Warlock: Simple Questions/Simple Answers - Page 22

Espilfovi · 01/09/09, 4:37 AM

I would resort to Rain of Fire if the tanks aren't quick enough on building up aggro, since SoC can lead to bursty threat generation if you get a chain explosion. But if the tanks have solid aggro SoC will most likely do more dps (if your willing to spam the button), its just that Rain of Fire only requires us to click where we want it and wait its channeling duration, giving you time to drink a cup of coffee ^^

Livion · 01/09/09, 8:33 AM

Originally Posted by CJTheran

I was in Naxx25 last night on my Hunter, and was watching the Warlocks do their damndest to stay at the bottom of the Recount DPS chart. I noticed that all of them, who were all affliction, were using Rain of Fire for AOE purposes. They cast not a single seed throughout the instance. Throughout TBC, I remembered 'locks reigning Kings of AOE because Seed was so good, and never touching Rain because it wasn't. While I know times had changed, I did not think Seed had, and I remembered other 'locks that I know to do well to use Seed. I asked why no one was seeding, and was given a response of "It's better because all the mobs are dead before Seed can proc" and "It's better because it says on EJ that it's better". Looking at the tool tips for the spells, it looks to me that Seed is strictly more useful, but I could be wrong, as I am a simple Hunter and raid by binding steady shot to everything and face rolling.

My question to you: Is Rain strictly superior to Seed, or are there times when one is appropriate and the other not, or are these Warlocks incorrect?

From What I've noticed it all depends on you're spec.
If you're destruction use rain of fire, if you're affliction use seed of corruption.
Both talent builds have talents which will buff the rain of fire or seed of corruption.
In general I've noticed affliction locks using seed of corruption do more damage then destruction locks using rain of fire.
It's true that when you use seed of corruption you will become oom pretty fast, But as an affliction lock you're most likely to have improved lifetap, so mana isn't really the issue

Melbuframa · 01/09/09, 10:30 AM

Originally Posted by CJTheran

My question to you: Is Rain strictly superior to Seed, or are there times when one is appropriate and the other not, or are these Warlocks incorrect?

Seed as others have said is much better then ROF as AFF but IMO currently there is not a fight that demands the high DPS of seed spamming. When I raid as aff I use RoF simply because every AOE pack of Naxx trash dies within 1 channel of it, it’s a set it and forget it spell. I use seed on adds in 3D Sarth but that’s about it.

Lominen · 01/09/09, 10:38 AM

For the people who dont see their seeds explode fast enough, aka before the packs go down, toss a shadowflame at the pack as soon as you are done applying. That makes the seed proc on command instead of having to wait. This is also very useful (though dangerous) on Gothik.

oresteez · 01/09/09, 12:42 PM

Originally Posted by Lominen

For the people who dont see their seeds explode fast enough, aka before the packs go down, toss a shadowflame at the pack as soon as you are done applying. That makes the seed proc on command instead of having to wait. This is also very useful (though dangerous) on Gothik.

Thanks for the tip--I forgot about Shadowflame.

I really like using Seed during Phase 1 of Kel'Thuzad. It's especially useful late in the phase, when you toss it on a slow moving skeleton and by the time he gets closer to the circle, he ends up taking out a few other skeletons and/or hitting an abom pretty hard.

Livion · 01/09/09, 2:46 PM

Originally Posted by Lominen

For the people who dont see their seeds explode fast enough, aka before the packs go down, toss a shadowflame at the pack as soon as you are done applying. That makes the seed proc on command instead of having to wait. This is also very useful (though dangerous) on Gothik.

I don't know if everyone knows this but for your seed to explode there has to be done 1518 damage to the target.
The damage that is needed to explode can be done from other players to that target. So from the moment that target has 1518 damage received you're seed of corruption will explode.

for example if a mage casts blizzard on a group and you cast seed, the damage of the blizzard will let you're seed explode. This way you just keep on spamming seed on that target and you're seed of corruption will explode instantly and deal a large amount of damage.

