PVE Spec Discussion - Page 11

Bokkie · 11/27/08, 9:49 AM

Originally Posted by krilz

I'm pretty sure (but can't back it up though) that if you're at full hp, the Fel Armor will stop healing, just like you can't use a health potion or a healthstone at 100%, and thus you won't be able to proc it. This is sort of what makes me not get the trinket since I'm very often at full hp and don't want to be bothered with always staying under 100% for max effiency (also, it's a bit cumbersome to tell healers to never heal me up to 100%).

Unless parrot is buggered, Fel armor keeps ticking even if you are at 100%HP
I had to apply the filter because parrot kept spamming "Fel Armor +70 hp (overheal 70)"
Haven't checked the wow combat log itself though. Will do that later tonight.

Would be logical as well, since it just works as a hot, if you get a priest renew, it will keep on ticking, even if you are full HP

krilz · 11/27/08, 11:07 AM

Originally Posted by Bokkie

Unless parrot is buggered, Fel armor keeps ticking even if you are at 100%HP
I had to apply the filter because parrot kept spamming "Fel Armor +70 hp (overheal 70)"
Haven't checked the wow combat log itself though. Will do that later tonight.

Would be logical as well, since it just works as a hot, if you get a priest renew, it will keep on ticking, even if you are full HP

My combat log mentions nothing at full hp, neither does SCT.

Melbuframa · 11/27/08, 12:35 PM

Originally Posted by krilz

My combat log mentions nothing at full hp, neither does SCT.

I use EavesDrop and it does not show any ticks from FA at 100% either.

Aeetes · 11/27/08, 1:32 PM

I've been playing an affliction warlock for as long as I've had a warlock, except for PvP, and I love the new changes allowing for it to be less of a utility spec, but I'm having some difficulty adjusting my spec. Having always built my own specs, i have a solid knowledge of them (at least, i like to think so), but I'm still working out some kinks and I'd love some sound advice. Here's what I'm looking at now: Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

My glyphs are corruption, UA, and SL, but i plan on replacing UA with immolate as soon as i find someone who can make it...I notice there doesn't seem to be much favor towards SL, but i personally find having 800+ ticks that also heal me to be very useful. The only thing with this spec that I'm having trouble with is minor mana issues, which I've mostly solved by working lifetap into my rotation right after refreshing haunt in order to catch the return, i find this keeps my mana at a fairly consistent level, and dark pact helps prevent falling too low. The other issues include low range, simply because i don't have the spare points, and aggro issues...I've noticed affliction is generating a LOT of threat now.

If anyone has any suggestions for improvements, I'd love to hear them, I recently changed from Improved CoA to soul siphon after confirming my suspicions that DS would yield high results after the target is at 25% life, thanks to these forums. I also dropped points out of improved fel hunter to pick up slightly larger yields from ruin, as well as molten core, which i believe will be an excellent asset once i finally get glyph of immolate. I'm still struggling with if i should send my fel puppy in at all after its gotten killed a few times, it might just be too much to keep track of, hence dropping imp fel hunter, also mage and priest buffs should overwrite fel int anyway in a balenced raid, in which case I may as well use an imp so it cant get killed.

If theres any holes or obvious mistakes in this spec, please let me know.

Lillyanne · 11/27/08, 1:49 PM

I would like to see some solid full destro specs. I tried out the 2/3/50+ variant with empowered imp and backdraft and it actually did pretty well. But I had a few issues questions with it. I dunno if this should be posted in the Q&A thread or here, but here goes:

Is getting backdraft an absolute necessity, even if you are going full destro? I tried some testing the other night and I actually did mroe dps just spamming incinerate and immlates. ?

Now another big, and more current question I have is this:

I've seen 41/30 and 30/40 + 1 tossed around as solid dps specs. But I want to know is why not Meta Ruin? Why is 41/30 in partiuclar so much better than say 56/15? (Demo not Affliction)? Loooking at the talents in 41/30 you'd get MC (plus ten fire damage) and emberstorm, so you get a passive plus 25 to fire spells. But with Meta/Ruin you get 10% crit, 33% of ur crit plus for your demon, so in effect demonic pact procs more. and of coruse you get demonic pact.which in my case level gear now is another 140ish. spell power.

