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Old 12/01/08, 6:42 PM   #226
Evyle
Von Kaiser
 
Human Warlock
 
Proudmoore
Eradication

At 70 there was talk that you only needed 1/3 in eradication to get close to full benifit. Do you know for a deep affliction lock (haunt/ruin), it is better now to have 2/3 or even 3/3 eradication?

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Old 12/01/08, 6:56 PM   #227
Trickykid
Don Flamenco
 
Gnome Warlock
 
Turalyon
Originally Posted by Evyle View Post
At 70 there was talk that you only needed 1/3 in eradication to get close to full benifit. Do you know for a deep affliction lock (haunt/ruin), it is better now to have 2/3 or even 3/3 eradication?
Eradication suffers from more diminishing returns than a lot of other talents, but that doesn't mean subsequent points are inferior. Each point adds more uptime, just less than the point before it.

Simplified (haven't tested if the 30 second ICD starts at the beginning or end of the buff):
1/3: 12 second buff that happens every 3/.04+30 = 105 seconds. 12/104 = 11.43% uptime
2/3: 12 second buff that happens every 3/.07+30 = 73 seconds. 12/73 = 16.47% uptime (5% more than the first point)
3/3: 12 second buff that happens every 3/.1+30 = 60 seconds. 12/60 = 20% uptime (3.5% more than the second point).

While the first point gets more than half of the benefit that 3/3 does, but each still does increase the haste uptime. Note this is all for single target DPS.

Edit: if the ICD starts on the buff's proc, the uptimes go:
1/3: 12.9%
2/3: 19.7%
3/3: 25.0%

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Old 12/02/08, 1:03 AM   #228
nom
Von Kaiser
 
Gnome Warlock
 
Dragonmaw
Eradication can only proc on a corruption tick, and since duration & internal cooldown of eradication divides 3, the soonest it can proc again appears to be a whole number n corruption ticks later.

Can Eradication proc exactly n corruption ticks after the previous proc, or must it wait till the (n+1)th tick? If it can proc on the nth corruption tick, then the average dead time between procs falls by 3 secs.

Last edited by nom : 12/02/08 at 1:17 AM. Reason: unneeded assumption

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Old 12/02/08, 4:25 AM   #229
krilz
Don Flamenco
 
krilz's Avatar
 
Orc Warlock
 
Laughing Skull (EU)
Originally Posted by Runez View Post
1) Is glyph of Immolate worth it?
2) I've been using Glyph of Corruption and firing off a Shadowbolt whenever it procs, this seems to increase dps quite a bit. Anyone else do this?
3) Under the effects of Backdraft, is it better to priorotise Incinerate over Immolate?
4) Under the effects of Heroism, I've heard various things. I tend to just keep Immolate up and spam Incinerate, using CB when it's off cooldown, and ignoring Corruption and Backdraft. Is this the best way to go?
5) Is CoA or CoD worth putting on if I'm not on CoE duty (providing there's no moonkin, yadda yadda)
1) As stated before: Opposed to what? I'm hesitant though to taking this over Imp and CoA but is probably better than for example Conflagrate. I dislike it however when using Backdraft since you won't let it tick for it's full amount and don't have anything that increases it's DoT as opposed to it's DD.
2) Nightfall procs will probably increase your DPS but if you don't get any, it will probably decrease it.
3) Personally during Bloodlust I Backdraft and when the effect is up I Soul Fire x3. When last tested this (on a 10-man Instructor Razuvious) the Soul Fires accounted for 15% of my total damage. This avoids any clipping you might encounter with Immolate being shorter than the GCD.
4) I think it depends on whether you got Imp. CoA and Molten Core. If you do, CoA is probably a better choice. If you don't, CoD will be better. I have no way to back this up though.

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Old 12/02/08, 5:18 AM   #230
Aphex-
Von Kaiser
 
Gnome Warlock
 
Moonrunner
Has anyone found some nice uses for our Demonic Portal/Teleport spells? The only one I know of is being able to get out of Malygos' Vortex early if you place your portal near the middle of the platform.

