So, my guild just finished up through Felmyst,
On brut my dps was a decent 2100. The problem was the top 3-5 dpsers were sitting at 3k+ with some hitting over 3.4k.
On Felmyst I was sitting ust over 1800, but the mage and the rogue were at 2.4 and 2.7k
on Kalec I was at about 2.2k - got second place here.
I raided affliction, my spec was 56/0/5
My rotation was haunt, cor, sl, coa, ua, immo, Sbolt x2 -repeat + add in NF procs.
I managed to keep up all dots with some slight error -
any critiques on the spec/rotation -for better results?
I am at over 1450 sp buffed,
242 haste, 175 hit, 27%crit
Try casting a SB first so you get 2 stacks of SE after you cast Haunt
So, my guild just finished up through Felmyst,
On brut my dps was a decent 2100. The problem was the top 3-5 dpsers were sitting at 3k+ with some hitting over 3.4k.
On Felmyst I was sitting ust over 1800, but the mage and the rogue were at 2.4 and 2.7k
on Kalec I was at about 2.2k - got second place here.
I raided affliction, my spec was 56/0/5
My rotation was haunt, cor, sl, coa, ua, immo, Sbolt x2 -repeat + add in NF procs.
I managed to keep up all dots with some slight error -
any critiques on the spec/rotation -for better results?
I am at over 1450 sp buffed,
242 haste, 175 hit, 27%crit
don't use Immo (if you are under 1320 fire dmg)
and Eardiction 3/3 + Amplify Curse should increase your dps, you can always drop grim reach. and 1 point from imp life tap, or (with tank boosts) you can loose 1 point from imp drain soul.
just a suggestion
I'll mix CBs with Incinerate if the cooldown is up. I wasn't intending to use a fire build, but I found myself completely thrown off when casting Shadowbolts and trying not to miss the MC buff. Should I be casting corruption? I'm letting Immo tick instead of using Conflag right off the bat, is that the surefire way to go?
Anyway I was at a target dummy trying to get my rhythm down and according to Recount I was doing 1200 dps. I'm guessing that's a bit low. Also my Imp was not attacking.
I'll mix CBs with Incinerate if the cooldown is up. I wasn't intending to use a fire build, but I found myself completely thrown off when casting Shadowbolts and trying not to miss the MC buff. Should I be casting corruption? I'm letting Immo tick instead of using Conflag right off the bat, is that the surefire way to go?
Anyway I was at a target dummy trying to get my rhythm down and according to Recount I was doing 1200 dps. I'm guessing that's a bit low. Also my Imp was not attacking.
Thanks.
As 0/3/58 you are better off casting Agony over Cor, unless you have to be on a support curse. As someone said the dummies are a bad representation of your DPS, Boom is better but not perfect
I raided sunwell last night as that spec, did 2100 ish on brut before I died (I miss Shadow Embrace), which IMO isn’t very good as I was doing 2500ish before the patch, last night hunters mages and rogues were all over 3K, brut dies in about 3min.
I'll mix CBs with Incinerate if the cooldown is up. I wasn't intending to use a fire build, but I found myself completely thrown off when casting Shadowbolts and trying not to miss the MC buff. Should I be casting corruption? I'm letting Immo tick instead of using Conflag right off the bat, is that the surefire way to go?
Anyway I was at a target dummy trying to get my rhythm down and according to Recount I was doing 1200 dps. I'm guessing that's a bit low. Also my Imp was not attacking.
Thanks.
Only thing I would add is when Backdraft procs I would cast Immolate first. It will receive the spellhaste bonus from backdraft and then cast Incinerate afterwards as it will do more damage once Immolate is on your target. I have not tested this at all, it just seems logical to do this way.
Only thing I would add is when Backdraft procs I would cast Immolate first. It will receive the spellhaste bonus from backdraft and then cast Incinerate afterwards as it will do more damage once Immolate is on your target. I have not tested this at all, it just seems logical to do this way.
You are right in casting immolate first for incinerate but it isnt exactly the 'logical' thing to do since backdraft grants a 30% cast time reduction which drops immolate well below the GCD. I cant believe they havent addressed this GCD clipping & F&B design despite all the complaints on beta.
I went to Dr. Boom and was able to do 1600dps before running out of mana.