So 41/30 is better because psssive 25% dammge bonus > 10% crit and meta's 20% damage boost?

I tend to us emeta a lot in raids, in similar fashion that hunters user Rapid killing and BW. eveytime its off coooldown ill use it.

I ran kara last night with a bunch of high level 70's. We had 76's and up, boomkin, rogue, hunter, dk, pally, and I still ended up topping the dps chart with meta/ruin.

And before you ask..we were bored..really bored.

TheRedFox · 11/27/08, 1:53 PM

I have been playing with different specs since reaching 80, trying to get the best DPS out of my lock as possible. I have read through this entire thread, and would like to thank alot of you who have provided a great deal of information.

Now, personally I have found that Affliction 56/0/15, is bar none the DPS king, albeit only in the right situations and in Boss fights that are prolonged. I have found that on Trash mobs and short boss fights Affliction does very poor and is completely inconsistent, add to that anything that might delay your spell rotation, cause cast interruption, silence, ....ect....ect will dramatically decrease your DPS. I believe that in pure practical raiding that this spec will be situational at best, and not very viable as a solid main spec, where consistency is a must.

>Spell rotation = Haunt, CoA, Corr, UA, SB, SB, Haunt, Imm, UA....then pick up the pieces after that, as all of the fights change things abit.

>I like to add Imm, but I really want to stack SE as fast as possible, and try to cast Haunt first to gain the 20% buff to all my dots immediately. Any factual advise in my rotation would be greatly appreciated, I.E. any number crunchers that know how to absolutely maximize the rotation.

I like the 0/41/30 spec as it is much more consistent DPS wise, as long as you can keep your FG alive, learning the fights and being well informed helps a great deal to increase his longevity, although, and I am sure a lot of you would agree, that it would be nice to have a healer who actually made it a point to keep our minions alive. I hope that the word get around fast, as it would be nice to not have to worry about, and casting HF, is not viable as it stops DPS, and whats the good in that.

I have not yet given the 2/13/56 spec a try yet but after more testing the Aff spec, I will give it a go, as I really enjoy the Aff build, its alot of fun to play, as apposed to SB spamming of old, it really keeps you on your toes, and man is it nice to see those deep number pop up once and awhile. Also big ups to the first person to post a great spell rotation for this build.

One question that I do have is, what rotation of spells do you use on Trash Mobs as Aff, I find that things die to quickly to really pump out good DPS? This really kills overall DPS as Aff.

I really look forward to when/if we get to utilize the dual spec, being able to go Nuke or Sustained, would be GOD MODE.

Aeetes · 11/27/08, 2:05 PM

Originally Posted by TheRedFox

One question that I do have is, what rotation of spells do you use on Trash Mobs as Aff, I find that things die to quickly to really pump out good DPS? This really kills overall DPS as Aff.

I really look forward to when/if we get to utilize the dual spec, being able to go Nuke or Sustained, would be GOD MODE.

Spell rotation = Haunt, CoA, Corr, UA, SB, SB, Haunt, Imm, UA....then pick up the pieces after that, as the fights change things abit

I like to add Imm, but I really want to stack SE as fast as possible, and try to cast Haunt first to gain the 20% buff to all my dots immediately. Any factual advise in my rotation would be greatly appreciated.

Personally, as an aff lock, when it comes to trash i don't do a lot. I haven't yet raided at 80, but in heroics I've been dropping CoA, corr, haunt, SB, then DS, unless its a high helath mob, in which case i come closer to my full rotation.

As for the rotation itself, I like to start out with a curse, allowing the tank to get an initial threat build, then SB, haunt, corr, UA, immo, SB spam, rinse repeat. I think getting the 2 charges of shadows embrace off immediately is a good idea personally.

Batuk · 11/27/08, 4:48 PM

Just did a 25man with 2 affliction locks, and debuffs were dropping. I lost shadow embrace, he lost shadow embrace and siphon life. Meaning not only are we loosing dots, we're lowering the raids dmg by pushing off their dots.

