Mists of Pandaria: All Specs - Page 5

krilz · 02/17/12, 9:23 AM

Originally Posted by Keldion

I don't see Auto Wand functioning any differently than Auto Attack. Allowing Destruction to wand DPS while casting their spells is essentially restricting that spec to wands, and it also encroaches heavily upon hunter gameplay.

If I remember correctly, Blizzard talked about getting rid of the ranged slot for everyone besides hunters (and hunters subsequently getting rid off their melee slot) and instead converting wands to main hands.

This is nice since it was just a minor "stat slot" but it does force som awkward gameplay of casters switching between melee and ranged weapons (although I doubt that we'll ever resort to those).

Xayide · 02/20/12, 4:47 PM

Originally Posted by krilz

If I remember correctly, Blizzard talked about getting rid of the ranged slot for everyone besides hunters (and hunters subsequently getting rid off their melee slot) and instead converting wands to main hands.

This is nice since it was just a minor "stat slot" but it does force som awkward gameplay of casters switching between melee and ranged weapons (although I doubt that we'll ever resort to those).

I think what he means is that Auto-wand could be the equivalent of auto-shot for hunters, i.e. we'd be shooting our wand as Destro WHILE we are casting.
And wands being a main-hand weapon just like swords and daggers, Destro would be required to use wands only, no staves, swords or daggers.

I'm sure it's an error in the calculator though... It would be really awkward to cow one of our specs to a single weapon type like that. The only specs that are like this currently in the game are Assassination and Subtlety, but I guess that works for rogues. It definitely wouldn't for any caster.

dhrakho · 02/20/12, 11:04 PM

I think what he means is that Auto-wand could be the equivalent of auto-shot for hunters, i.e. we'd be shooting our wand as Destro WHILE we are casting.
And wands being a main-hand weapon just like swords and daggers, Destro would be required to use wands only, no staves, swords or daggers.

I'm sure it's an error in the calculator though... It would be really awkward to cow one of our specs to a single weapon type like that. The only specs that are like this currently in the game are Assassination and Subtlety, but I guess that works for rogues. It definitely wouldn't for any caster.

you can also see it as if we are the only casters that requried a wand, and only dest spec has that. then for me im the only destro lock in my guild maybe wands ill be priority since im the only one that requires using it for dps. they will have the same stats as a 1her, hope they don't make 2h wands, so it might not be so bad

Seiru · 02/21/12, 11:36 PM

Super interesting new info about destro in MoP:

Question: How does Destruction’s Ember system work?

Answer: Basically, you build embers with some spells, and then spend those embers with Soul Fire, Ember Tap, or Fire and Brimstone.

Internally, this is how it works:

Immolate – DD + DoT on the target
Incinerate – generates 1/10th ember, or 2/10ths if it crits an immolated target.
Fel Flame – generates 1/10th ember, or 2/10ths if it crits an immolated target.
Conflagrate – triggers Backdraft and has a 12 second cooldown.

Soul Fire – consumes one ember instead of mana.
Fire and Brimstone – costs 1 ember and has no cooldown.
Ember Tap – costs 1 embers.

Each full ember costs 0.33% of your maximum health per second. If you stay below 1 ember, you take no damage.

Question: How does chaotic energy work?
Answer: We are experimenting with a resource-driven, rather than time-limited, caster model on the Destruction warlock.

In a nutshell, Destruction warlocks are not GCD locked. In fact, chain-casting spells as a Destruction warlock is less important than spending all of your resources.

Keep in mind this is all subject to change, but here is how Destruction flows at the moment:

• Start of Fight: Full mana bar, Empty Ember bar

1. Immolate the target
2. Conflagrate to trigger emberstorm
3. Incinerate to generate embers
4. Continue until you are low on mana

• Middle of Fight: Empty mana bar, ~2 Embers

1. Soul Fire
2. Soul Fire
3. Mana bar is mostly full (Soul Fire costs embers, so your mana refills during the Soul Fires)

In addition to increasing your base mana regen, Chaotic Energy increases mana regen even more with Haste. This means the ability to cast spells scales smoothly with gear.

As long as the warlock never lets her mana bar fill up and burn her embers, she's maximizing damage. This is very different from the standard caster model where priority is placed on casting at all times and ordering spells based on cooldown.

Our hope is that the Destruction Warlock will attract players who are interested in a playstyle that rewards spending resources at the right time, rather than constantly casting.

Question: How does Destruction’s Mastery work?

Answer: Emberstorm increases the effectiveness of all Ember consuming spells. Soul Fire deals more damage. Fire & Brimstone deals a higher % of the base spell’s damage. Ember Tap heals for more.

Sources:
February 15 Update to Mists Talent Calculator - Forums - World of Warcraft
February 15 Update to Mists Talent Calculator - Forums - World of Warcraft
February 15 Update to Mists Talent Calculator - Forums - World of Warcraft

Sounds really interesting, I'm wondering exactly why it wouldn't be most efficient to just use Soul Fire etc whenever you can instead of holding onto your embers (which is what it sounds like they intend).