My Imp was attacking, and I used both trinkets:
1. CoA
2. Chaos Bolt
3. Immo
4. 6 x Incinerate -> Conflag
5. CB + 2 x Incinerate
I tried refreshing Immolate first + 2 x Incinerate on the dummy, but that totally threw off my rotation. I head back SWP tonight and will probably get a lot of attempts on Brut. I am leaning towards trying out an Affliction build because this fire build seems to be lacking punch. Can someone point out something else I can change up? Should I go back to Shadowbolts?
We did a BT (to supremus) --> Sunwell (to twins) run last night. I decided to spec out of conflag after a half an hour with a training dummy, just to simplify the rotation a bit. I was able to pull a bit over 2650dps (according to recount) on Brutallus, but I feel that I could have gone a bit higher, as I missed a few Chaos Bolt cooldowns. My previous best in my old spec (SB spam + CoD) was about 2400.
I was using CoD --> Corr --> ChaosBolt --> Immo --> Incinerate (popping Chaos Bolt whenever I noticed it was up, regardless of time left on immo). I think I'll need to pick up SCT to make those Nightfall procs more apparent, and to have a reminder of the Chaos Bolt cooldown.
Originally Posted by Melbuframa
As 0/3/58 you are better off casting Agony over Cor, unless you have to be on a support curse. As someone said the dummies are a bad representation of your DPS, Boom is better but not perfect
Even accounting for the Glyph of Corruption procs?
Majorly disappointed with Warlocks when compared to other classes at the moment. I've been doing some dummy testing for a couple of hours, and the best DPS I can come up with (with a healer for taps) is the 56/0/5 with Felhunter or Imp Affliction build. Casting UA -> Corr -> CoA -> Immo -> SL -> Haunt -> SB -> Repeat, I can get to around 1800 DPS. As the 2/3/56 Fire Destruction build, I had a hard time breaking 1650 DPS. This is with basically the best gear in the game (full Sunwell). We'll see how it translates into raid DPS, but I was in the 2400-2800 range pre-3.0, and I imagine I'm right around there now. Not really a buff, while we've been seeing Fury Warriors doing 3600 DPS on Brut, and Hunters/Mages/Rogues/Pallies over 3000 DPS.
Its like we are being punish for having it too easy with TBC
Fully deck in T6+sunwell gear, my dps on brut use to sit around 2600,
Speccing 56/0/5, largely said to be best dps spec, I only managed to squeeze out a meagre 1700 dps.
from top dps to being just above the tank, and jostling not to be lower then the shadow priest is not exactly fun.
Maybe i have too much haste 300, which doesn't scale well with affliction, maybe we will balance out if we do reach level 80.
We did a BT (to supremus) --> Sunwell (to twins) run last night. I decided to spec out of conflag after a half an hour with a training dummy, just to simplify the rotation a bit. I was able to pull a bit over 2650dps (according to recount) on Brutallus, but I feel that I could have gone a bit higher, as I missed a few Chaos Bolt cooldowns. My previous best in my old spec (SB spam + CoD) was about 2400.
I was using CoD --> Corr --> ChaosBolt --> Immo --> Incinerate (popping Chaos Bolt whenever I noticed it was up, regardless of time left on immo). I think I'll need to pick up SCT to make those Nightfall procs more apparent, and to have a reminder of the Chaos Bolt cooldown.
I tried Desto with Backdraft last night on Brutallus, with the Corruption Glyph, and I wanted to bang my head into the wall. Party because of lag, but mostly because of the strange rotation that all turns into. Your simplified chain looks nicer and you seem to have done well with it.
Its like we are being punish for having it too easy with TBC
Fully deck in T6+sunwell gear, my dps on brut use to sit around 2600,
Speccing 56/0/5, largely said to be best dps spec, I only managed to squeeze out a meagre 1700 dps.
from top dps to being just above the tank, and jostling not to be lower then the shadow priest is not exactly fun.
Maybe i have too much haste 300, which doesn't scale well with affliction, maybe we will balance out if we do reach level 80.
/wanna reroll HunteR
Pre-patch I decided that I wanted to raise my lock up to 80 first because of my gear advantage from Sunwell.
Post-patch I decided I'm just gonna reroll Death Knight along with everyone and their mothers.
Its like we are being punish for having it too easy with TBC
Fully deck in T6+sunwell gear, my dps on brut use to sit around 2600,
Speccing 56/0/5, largely said to be best dps spec, I only managed to squeeze out a meagre 1700 dps.
