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Old 01/01/09, 9:08 AM   #476
turturin
Don Flamenco
 
Orc Warlock
 
Destromath
Originally Posted by mozed View Post
For an example, patchwerk. I (fully flasked, all out, food, etc) hit around 4000 DPS... He was closer to 5000. I use a DoT timer and to my knowledge, my dots hardly ever have downtime and stay up for their full duration.

What could explain such a gap in our DPS? My DPS isn't bad by any means, but the other lock is proof that I'm not doing something to the best of my ability.

Edit: I use felhunter and 2pc
Have you compared your dot uptime to his on your wws? check the wws thread for the best way to do this.
Are you busting out an infernal?
Are you stacking trinkets and/or speed potions with heroism?
Use the imp for max dps, not the felhunter.
Have you compared the percentage of total dmg he gets from shadowbolt vs you?
Have you asked him about his latency and compared it to yours? (latency differences have a more pronounced effect the more a build relies on shorter/instant casts?

all of these things affect your dps

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Old 01/01/09, 12:08 PM   #477
Oth
Piston Honda
 
Human Warlock
 
Cenarius
Alternatively: Are you the first one to apply Shadow Embrace?


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Old 01/01/09, 3:47 PM   #478
DiamondTear
Don Flamenco
 
DiamondTear's Avatar
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
Lightning's Blade (EU)
Originally Posted by mozed View Post
Hi there. I currently raid with another affliction lock (with similar gear, I actually slightly outgear him by stats), we use the same rotation, but I am consistently getting destroyed by him in DPS every single fight. I cannot figure out for the life of me what I'm doing wrong or not doing right...
Remove those hit and stat gems and replace them with spellpower. You're already over hit cap. You don't have to worry about being under the cap too much, since hit rating isn't as good as it was in tbc.

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Old 01/02/09, 2:33 AM   #479
Krathis
Von Kaiser
 
Krathis's Avatar
 
Undead Warlock
 
Cenarion Circle
Originally Posted by mozed View Post
Hi there. I currently raid with another affliction lock (with similar gear, I actually slightly outgear him by stats), we use the same rotation, but I am consistently getting destroyed by him in DPS every single fight. I cannot figure out for the life of me what I'm doing wrong or not doing right...

He is ahead of me in DPS 400-900 DPS per fight.
For an example, patchwerk. I (fully flasked, all out, food, etc) hit around 4000 DPS... He was closer to 5000. I use a DoT timer and to my knowledge, my dots hardly ever have downtime and stay up for their full duration.

What could explain such a gap in our DPS? My DPS isn't bad by any means, but the other lock is proof that I'm not doing something to the best of my ability.

Spec: 54/0/17
Glyphs: SL, Immolate, CoA
Rotation: SB, Haunt, UA, Immolate, CoA, Corruption, SL, SB, Haunt, SB, SB, UA, Immolate, etc, etc (soul drain <25% as filler)
Stats (completely unbuffed, no self buffs at all): 1730 sp dmg, 11.53% crit, 12.39% hit, 14.55% haste

Edit: I use felhunter and 2pc
I'd use Glyph of Corruption or Glyph of Imp over CoA for a full affliction build. For a detailed explanation of why dig around in the Glyph Choice thread. Page six has some good arguments on why you don't want to use Glyph of Agony.

I'm curious about the dot uptime comment. If you're clipping your dots or even worse not starting a shadow bolt because you want to be able to refresh on time then that could explain a dps gap of that size. While maximizing dot uptime is important it's more important to make sure you're always casting something and that you're making the most of your global cooldowns.

What Oth said is probably a factor as well, especially if you're opening with Curse, Corruption, Haunt and the other warlock opens with Haunt, Curse, Corruption. He'd consistently get the Shadow Embrace off first and it would easily explain at least two or three hundred of the dps difference you're seeing.

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Old 01/02/09, 7:11 AM   #480
Neqael
Glass Joe
 
Undead Warlock
 
Earthen Ring (EU)
Molton Core questions

Hello EJ community.
After reading for quite some time I came up with a few things that aren't really clear to me yet regarding Molten Core;

1: Does it apply it's effect when Immolate is already casted, or only on a newly cast Immolate?
2: If it's only for the newly cast Immolate, will it have it's full buff for the entire duration of Immolate if it lands in the last second of the Molten Core proc?
3: Does it increase my Imp's damage or is it (as I read it in the tooltip) only for my own fire spells?