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Old 12/02/08, 5:19 AM   #231
 dragon12
Likes gnomes
 
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Greenilocks
Gnome Warlock
 
No WoW Account (EU)
Originally Posted by Aphex- View Post
Has anyone found some nice uses for our Demonic Portal/Teleport spells? The only one I know of is being able to get out of Malygos' Vortex early if you place your portal near the middle of the platform.
Pretty useful for using on any heroic boss that ports you to him. I've not found much apart from that though.


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Old 12/02/08, 6:00 AM   #232
fschoenm
Glass Joe
 
Human Warlock
 
Zirkel des Cenarius (EU)
Originally Posted by Aphex- View Post
Has anyone found some nice uses for our Demonic Portal/Teleport spells? The only one I know of is being able to get out of Malygos' Vortex early if you place your portal near the middle of the platform.
I use it to improve DPS time in cases where I have to move, e.g. Thaddius to switch sides, Gothik to move through the gate, Heigan to port back to the platform after a dance phase, Sapphiron to avoid AoE damage or move back in range from behind an ice block, Grobbulus after dropping the poison cloud, ...

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Old 12/02/08, 7:34 AM   #233
Villeraz
Von Kaiser
 
Undead Warlock
 
Greymane
Originally Posted by Aphex- View Post
Has anyone found some nice uses for our Demonic Portal/Teleport spells? The only one I know of is being able to get out of Malygos' Vortex early if you place your portal near the middle of the platform.
There are lots of situations where planning ahead with the circle will save you time later on, and it's only a .5 second cast.

On any boss that physically moves you you can get rid of potential fall damage and save time from the actual movement (Anub'rekhan's Impale, Malygos' Vortex, etc).
Any boss that places AoE (Rain of Fire, Blizzard, etc).
Any boss that requires you to be in specific locations (Tanking a Horseman, Thaddius, etc).
Kiting the boss for that final percent of damage.
Any boss that requires you to return to a set location (Grobbulus' Mutating Injection, failing the Thaddius jump, etc).

I'm sure I've still missed hundreds of other useful situations to use it. I suggest getting used to using it; it's a very powerful tool, and the best way to find uses for it is to make it a regular part of your arsenal.

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Old 12/02/08, 9:12 AM   #234
DiamondTear
Don Flamenco
 
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Blood Elf Paladin
 
Lightning's Blade (EU)
Originally Posted by Villeraz View Post
Any boss that places AoE (Rain of Fire, Blizzard, etc).
Any boss that requires you to be in specific locations (Tanking a Horseman, Thaddius, etc).
For simple moving, such as moving away from a RoF running is often better because you can tap/dot/dp and you know for sure that you won't be teleporting into another aoe effect or too close to the one you are trying to get away from. Depending on how you cast the portal, porting can also be disorienting which means that you lose more casting time than the GCD.

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Old 12/02/08, 9:31 AM   #235
Kana
Von Kaiser
 
Human Warlock
 
Dark Iron
Any fight that involves movement is a fight where you can get utility from demonic circle. I use it on Maxenna(sp) to break web cocoons faster, on loatheb to get back to the clump after chasing a spore, on thaddius to avoid shock damage... almost every boss fight in the game has a creative way to use it if you spend a little time considering how you'll be moving.

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Old 12/02/08, 10:35 AM   #236
Darkstarrz
Von Kaiser
 
Orc Warlock
 
Bonechewer
Demonic Circle in many ways can be a very nice dps and survivability gain if used correctly. One of my favorite ways to use it is on malygos. I be sure about 5 seconds before we pull to put my demonic circle on the edge of the perimeter somewhat near to where the portal is where you zone in from to get as much time out of the spell as possible. Malygos does a vortex ability which tosses the raid around the room and deals around 2000 Arcane damage every second for 10 seconds. When Vortex ends, everyone will be dropped around the center of the platform. The second I feel myself falling, I spam my bind for DC which puts me out of harms way from his arcane breath and faces me towards him immediately, where I can continue to dps him while the entire raid is still running away from him to there spots. OP!

It really is a great ability if used correctly and wisely. I reccomend on all fights to use your imagination and put this spell to work, you will not be disappointed. Make sure you place it in a spot where you will not be out of its range. The more you use it, the more you get a feel for the distance in which you need to place yourself durring each encounter.