When there's a "Post your 3.0/WotLK WWS" thread we can then find out what is actually happening with class balance. Anecdotal evidence without parses based on one or two nights of raiding on bosses that heavily favor classes with cooldowns, I think, isn't too helpful. I'm personally in the "I'm not sure why people are complaining" camp since I was clocking 2900 on Brutallus and 1900 on target dummies with the same 56/0/5 spec, but I can't compare how much luckier I was for 2 minutes than other people since the parses aren't there.
Keep in mind there are also possible bugs with Shadow Embrace and Everlasting Affliction that drag affliction dps down.
After trying out every spec I could think of, and reading some other people's comments on the current nerfed state of raiding, I decided to spec Felguard Ruin for our Sunwell last night. Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft
I didn't realize until I talked to people who had already fought some of the nerfed encounters how different our level 70 specs were going to be from level 80. I barely had time to get a shadow bolt off on trash before they were dying. A spec like affliction, or even fire destro with its reliance on immo and shadow DoTs for MC uptime just won't cut it for these short fights.
I figured speccing into Felguard and ruin would let me benefit the most from all the new melee and caster buffs I would be getting in raid. I should have talked to the hunters before brut so they could have told me that pets bug out on that encounter and I could have positioned by Felguard better, but even without him dpsing at all I pulled 2500 dps. And from testing the Felguard earlier with and enhance shaman it seemed like he could easily pull 500-600dps by himself.
My rotation for trash was just shadow bolt spam. For bosses i threw in CoD, Corr for glyph procs, and immo to help out the other destro lock with his uptime.
Anyone who thinks they are going to just switch cold from a class that spammed one button over and over to one that is watching 5 or more cooldowns at the same time and maintain the same dps, just because you still have the same class name, is a bit naive. The new affliction and the old destruction play nearly as differently as a hunter and a rogue, if you didn't practice it, or at least have a substantial amount of experience with affliction beforehand, you certainly aren't going to be at your maximum level of production. The same goes for the more tricky destro rotations as well. And I guarantee people not used to running a pet weren't getting the best possible production there either.
It's going to take time to adjust, more for some people than others, and I'm sure plenty of people will find that they don't even enjoy playing a warlock any more due to the changes. If anything, let some of the more neglected classes have their time in the sun, eventually the numbers will come back around.
Played around with the 56/0/5 Haunt build. The thing that irks me the most is Haunt itself in the build :1.5s cast, 10s cd, 12s duration. There will be times that the debuff will fall off if you don't prioritize Haunt ( because some dots will expire at that moment ) and I am kinda gissing that waiting for Haunt to be back up in 1.0-2.0s while doing nothing is more of a dps loss than letting it fall of.
They need to either : instant cast+hit, shorten the cd or extend the debuff duration. Already crazy focus on the thankfully working DoTimer. 1.5s cast + 10s cd + 12s duration is damn strict, not even counting lag/ping.
PS : pulled off around 1800 dps for 1 coe duration on a 70 dummy with the build. Pandemic not included.
Its like we are being punish for having it too easy with TBC
Fully deck in T6+sunwell gear, my dps on brut use to sit around 2600,
Speccing 56/0/5, largely said to be best dps spec, I only managed to squeeze out a meagre 1700 dps.
from top dps to being just above the tank, and jostling not to be lower then the shadow priest is not exactly fun.
Maybe i have too much haste 300, which doesn't scale well with affliction, maybe we will balance out if we do reach level 80.
/wanna reroll HunteR
I'm in the same boat, I think we were nerfed too much. We’re jugging a hell of a lot more than any of my alts have to (fury war/prot Pally) and are getting a lot less return than other classes. Right now boomkin and rogues are at the top DPS and every lock is at the bottom. I’m pretty concerned we are supposed to out-perform hybrids and right now that are more viable than we are. Even with perfect rotation which is kind of a headache as affliction, even with everlasting affliction.
Unstable affliction needs more damage and to last longer than it does.
I leveled as affliction and prefer it, but the felguard/metamorphisis is bad in raids based on the one fight I did with it.
When there's a "Post your 3.0/WotLK WWS" thread we can then find out what is actually happening with class balance. Anecdotal evidence without parses based on one or two nights of raiding on bosses that heavily favor classes with cooldowns
There is truth in this.