Hope I don't ask too many or already answered questions. I tried searching for the answers myself but I couldn't succeed in it.

edit:
53/1/17 Affliction. Notes; recently changed to aff down from demo/ember, still a lot of hit gems sadly. I only raid 10man as I left 25man raiding.

Last edited by Neqael : 01/02/09 at 8:01 AM.

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Old 01/02/09, 8:28 AM   #481
krilz
Don Flamenco
 
krilz's Avatar
 
Orc Warlock
 
Laughing Skull (EU)
AFAIK, MC increases the effect of all Fire spells, whether they are being casted with the buff up or they're already active so if it procs, your current Immolate ticks will hit harder. I'm assuming also that MC only applies to you and not your pet since the buff is only active on the caster, and not a debuff on the target itself that would also increase your imp's damage.

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Old 01/02/09, 9:56 AM   #482
powerzone
Glass Joe
 
Ruyan
Human Warlock
 
Non-US/EU Server (EU)
What about a good build around shadowbolt?

Hi EJ,

And first of all thank you for the great advice and comments I find on this forum.
Now... I would like to try and build a good 10-man raiding build around the shadowbolt, meaning, trying to make the shadowbolt as the main nuke spell. I have been playing around with a 51point demobuild, but our guild is mostly raiding with melee characters, so they have no benefit from the Demonic Pact.

I'm also doing a lot of heroics, so there I also like a spec with good viability, while not underperforming in raids. Next to that... I just love the shadowbolt way more compared to incinerate. (and any fire damage, on a RP server you know...)

Unfortunately good shadowbolts require destro talents, not much in the destro tree that likes the shadowbolt, except maybe S&F.

So I was thinking of a real hybrid build...

http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/talents/warlock/talents.htmltal=035022200102351005000000000000000000000000000000000000055033015220001 300235000000

Would such a build make any sense at all? Or would it be better to go full demo and pimp up the FG as much as possible so he benefits from all the melee buffs around?

Thanks for the advice!

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Old 01/02/09, 10:18 AM   #483
turturin
Don Flamenco
 
Orc Warlock
 
Destromath
I'm confused. If you want to cast dots, go full affliction/ruin. Shadowbolt will be your main nuke. If you only like "a few dots", Metamorph/Ruin will likely perform better overall and have more versatility for heroics and grinding than the build you linked.

To answer the question on the build you linked in isolation...yes it should do "ok" dpswise. Give it a try and see if you like it. I don't know why you'd put points in soul leech and not improved immolate though, especially when you have siphon life and are taking molten core.

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Old 01/02/09, 12:29 PM   #484
Tinava
Piston Honda
 
Tinava's Avatar
 
Human Warlock
 
Scarlet Crusade
Here's one for you, I think it's simple, but I'd like some other opinions from my own.

Lets say you have a 25 man raid, with no boomkin or unholy DK. Two warlocks, one a 30/41, and one a 56/0/15 (basically, has improved COE). Who would be the best person to put up COE in this case? My reasoning is the afflock, as they have the improved talent, which benefits the overall raid. Is my reasoning incorrect, and if so, please explain.

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Old 01/02/09, 3:23 PM   #485
Krathis
Von Kaiser
 
Krathis's Avatar
 
Undead Warlock
 
Cenarion Circle
Not only does the affliction warlock have malediction the 0/31/40 (I'm assuming that's the 31/40 build you're referring too) will see better molten core uptime if they can use curse of agony and corruption which is a pretty substantial dps increase for a fire build.

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Old 01/03/09, 9:45 PM   #486
PSGarak
Bald Bull
 
PSGarak's Avatar
 
Undead Warlock
 
Hyjal
Originally Posted by krilz View Post
AFAIK, MC increases the effect of all Fire spells, whether they are being casted with the buff up or they're already active so if it procs, your current Immolate ticks will hit harder. I'm assuming also that MC only applies to you and not your pet since the buff is only active on the caster, and not a debuff on the target itself that would also increase your imp's damage.
DoTs tend to do damage with respect to the buffs you had active only at the moment of cast. Does Molten Core really work differently for no good reason? Or did they redesign that to only apply to spellpower buffs and not percent effects.