Personally I use seed of corruption from the moment they're are three or more targets. By the time you have applied al you're dots on that target, it is allready killed and you're dots didn't have a chance to apply damage.

Zaleiria · 01/09/09, 2:58 PM

Originally Posted by Livion

I don't know if everyone knows this but for your seed to explode there has to be done 1518 damage to the target.
The damage that is needed to explode can be done from other players to that target. So from the moment that target has 1518 damage received you're seed of corruption will explode.

It looks like you can't use Haunt or Drain Life though to help trigger seed if you have Everlasting Affliction though, since that'll reset the duration and damage counter. 8-) I guess it really does count it as a "corruption effect" across the board! (Obviously you can only have one corruption or seed of corruption up on a target.)

Syrene · 01/09/09, 5:59 PM

I have a quick warlock question as as hunter. When we're busy AoEing down trash in naxx what should my locks be using. I assumed seed but my locks have told me different.

Drison · 01/09/09, 6:31 PM

Originally Posted by Syrene

I have a quick warlock question as as hunter. When we're busy AoEing down trash in naxx what should my locks be using. I assumed seed but my locks have told me different.

Now that RoF crits it totally depends on spec. If you have a spec that has emberstorm RoF is going to be better. If your a affliction spec that has all the talents that buff seed seed is the better aoe for that warlock.

FalseMyrmidon · 01/09/09, 6:37 PM

Originally Posted by Drison

Now that RoF crits it totally depends on spec. If you have a spec that has emberstorm RoF is going to be better. If your a affliction spec that has all the talents that buff seed seed is the better aoe for that warlock.

It also depends on the number of targets since seed doesn't effect the target it was cast on.

amz370 · 01/09/09, 6:54 PM

Seed in a target rich environment (yea, I stole that from top gun, so sue me) is still probably the best dps in the game w/e spec you are.

nuibank · 01/09/09, 8:23 PM

Originally Posted by PSGarak

Improved Imp ups his DPS by the listed 30%. Demonic Power increases it by 1/3 (3/4 casting time is 4/3 damage done). So Demonic Power is a slightly higher damage boost for one less talent point. However, in finite-mana situations, Improved Imp increases the damage done in one mana pool by 30% and Demonic Power increases it by 0 (he casts the same number of firebolts for the same damage, just in a shorter amount of time). Note that JoW in particular does not affect this, as it's a per-attack proc. Demonic Power has a more favorable interaction with Empowered Imp uptime in non-mana-limited situations. I hope that's enough information for you to figure out for your own use.

Isn't 2/2 demonic power a it 1/4 IMP DPS increase instead of 1/3?

The casting time for firebolt listed on wowhead is 2.5. 2/2 in demonic power would result in a 2 second firebolt. So 4/5 casting time would end up being 5/4 damage done, which is a 25% increase. So each point in demonic power would be a 12.5% dps increase for the Imp. Or am I assuming something which is incorrect?

Leibniz · 01/09/09, 9:03 PM

One question I've been wondering about but never see brought up is our threat generation, especially as affliction spec. I've noticed from Omen my TPS seems incredibly high compared to other dps classes and I'm trying to figure out if it's just from the self-healing or if something is wrong with how our tps scales to dps?

At lower gear levels it wasn't so noticeable, but now it occasionally causes issues. I'd like to find some concrete numbers somewhere, as right now my only anecdotal evidence is from a Thaddius fight where the only person in the mid-90 threat range (besides me) was a fury warrior doing 9k dps to my 5.5k, and no one else was even close to us and the MT on the meters at the end.

Viper007Bond · 01/10/09, 7:53 AM

Warlocks have always generated buttloads of threat, even more so in WotLK. Get your guild to use a Prot Pally as the MT though and you shouldn't have any problems. Otherwise you may need to spec into the threat talents and even maybe the meta gem.