I think, isn't too helpful. I'm personally in the "I'm not sure why people are complaining" camp since I was clocking 2900 on Brutallus and 1900 on target dummies with the same 56/0/5 spec, but I can't compare how much luckier I was for 2 minutes than other people since the parses aren't there.
And what rotation were you using? From what I understand you open with CURSE -> Haunt -> UA -> Corruption -> SL -> SB until haunt is up. Then after that all you need to do is Haunt -> UA -> SL -> SB until haunt is up depending on the encounter of course.
Reasoning behind cutting corruption is because haunt refreshes it and if you're haunting every CD then it will refresh. Also from my understanding you lose DPS if haunt falls off for even a second. The issue I'm having is deciding whether to cut that last shadow bolt before haunt is up.
Keep in mind there are also possible bugs with Shadow Embrace and Everlasting Affliction that drag affliction dps down.
I confirm SE still being bugged. I tested it with one guildmate on brutallus this evening and the one who got the first cast was the lucky guy to get the "buff".
Its like we are being punish for having it too easy with TBC
Fully deck in T6+sunwell gear, my dps on brut use to sit around 2600,
Speccing 56/0/5, largely said to be best dps spec, I only managed to squeeze out a meagre 1700 dps.
Sorry to say this, but if your pre 3.0 2600 dps are not exaggerated, then you definitely did something majorly wrong. I have a hastily geared warlock with 3 t6, bt weapons (dagger, offhand) and much green/blue equip (thats about 1200 spelldamage buffed) and did a flat 2000 dps on brutallus. My previous shadowbolt spam dps was about 1800 dps. So your dps dropping this extremely is not realistic, at least not if you say you played a perfect affliction rotation.
The issue I'm having is deciding whether to cut that last shadow bolt before haunt is up.
Since the Haunt cd-duration gap is 2 seconds, if you have enough haste to get sub-2.0 second shadow bolts then Haunt is not really in danger of falling off. For 2.0 bolts you need 25% haste, and you get 5% spell haste from Wrath of Air Totem and another 3% from either moonkin or retadin talents, so if it's additive (not sure) then you need 17% base haste. I think most end-of-Sunwell geared warlocks have that much.
Immolate still had substantially higher dpct than bolts, it should be worth casting.
I have a question about the Curse of Agony in this rotation. When i saw my CoA with 2 seconds left on the timer i sometimes hesitated to reapply it before casting another shadowbolt, because i thought that the last ticks may be cut off, which are the highest for CoA. Is it a dps loss to cut these lets say 1-2 seconds and reapplying the CoA or is it less beneficial to have 1-2 seconds without CoA because of casting a shadowbolt while CoA ends?
Since the Haunt cd-duration gap is 2 seconds, if you have enough haste to get sub-2.0 second shadow bolts then Haunt is not really in danger of falling off. For 2.0 bolts you need 25% haste, and you get 5% spell haste from Wrath of Air Totem and another 3% from either moonkin or retadin talents, so if it's additive (not sure) then you need 17% base haste. I think most end-of-Sunwell geared warlocks have that much.
Immolate still had substantially higher dpct than bolts, it should be worth casting.
Thanks for the clarification but I can only reach a max of 204 haste, dropping to 167 hit. From what I understand you only get 3% hit from Shadow Priest talents and say your shadow priest either dies, or we don't bring one then I'm in a bad situation for hit.
I noticed a DPS increase of ~ 125 when using immolate in my rotation. I don't know the exact numbers but it definitely is still worth casting.
After some intensive 10+ minute Dummy runs, I'm finding that 51/0/10 (1/3 Erad, 1/3 DE, 5/5 ISB) is actually putting out about 100 DPS more (~1950 including pet) than 56/0/5 (3/3 Erad, 3/3 DE — ~1850 including pet). If you have a good amount of crit, the ISB buff will be up fairly often, and it absolutely does increase the damage of DoTs cast with the buff by 10%. Essentially, 5/5 ISB is way better than 3/3 Eradication.
The caveat here is that Dummy trials don't realize the benefit of Death's Embrace. Having the extra two points in DE may increase average DPS over the course of a boss fight enough to equal or overcome the DPS advantage of 51/0/10. Some raid testing should shed some light on this.
10/16/08, 5:17 AM
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