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Old 01/04/09, 1:31 AM   #487
Caddar
Glass Joe
 
Human Warlock
 
Silver Hand
Is there such a thing as too much haste? I'm reaching close to 600 haste rating right now, and I'm thinking its time to stop picking up items with haste and go for crit. Leiulier values seem odd to me, since even with my gear its still valuing haste points more than double the value or crit with a 0/31/40 build

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Old 01/04/09, 5:15 AM   #488
jsemon2
Glass Joe
 
Human Warlock
 
Greymane
i know the hit rating cap. is the rule still apply as it did in bc, in that you do afflic until your hit cap, then you can go to destro?

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Old 01/04/09, 4:02 PM   #489
Hexin
Glass Joe
 
Undead Warlock
 
Shandris
Originally Posted by jsemon2 View Post
i know the hit rating cap. is the rule still apply as it did in bc, in that you do afflic until your hit cap, then you can go to destro?
It's much easier to hit cap in wotlk than it was in tbc, so it's not really an issue. Affliction has higher dps potential on bosses if you are good at multitasking; if you don't like juggling multiple timers, a destro variation is better for you.

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Old 01/04/09, 6:14 PM   #490
Lominen
Von Kaiser
 
Orc Warlock
 
Kazzak (EU)
Originally Posted by Hexin View Post
It's much easier to hit cap in wotlk than it was in tbc, so it's not really an issue. Affliction has higher dps potential on bosses if you are good at multitasking; if you don't like juggling multiple timers, a destro variation is better for you.
Not sure I agree on this. It might be practice, but I find it a lot easier rotating dots on a boss instead of watching timers to pinpoint your Conflag, having to BD, then swap to SF if under BL, always make sure to fire CB asap after CD expires etc. Also despite what people say I find Aff to be a lot more forgiving if you have a bit higher MS. It is much less clinical to keep rolling properly.

Tonight I ran as destro for the first half of Naxx25 (20/51) but after Loatheb I simply found myself frustrated with the low dps and the annoying rotations, not to mention the spam of shards on Soulfires. Jumped back to Aff and to the top of the meters.

Aff is by far the best choice atm, unless ppl are so handicapped from SB-spamming, then demo might be the way to go. Destro is not worth it to me at least.

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Old 01/04/09, 7:11 PM   #491
Hexin
Glass Joe
 
Undead Warlock
 
Shandris
Well I wasn't thinking about multitasking in terms of the rotation alone, but the rotation in conjunction with environmental hazards. I find it much harder to pay attention to void zones, etc, in Sarth with 3 drakes up while juggling dots as affliction and my dps suffers terribly, so I've been specing destro for that fight. I'm sure others are better at it than I am though.

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Old 01/05/09, 12:51 PM   #492
Damphair
Von Kaiser
 
Undead Warlock
 
Uldaman
Originally Posted by jsemon2 View Post
i know the hit rating cap. is the rule still apply as it did in bc, in that you do afflic until your hit cap, then you can go to destro?
The WotLK environment is quite different from the TBC for most classes, and this includes warlocks. There are many good posts in this thread alone, not to mention the others in the forum, that talk about new variants for the WotLK environment. I think you'd get a much better idea on what to do if you spend some time reading those.

My personal experience is that at lower-end gear (dungeon blues, 2 pieces of badge-vendor gears), I seem to have equal dps on both 56 /0/15 and 0/41/30 if my pet survives. On many fights, though, Felguards die very fast, so it gimps your dps. So I have been using an Affliction build. If the fight is anti-pet, I switch out the fel-puppy with the imp and put him in phase-out. I tried the 0/30/41 fire build at hit cap against a practice dummy, and my dps is lower (1.3k) than either the afflic or felguard spec (1.7k each). I did the test on the same set of hit-capped gear, against the ???? practice dummy. I think perhaps later on, when I get better gear, I can maintain hit-cap without having to sacrifice spell power and/or crit, the fire build might perform better. But right now, afflic gives me the best dps for my gear level.

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Old 01/05/09, 10:14 PM   #493
Naforce
Piston Honda
 
Human Warlock
 
Frostmane (EU)
Quick and easy question. Should I or should I not use drain soul < 25% if I am using any 0/41/30 or similiar tree (no talents in affli), and should I or should I not use corruption? Based on what I've read, the latter part of the precious sentance needs to be discussed, calculated and tried out. Although, I heard somewhere that Blizzard will be changing the coefficient from .13 or so to .2, I guess that would make it worth casting anyway.