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Old 12/02/08, 10:42 AM   #237
Woggle
Von Kaiser
 
Undead Warlock
 
Blackrock (EU)
Actually, a much easier way to use it on Malygos (and imho more promising), is to just drop the circle in the center when the fight starts. That way, you can immediately port back down when the vortex starts, continue dps and/or position yourself for the landing while the raid swirls up in the air. Also remember that you don't take any damage if you teleport out of the vortex, so it's less stress on the healers. The only limitation to that use is actually aggro (and that is one of the VERY few fights where aggro actually might be an issue).

Otherwise, I agree fully in that there are tons of uses on almost any encounter where movement is involved.

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Old 12/02/08, 11:52 AM   #238
Nve
Glass Joe
 
Undead Warlock
 
Twisting Nether
Does Curse of Recklessness stack or not stack with other debuffs? Is there a debuff that is better and overrides this that can be provided by another class?

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Old 12/02/08, 12:06 PM   #239
bhaltayr
Glass Joe
 
Undead Warlock
 
Blackrock
Has anyone modeled Empowered Imp as a static crit%? I was trying to analyze the talent and came up with this:

Assumption:
  • Imp's Crit % - 5% (base) + 18% (raid buffs) = 23%

The imp's firebolt cast time is 2.0s talented therefore about one in every five firebolts (conservatively) will be a crit giving the player 20% crit on their next spell. The cast time for a destro specced warlock and imp are comparable so I'm assuming that about one in every five incinerates/chaos bolts will have the added 20% crit which equates to about a 4-5% static crit %.

Now it's finals week for me and I haven't slept much so I could be missing something apparent but this is what I was able to come up with. Any help would be appreciated.

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Old 12/02/08, 1:01 PM   #240
• bartolimu
palpably superior comprehension
 
bartolimu's Avatar
 
Undead Warlock
 
Mal'Ganis
Originally Posted by threep* View Post
Can someone tell me if the "Black Magic" enchant is good for affliction locks? A guildmate says it's affected by talents, and he's unsure about enchanting +dmg or BM. Thanks in advance.
I had a Black Magic enchant done to test it, and along with another person's data I can say:

1. It is not affected by spell power, Haunt, or Shadow Mastery.
2. It is affected by Shadow Embrace
3. It only procs on spells with an immediate damage component - Shadowflame, Shadowburn, Immolate, Shadow Bolt, Incinerate, Searing Pain.
4. High proc rate - around 50%.
5. 45-second internal cooldown on the ability
6. Does not proc Molten Core

Given these issues - mostly the internal CD being so long - this enchant is vastly inferior to (and more expensive than) a flat spell power enchant.

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Old 12/02/08, 2:10 PM   #241
DiamondTear
Don Flamenco
 
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Blood Elf Paladin
 
Lightning's Blade (EU)
Originally Posted by Nve View Post
Does Curse of Recklessness stack or not stack with other debuffs? Is there a debuff that is better and overrides this that can be provided by another class?
Armor Debuff (Minor): Faerie Fire, Sting (Hunter pet), Curse of Recklessness

Those do not stack.

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Old 12/02/08, 4:07 PM   #242
blecap
Banned
 
Absinte
Undead Priest
 
Thaurissan
As a 0/41/30, The fg/Ruin build. I have glyphs for Corr,Immo and FG. I been doing 3k+ to a nearly 4k dps on patchwerk fight. But i want to increase my dps.
1. Do i use CoA Instead of CoD? If yes, its better if i Glyph for CoA and remove Glyph of Corr place?
2. Or CoD->Corr>Immo Rotation is better? And leave the glyphs i have untouch?

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Old 12/02/08, 4:12 PM   #243
 Nicarras
Keyboard Cowboy
 
Nicarras's Avatar
 
Undead Priest
 
Illidan
All you need to do is calculate the DPCT for each spell for your gear to know the answer, but in general CoA is much better than CoD now. And get the Glyph for CoA as well.

Hope this helps.