Minifridge · 02/22/12, 1:41 AM

Yeah, from the information they gave it seems to me like Incinerate to one ember -> soul fire, repeat, would be the same as emptying your mana bar and hoarding embers. It also makes no sense to me from this that 'constantly casting' is inconsequential to DPS, or less important.

krilz · 02/22/12, 8:10 AM

It's not mentioned specifically but I'm wondering what they mean by "Soul Fire costs embers, so your mana refills during the Soul Fires". I couldn't find any information on Soul Fire replenishing your mana so I'm not sure quite how this works. There is Chaotic Energy but it's weirdly worded how exactly it works. If it really is powerful enough to regen your mana during two Soul Fire casts, then you should never run of out mana to begin with.

Nonetheless, it sounds just like a new version of combat points/holy power. You have "chargers", which in this case is Incinerate and "finishers" which is Soul Fire. However, the rotation system they pointed out is flawed in it's current state since Soul Fire's cast time is doubled for 30 sec if it hits a target which is above 25%. Therefor the rotation mentioned by Minifridge sounds more plausible.

Nfariessence · 02/22/12, 8:38 AM

If only warlocks had a way to regenerate mana...

So, based upon the information we know currently, we're supposed to cast a 4 or 8 second nuke to regen our mana? Whereas in MoP, Life Tap is showing 20% mana return for a single GCD - which means you could fill your full mana pool in 7.5 seconds, while on the run.

While Destruction was the tree I was most excited about initially in MoP, this new concept sounds incredibly underwhelming.

Warlocks are now going to have 3 resources to manage: Mana, Health, and Burning Embers.
Our base rotation isn't changing much (keep Immo up, Conflag on cooldown, and Incinerate as filler),
Now we have to juggle a stacking self DoT effect,
Our mastery will be benefiting exactly 1 spell (the DPET of Fel Flame is 1/2 of Incinerate, meaning you'll never cast it unless you're moving) which will now cast 33%-166% slower, and also has 1/2 the DPET of Incinerate...
The neatest ability we gain as the spec (Fire and Brimstone) has no 'cooldown', but instead requires a resource that we will accumulate every 20 seconds, and causes our spells to hit for 55% less in exchange for splash damage.

Either they're not being very clear on how the spec will work, they have entirely wrong placeholder numbers on the calculator, they haven't dropped the other shoe on class redesign yet (lolwarlocktank), or they've got a lot of overhauling to do. Consider my enthusiasm from post # 51 above mollified at this point :/

Randomklng · 02/22/12, 5:25 PM

Originally Posted by Nfariessence

So, based upon the information we know currently, we're supposed to cast a 4 or 8 second nuke to regen our mana? Whereas in MoP, Life Tap is showing 20% mana return for a single GCD - which means you could fill your full mana pool in 7.5 seconds, while on the run.

Don't forget about Destructive Influence. This should reduce the cast time of soul fire substantially while we are generating embers.

Nfariessence · 02/22/12, 9:33 PM

Originally Posted by Randomklng

Don't forget about Destructive Influence. This should reduce the cast time of soul fire substantially while we are generating embers.

Unless you have sacrificed your pet for 15% more personal damage that is...

Keldion · 02/22/12, 11:16 PM

Originally Posted by Randomklng

Don't forget about Destructive Influence. This should reduce the cast time of soul fire substantially while we are generating embers.

As of right now, both Destructive Influence and the Soul Fire/Decimation tooltip subvert the ability for Destruction to dump Embers with consecutive Soul Fires. Influence's subversion is implicit, awarding a significant cast time reduction only to the first Soul Fire cast in a series.

AlexanderYoshi · 02/23/12, 3:15 PM

I'm just gonna spare you guys the trouble:

Soul fire does NOT increase in cast-time for Destruction. Look at Shadow Bolt level 1 - they CLEARLY only ran the talent calculator tooltip generator using a Demonology Warlock.

None of the other specs would care about Demonic Fury...

whi · 03/22/12, 5:06 AM

Looks like mmoc's wowdb has some(all?) new/changed glyphs up already. Didn't list the ones that got deleted(or so it seems -- like felhunter, haunt or meta) or the ones that I could've missed while going through it all, obviously:

Glyph of Burning Embers - Spells - WOWDB - Increases your maximum Burning Embers by 1.
Glyph of Conflagrate - Spells - WOWDB - Reduces the movement speed reduction of Conflagrate to 100% and increases the duration by 100%.
Glyph of Curse of Exhaustion - Spells - WOWDB - Curse of Exhaustion now reduces the targets movement speed by ((30+40)*-1)%, lasts half as long and has a 20 second cooldown.
Glyph of Demon Hunting - Spells - WOWDB - Demonic Fury now reduces damage taken instead of increasing damage dealt. In addition, while using Metamorphosis, Soulshatter taunts your target, Twilight Ward will absorb all schools of damage and Demonic Slash is shorter range and generates fury.
Glyph of Eye of Kilrogg - Spells - WOWDB - Your Eye of Kilrogg is no longer stealthed and can now place your Demonic Circle. + Old effect.
Glyph of Felguard - Spells - WOWDB - Your Felguard will equip a random two-handed axe, sword or polearm from your backpack
Glyph of Healthstone - Spells - WOWDB - You receive 100% more healing from using a healthstone, but the health is restored over 10 sec.
Glyph of Shadow Bolt - Spells - WOWDB - Splits your Shadow Bolt into three smaller attacks.
Glyph of Shadowflame - Spells - WOWDB - Your Shadowflame also applies a 70% movement speed slow to its victims, but Metamorphosis no longer reduces the duration of Stuns or Snares.
Glyph of Soul Shards - Spells - WOWDB - Increases your maximum Soul Shards by 1.
Glyph of Unstable Affliction - Spells - WOWDB - When Unstable Affliction is removed, it instantly deals critical damage to both the target and the dispeller, but no longer silences.