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Old 01/06/09, 12:41 AM   #494
turturin
Don Flamenco
 
Orc Warlock
 
Destromath
Originally Posted by Naforce View Post
Quick and easy question. Should I or should I not use drain soul < 25% if I am using any 0/41/30 or similiar tree (no talents in affli), and should I or should I not use corruption? Based on what I've read, the latter part of the precious sentance needs to be discussed, calculated and tried out. Although, I heard somewhere that Blizzard will be changing the coefficient from .13 or so to .2, I guess that would make it worth casting anyway.
right now, you should not use drain soul as 41/30.

Use of corruption is arguable.

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Old 01/06/09, 10:30 AM   #495
Livion
Glass Joe
 
Undead Warlock
 
Bloodscalp (EU)
question

As an affliction warlock I'm having some issues with an excess of threat.
I know there's a talent for that, but I'd rather be spending my talent points on talents which increase my dps.

There are two different cloack enchants which reduce the threat.

-Scroll of Enchant Cloak - Subtlety
Use: Permanently enchant a cloak to decrease threat from all attacks and spells by 2%.

-Scroll of Enchant Cloak - Wisdom
Use: Permanently enchant a cloak to reduce threat slightly and increase Spirit by 10. Requires a level 60 or higher item.

Is the threat reduction the same for the both of them or is the second one better?

There is a meta gem which reduces threat by 2%, does it stack with cloak enchants?

Also I would like to know if the trinket from sapphiron 25 is a good trinket for affliction warlocks (extract of necromatic power)
or should I aim for other trinkets?


And last of all is there an addon which warns you when the target is below 25% for drain soul?

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Old 01/06/09, 10:49 AM   #496
duhwhat
Piston Honda
 
Undead Warlock
 
Area 52
Originally Posted by Livion View Post
And last of all is there an addon which warns you when the target is below 25% for drain soul?
MikScrollingBattleText, available on WoWInterface.com can easily be configured to alert you when the target is below 25%. I have it configured to play a sound and display a text alert when target health is 25%.

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Old 01/06/09, 11:18 AM   #497
Lominen
Von Kaiser
 
Orc Warlock
 
Kazzak (EU)
Originally Posted by Livion View Post
Is the threat reduction the same for the both of them or is the second one better?

There is a meta gem which reduces threat by 2%, does it stack with cloak enchants?

Also I would like to know if the trinket from sapphiron 25 is a good trinket for affliction warlocks (extract of necromatic power)
or should I aim for other trinkets?
The threat reduction of the 2 enchants are similar, both 2%. The metagem stacks with the enchant and the trinket is excellent imo. At least in the top5 of trinkets in the game. But ofc. if you have IotDS and Dying Curse/EotS then those are definately better

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Old 01/06/09, 11:57 AM   #498
duhwhat
Piston Honda
 
Undead Warlock
 
Area 52
Originally Posted by Krathis View Post
I'd use Glyph of Corruption or Glyph of Imp over CoA for a full affliction build. For a detailed explanation of why dig around in the Glyph Choice thread. Page six has some good arguments on why you don't want to use Glyph of Agony.
Blacksen seemed to get quite emotional about CoA in that post, but I would disagree that Corruption is so much less garbage than CoA. Under perfect circumstances glyphing Corruption is about 20 DPS more than glyphing CoA. However, I believe there is a tangible benefit to lengthening CoA, namely that it becomes closer in duration to SL, allowing them to be "paired" in a fashion similar (though obviously not identical due to the remaining 2 second difference) to UA and Immolate pairing. I would imagine his 1000 dps difference is due to subtle playstyle factors and/or not-so-subtle SE bugging. Glyphing CoA might help rotation management more than additional Nightfall procs.

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Old 01/06/09, 2:01 PM   #499
Auze
Glass Joe
 
Blood Elf Warlock
 
Icecrown
Originally Posted by Livion View Post
And last of all is there an addon which warns you when the target is below 25% for drain soul?
Drain Soul Warning - Addons - Curse

A must have, IMO. Be sure to rename the folder to get it to load. (Read the comments)

Playing Aff, I don't have time to look for scrolling text or anything else. I put this little window right above my button bar and it works beautifully.

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Old 01/06/09, 2:21 PM   #500
Mystearica
Von Kaiser
 
Mystearica's Avatar
 
Blood Elf Warlock
 
Magtheridon
Probably a dumb question, but does Improved Imp or Demonic Power (or even 2/2demonic power & 1/3imp imp) provide more dps to the imp?

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