a cast then starts casting again between two clicks of the macro. Your autoclicker leaves 0.3 sec between clicks, which isn't very helpful when your imp's pause is only 0.179 sec. i.e. the lower your latency, the more rapidly you must click to make the Firebolt macro effective. Personally, I spam my buttons about 4-5 times per second, and closer to 6-7 times per second when I really get aggressive, and I like to think (or hope) that most players spam at about 4-5 hits per second.

Here are my results from a few dummy fights:

Tooltip says 1.75 sec, 0/3 Dark Arts
 Fight Length# of CastsCast+PausePause Time
No Macro194s812.383s0.633s
w/ Macro193s1071.804s0.054s

Tooltip says 1.51 sec, 3/3 Dark Arts
 Fight Length# of CastsCast+PausePause Time
No Macro300s1871.600s0.090s
w/ Macro300s1901.579s0.089s

Tooltip says 1.24 sec, 3/3 Dark Arts
 Fight Length# of CastsCast+PausePause TimePause After GCD
No Macro194s1221.590s0.350s0.090s
w/ Macro193s1211.595s0.355s0.095s

The first table shows a huge gap when not spamming the macro, which works out to about 39% of the imp's potential DPS being lost to lag. The second table shows an imp just short of the GCD cap, and the third is well past the GCD cap. Curiously, the latter two imps don't seem to be very much affected by lag while the first one is devastated by it. Does anyone know why this might be? Something to do with Dark Arts perhaps?

Offline
Old 11/03/10, 8:27 AM   #253
vo1os
Banned
 
Human Warlock
 
Черный Шрам (EU)
Originally Posted by matornot View Post
Tooltip says 1.75 sec, 0/3 Dark Arts
 Fight Length# of CastsCast+PausePause Time
No Macro194s812.383s0.633s
w/ Macro193s1071.804s0.054s
mistake in test?

Last edited by vo1os : 11/03/10 at 9:23 AM.

Offline
Old 11/03/10, 10:03 AM   #254
matornot
Von Kaiser
 
matornot's Avatar
 
Gnome Warlock
 
Hydraxis
Originally Posted by vo1os View Post
mistake in test?
No, I tested more times but I didn't really want to make that post any bigger. A guildie of mine seems to think it has something to do with the imp's cast animation, where he wants to finish his little jump before starting his next cast, but then why does he cast just fine when his cast time is closer to 1.5? As I said, it could have something to do with Dark Arts, which shouldn't be an issue for any spec that uses the imp anyway. The main point of that post is that the macro does indeed make a difference, though less of a difference closer to 1.5 sec, depending on how fast you're spamming the macro.

Last edited by matornot : 11/03/10 at 10:10 AM.

Offline
Old 11/09/10, 6:18 PM   #255
Redlock
Glass Joe
 
Blood Elf Warlock
 
Turalyon
I've been meaning to test for the possibility that this discrepency is caused by the firebolt being in flight causing the imp to pause before the next cast. Having the imp "move to" melee range of the target might allow him to chain-cast a bit faster. I'll have time later this week to follow up.

Offline
Closed Thread

Go Back   Elitist Jerks » Class Mechanics » Warlocks

Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Balance Raiding in Cataclysm Hamlet Druids 573 10/14/10 9:47 PM