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Old 12/02/08, 6:24 PM   #244
Akj
Piston Honda
 
Orc Warlock
 
Suramar
Originally Posted by Nicarras View Post
All you need to do is calculate the DPCT for each spell for your gear to know the answer, but in general CoA is much better than CoD now. And get the Glyph for CoA as well.

Hope this helps.
This is not true for non affliction warlocks.

If X is spell power, over the period of a minute
Curse of Doom does 7300+2X damage
Curse of Agony does 2.5(1356+1.2X) damage

Equating the two we get the crossover point as X = 3910 spell power
With two points in improved curse of agony this drops down to X = 2747 spell power

Therefore Curse of Doom costs less mana, GCDs and also does more damage than CoA until spell power exceeds 3910 (or 2747 with 2/2 imp CoA).

Whether the gain in molten core uptime justifies the use of CoA over CoD is something I dont have an answer to yet.

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Old 12/02/08, 6:29 PM   #245
 Nicarras
Keyboard Cowboy
 
Nicarras's Avatar
 
Undead Priest
 
Illidan
I thought that the general thought for MC uptime was that CoA was the best because it ticks most often of any other dot (2 seconds). At least that was the argument when people were trying to decide between CoA/Corr for destro priorities. Would assume that the lack of ticks on CoD would mean that it doesnt maintain MC at all.

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Old 12/02/08, 6:47 PM   #246
Nve
Glass Joe
 
Undead Warlock
 
Twisting Nether
For 0/41/30, you definitely want to be maintaining CoA if you are not on CoE duty. The glyph adds 4 ticks (2 at the beginning, 2 at the end) which gives you a high probability of proccing molten core even before your first incinerate (and maybe even immolate).

Anyways, in regards to curses, let me make sure I have this correct. If there is a boomkin with imp FF, that is better than CoR and since they don't stack, there's no need for a warlock to cast CoR (unless the boomkin dies), right?

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Old 12/02/08, 7:41 PM   #247
duhwhat
Piston Honda
 
Undead Warlock
 
Area 52
Originally Posted by Nve View Post
For 0/41/30, you definitely want to be maintaining CoA if you are not on CoE duty. The glyph adds 4 ticks (2 at the beginning, 2 at the end) which gives you a high probability of proccing molten core even before your first incinerate (and maybe even immolate).

Anyways, in regards to curses, let me make sure I have this correct. If there is a boomkin with imp FF, that is better than CoR and since they don't stack, there's no need for a warlock to cast CoR (unless the boomkin dies), right?
Are Corr and CoA ticks both able to proc MC if they are active at the same time?

Imp FF seems to be superior as it provides the same amount of armor reduction but no AP bonus. It does have a shorter duration than CoR, but it's going to need to be maintained anyway for the hit buff.

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Old 12/02/08, 11:07 PM   #248
Tomed
Glass Joe
 
Orc Warlock
 
Bloodscalp
I currently have 449 Hit Rating (slightly over hit cap) and I'm still missing my Immolate quite a bit on bosses. Has anyone else had similar experiences?

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Old 12/03/08, 1:25 AM   #249
Aeetes
Glass Joe
 
Orc Warlock
 
Executus
Originally Posted by Tomed View Post
I currently have 449 Hit Rating (slightly over hit cap) and I'm still missing my Immolate quite a bit on bosses. Has anyone else had similar experiences?
hit cap is not 100% chance to hit, you can still miss, also do you have the destro talent cataclysm?

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Old 12/03/08, 4:27 AM   #250
EasyWarlock
Glass Joe
 
Undead Warlock
 
Alonsus (EU)
Hello! I registered here to ask this question. Please forgive me if I'm not good with spreadsheets and formulas... I'm pretty sure this is very researchable but I just don't know how.

Anyway, I was wondering as I stacked on both +crit and +haste gear: when does stacking +haste (with its ever diminishing returns in casting time bonuses on 2.5s and 2.0s nukes) become less of an advantage than +crit? Like, a point when X haste makes the casting time quite smaller (say: -0.2), but just a few haste later the difference becomes negligible (say: -0.05) compared to a good old +1% chance to crit.

I don't even know if this point exists. I ask this humbly, please don't jump me! Thanks for any help.

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