Leibniz · 01/10/09, 9:40 AM

My understanding was the pre-WotLK threat was mostly a function of our high dps and relatively low threat reduction talents. What I'm noticing as I'm gearing up is our tps to dps ratio as affliction seems to be significantly greater than 1, so as we gear up we seem to generate increasingly disproportionate threat. It's still nothing my group's warrior tank can't handle unless he's off the boss for some reason, but it's a little disturbing this early in the xpac when other classes can generate more dps with fewer threat problems. What I'd like to get is some concrete numbers on tps/dps ratios.

Also, pallies and DKs seem to have the most issues with single target threat as of right now. It looks like the patch might address some of them, but I have more trouble with warriors in AE than single target mode.

duhwhat · 01/10/09, 10:01 AM

Is it best to continue to use Nightfall procs sub 25%, or to use Drain Soul exclusively?

Viper007Bond · 01/10/09, 11:41 AM

Originally Posted by duhwhat

Is it best to continue to use Nightfall procs sub 25%, or to use Drain Soul exclusively?

Since DS hits harder than a SB when sub-25% and lots of DoTs are up, my guess is you should continue to DS.

Drakh · 01/10/09, 4:17 PM

Short question for Affliction :
I have 13% hit atm and +3 Moonkinhit in Raids.
I have one talentpoint left to distribute, should I put it in Eradication (from 1 to 2) and gem 1% more hit or put it in Cataclysm and gem instead of hit more dmg (should be about ~ 40dmg more with dmggems).

Or is 2/3 MC and 1/3 Eradication better than 1/3 and 2/3 Eradication ?

Is there a rule of thumb how much spellpower is worth in comparism with one percent in hit with Cataclysm/Suppression ?

rutiene · 01/10/09, 4:31 PM

Don't bother with Cataclysm. The first 2 points of Eradication and first point of MC are both worth more than Cataclysm.

ShaidarLock · 01/10/09, 5:49 PM

Originally Posted by Viper007Bond

Since DS hits harder than a SB when sub-25% and lots of DoTs are up, my guess is you should continue to DS.

I find that I do use NF procs below 25% but not purely for their dps. If I have a NF proc up I can wait a little longer for a DS tick before refreshing haunt since I'm not as worried about the double stack of SE falling off.

Naforce · 01/10/09, 5:52 PM

Originally Posted by Drakh

Short question for Affliction :
I have 13% hit atm and +3 Moonkinhit in Raids.
I have one talentpoint left to distribute, should I put it in Eradication (from 1 to 2) and gem 1% more hit or put it in Cataclysm and gem instead of hit more dmg (should be about ~ 40dmg more with dmggems).

Or is 2/3 MC and 1/3 Eradication better than 1/3 and 2/3 Eradication ?

Is there a rule of thumb how much spellpower is worth in comparism with one percent in hit with Cataclysm/Suppression ?

Have a glance at this post

mozed · 01/10/09, 9:27 PM

Thanks guys for your help so far!

Question #1: As an affliction lock, what should I be doing to maximize my DPS when heroism hits? Do I still focus on keeping dots up or do I spam SB until hero ends?

Question #2: Also -- on fights like Loatheb when you've got the spore buff, what should I be doing to maximize DPS? Should I disregard my dots rotation and spam him with SBs or should I just keep up the rotation?

Thanks!

Mystearica · 01/11/09, 1:44 PM

Originally Posted by mozed

Thanks guys for your help so far!

Question #1: As an affliction lock, what should I be doing to maximize my DPS when heroism hits? Do I still focus on keeping dots up or do I spam SB until hero ends?

Question #2: Also -- on fights like Loatheb when you've got the spore buff, what should I be doing to maximize DPS? Should I disregard my dots rotation and spam him with SBs or should I just keep up the rotation?

Thanks!

Answer to both questions is to keep your DoTs up at all times, unless the boss is at 1% or something of that nature.

Talimar · 01/11/09, 9:34 PM

Does the spore buff add to eradication as well?

amz370 · 01/11/09, 10:43 PM

Originally Posted by Talimar

Does the spore buff add to eradication as well?

I would assume so, as it effects base crit level of your character.