Edit:
Aww, missed this little guy here:
Glyph of Demon Training - Spells - WOWDB - Improves your demon's special abilities:
- Reduces your Imp's Firebolt cast time by 50%.
- Increases your Voidwalker's total health by 20%.
- Your Succubus's Seduction ability also removes all damage over time effects from the target.
- When your Felhunter uses Devour Magic, you will also be healed for that amount.
- Increases the number of targets hit by your Felguard's Legion Strike by 1.

2 more:
Glyph of Nightmares - Spells - WOWDB - Your Felsteed and Dreadsteed can cross water while running and leave a trail of flames.
Glyph of Carrion Swarm - Spells - WOWDB - Your Carrion Swarm no longer knocks targets back.

Nehrak · 03/22/12, 8:50 AM

Went digging through wowhead's Pandaria data and found some interesting abilities by accident. Not being a tester, I can't say if these are live or what have you; datamining is still largely incomplete just by looking at core class ability lists. Still, this could be promising for pets:

Command Demon
Commands your demon to perform its most powerful ability. This spell will transform based on your active pet.

^ See the link; it provides a list of spell ID numbers that may or may not include what's listed below. No time to check that until after work.

Cauterize Master (Imp?)
Burns the Master's wounds, dealing a small amount of damage, then restoring X% health over 12 sec.

Shadow Shield (Voidwalker)
Encases the Voidwalker in shadow energy, reducing physical damage taken by X% for 30 sec.

Each time the Voidwalker is struck, a blast of Shadow damage is released, dealing X Shadow damage and reducing the power of Shadow Shield by X%.

Auto-Cast:
Use this ability when being attacked.

Cybsled · 03/22/12, 9:37 AM

The Glyph of Demonhunting seems to confirm early speculation that Demo locks might have the ability to be tanks.

So based on the current abilities available from the website talent calc + this:

-Meta gives you +800% armor contribution and now fury reduces dmg taken vs. increasing dmg
-Demonic Slash becomes our damaging attack + generates fury to keep us in Meta mode + it requires us to be closer to the mob, which moves into...
-Immo aura doesn't hurt us and doesn't need to be channeled, which helps not only in generating threat vs. a main target, but also in AE situations
-Unending Resolve (shield wall basically? 50% dmg reduction for 12s)
-Soulshatter now becomes an AE taunt vs. AE aggro dump (2m cd)
-Aura of Enfeeblement reduces physical damage from enemies by 30% (although it remains to be seen if this applies to boss level mobs)
-Ward absorbs damage types

With a tank mindset, the talents that suddenly look attractive now become:

-Dark regen for the large self heal + increased incoming healing
-Shadowfury (AE stun)
-Soul link (reduced dmg that is always there so long as your pet stays healed) if you chose Grimoire of Supremacy, otherwise Dark Bargain (prevent all dmg 10s, then 50% dealt over 20s) if you go with Grimoire of Sacrifice.
-60 rank would be a toss up I suppose...burning rush maybe (5% hp per tick to increase movement speed by 50%)
-See line 3. Grimoire of Supremacy (stronger demon) if you go soul link, otherwise Sacrifice (increased HP if you kill demon) if you go Dark Bargain
-Archimonde's Vengeance

I'm curious to see what the feasibility of a warlock tank will eventually be...will it be a gimmick type of tank, or something that can actually tank harder content? The lack of other taunts and reliance on damage for threat generation I suppose would be the largest shortcoming, especially since meta don't seem to have a searing pain type of ability (fast cast + high threat).

Nfariessence · 03/22/12, 10:36 AM

Originally Posted by Cybsled

The lack of other taunts and reliance on damage for threat generation I suppose would be the largest shortcoming, especially since meta don't seem to have a searing pain type of ability (fast cast + high threat).

Meta is getting a new ability called Provocation: 30 yd range, Instant, Requires Metamorphosis - Forces the target to attack you, but has no effect if the target is already attacking you. No idea of the cooldown on it though, but from videos it appears to be low.*

Meta with the glyph is also getting a threat modifier, like other tanks do. Metamorphosis: Effect #5, Apply Aura - Mod Threat, Value: 500

*Edit: Looks like an 8 second cooldown on Provocation, similar to a Warrior's Taunt.