Seriously annoyed right now, I guess I'll be looking into felguard/destro again

Havik0 · 11/27/08, 5:46 PM

Originally Posted by Lorelai

You want to use Infernal for the last minute of the fight. If its a one minute fight, drop it instantly, if its a 10 min fight, you will probably drop it at around 12% etc. The reason that you want to end the fight with the infernal rather than starting it is of course that you dont want to spend 9-10 seconds casting an imp or a fel puppy.

I guess I missed something important too (even though I have read this thread multiple times now). Why would you use an infernal in the first place? Origianlly, didn't they just plain suck?
Also, you can't use them indoors so are we talking about using them in raids, mobs, etc? Once again, I may sound like a complete noob by asking all these questions, but I am generally confused about this Infernal situation.
Any information will be appreciated, thank you in advance.

Turbo Moses · 11/27/08, 6:36 PM

Originally Posted by Havik0

I guess I missed something important too (even though I have read this thread multiple times now). Why would you use an infernal in the first place? Origianlly, didn't they just plain suck?
Also, you can't use them indoors so are we talking about using them in raids, mobs, etc? Once again, I may sound like a complete noob by asking all these questions, but I am generally confused about this Infernal situation.
Any information will be appreciated, thank you in advance.

You can use them indoors now, but I don't know what kind of DPS they put out, I'm gonna go log on and summon one right now to see.

Deviattor · 11/27/08, 6:38 PM

Originally Posted by Havik0

I guess I missed something important too (even though I have read this thread multiple times now). Why would you use an infernal in the first place? Origianlly, didn't they just plain suck?
Also, you can't use them indoors so are we talking about using them in raids, mobs, etc? Once again, I may sound like a complete noob by asking all these questions, but I am generally confused about this Infernal situation.
Any information will be appreciated, thank you in advance.

Infernals were buffed with 3.0, you can login and try it yourself. One of the main changes is that the cooldown is much shorter and the Infernal itself is more powerful. Doomguards have also changed.

If you check this post in the Warlock WWS Help and Analysis thread you will see that the Infernal actually contributed more in 1 minute than the Felhunter did in 2.5 minutes, along with approximate damage figures.

smoo86 · 11/27/08, 7:38 PM

Here are our WWS stats of Naxxramas 25, Military Quarter -> Kel'Thuzad. I played as 56/0/15 - 2nd raid at all (my nick is smoo). Boltimore is 56/0/15 too. Had about 1-3% miss depending on the crappy caster support (no shaman? no shadow? boonkin not all the time? :/)

Wow Web Stats

Rotation start:
Corr, CoA, UA, Immo, SL, Haunt -> whatever drops. Didnt have Soul Embrace all the time, had to share with the other warlock. UA + Immo are synched, so sometimes (or often...) the last ticks were capped. :/

Aeetes · 11/27/08, 10:47 PM

Originally Posted by Batuk

Just did a 25man with 2 affliction locks, and debuffs were dropping. I lost shadow embrace, he lost shadow embrace and siphon life. Meaning not only are we loosing dots, we're lowering the raids dmg by pushing off their dots.

Seriously annoyed right now, I guess I'll be looking into felguard/destro again

wait so you mean the debuff table is filling up? that's pretty much not cool...

PsyBomb · 11/28/08, 12:43 AM

I'm not surprised. Without even getting into DKs (who use a minimum of 2-3 slots each), a single affliction warlock can be responsible for 6 (Corruption, Curse, SE, Haunt, Immolate, UA). Even with a number of debuffs being made into buffs (as per ISB), that's still WAY too many to fit comfortably. That makes me sad, as I love Affliction (even though it feels like I have to chug 3 Jolts to get the twitch reactions needed nowadays).

In essence, the Debuff system has to change dramatically or the slots have to be increased to 60-ish if the raid wants to bring more than one Afflicter or Unholy DK to the party.

• dragon12 · 11/28/08, 3:22 AM

In one of these warlock threads, someone mentioned that they thought the debuff cap had gone up to 50. This is definitely not the case - we were stuck at 40 all through last night.