Dots and you: The Affliction Warlock Thread - Page 31

Xera81 · 01/27/09, 11:31 AM

DG summons no longer kill anyone.. they do however do a bit of damage to one of the summoners not loads but a bit.
It takes 5 people to click on the altar to summon a DG.
Doing this *during* a fight would be sheer lunacy and as such can only be done in a preparation for a boss fight before the pull.
He no longer requires enslaving after the summon either and after 15 mins of use simply dissapears.

In short. yes it is very worth summoning him on certain fights if you are affliction specced.

For FG specs the fg is still stronger and needed for your buffs.

Destro.. im just not sure. Personally i feel it would be a waste of imp talents.
Perhaps if you have DS in the build.. it might be worth sacking the imp and summoning one .. but I have seen no numbers on the subject of Destro / DG viability.

krilz · 01/27/09, 11:46 AM

No deep Destruction-spec includes DS (but rather goes for Chaos Bolt) so that discussion is out. Also, personally I never summon a DG as Destruction considering how much talents is spent for the Imp (Imp. Imp, Emp. Imp, DP, not to mention the glyph) and the fact that it even buffs you if it crits. Someone is very welcome to do some serious testing though, but I highly doubt it's worth it in the long run. Infernal on the last minute is still very good.

inktomi · 01/27/09, 11:59 AM

Thank you for this! I'll have to try out the doomguard on our next naxx run. I wish the tooltip was a bit better worded so it was clearer that all the person in the grp takes is a HP hit and not death anymore.

Originally Posted by Xera81

DG summons no longer kill anyone.. they do however do a bit of damage to one of the summoners not loads but a bit.
It takes 5 people to click on the altar to summon a DG.
Doing this *during* a fight would be sheer lunacy and as such can only be done in a preparation for a boss fight before the pull.
He no longer requires enslaving after the summon either and after 15 mins of use simply dissapears.

In short. yes it is very worth summoning him on certain fights if you are affliction specced.

For FG specs the fg is still stronger and needed for your buffs.

Destro.. im just not sure. Personally i feel it would be a waste of imp talents.
Perhaps if you have DS in the build.. it might be worth sacking the imp and summoning one .. but I have seen no numbers on the subject of Destro / DG viability.

Shocktar · 01/27/09, 12:00 PM

I considered PMing this, but I think it's important for us all to know: How did you get your Doomguard to show up as yours on WWS? Did they fix this, or is there some trick?

Morrigan · 01/27/09, 12:25 PM

Originally Posted by Shocktar

I considered PMing this, but I think it's important for us all to know: How did you get your Doomguard to show up as yours on WWS? Did they fix this, or is there some trick?

Just copy&paste a SPELL_SUMMON line (e.g. from Summon Felhunter) and replace the Pet UID/Name with the one of your Doomguard (see here).

Cyggs · 01/27/09, 12:47 PM

Originally Posted by HF-Decay

Which would you consider better, Embrace of the Spider or Sundial of the Exiled? and why?
When casting Drain Soul I noticed that my ticks have huge variance on damage[...]

- I use Sundial over Embrace, Leulier's Spreadsheet ranks it 11dps on top; for further information see Trinket Discussion.
- Maybe just your Sundial of the Exiled procced during different DS-Casts.
- Please post on WWS Help Analysis next time.

HF-Decay · 01/27/09, 1:51 PM

Originally Posted by Cyggs

- I use Sundial over Embrace, Leulier's Spreadsheet ranks it 11dps on top; for further information see Trinket Discussion.
- Maybe just your Sundial of the Exiled procced during different DS-Casts.
- Please post on WWS Help Analysis next time.

Thanks and sorry for posting in the wrong thread, thought it'd be appropriate in here.

I also had a feeling the Sundial would be better.

Also for the people asking about the Doomguard:
- It's summoned from Ritual of Doom, not through Curse of Doom.
- Nobody dies from the spell, but one person takes around 10k damage (probably % of health).
- It's definitely worth using whenever it's ready, and a must for bosses that require good dps.

sxk · 01/27/09, 9:06 PM

I'm working on improving my dot uptime and was wondering at what point do peopel usually start recasting. For example, if it takes 1.3s to cast a spell and 1 sec for it to hit, do you start recasting when the spell has 2.3sec left? Also, ss there an addon that can be used to track how long it takes between the time you cast a spell and the time it hits?

fallenman · 01/28/09, 9:50 AM

Originally Posted by Namnalia

Base stats:

Everything of green color is what current high end gear would give.

unbuffed:

~250 / 468 spirit
~1400 / 2130 spell power
10% / 17.7% Haste
10% / 12.5% Hit
10% / 13.77% Crit
0 / 0 MP5

This should be more or less what your stats are like when you step into Naxxramas for the first time.
This should be more or less what your stats are like when you step into Ulduar for the first time.

An optimal raid setup (and almost all setups are nearly optimal now) gives you:

Raidbuffs:

+3% damage (Sanctified Retribution, Ferocious Inspiration)
+91MP5 (Blessing of Wisdom)
+5% crit chance (Moonkin Aura, Elemental Oath)
+5% spell haste (Wrath of Air Totem)
+144 (or more) spell power (Flametongue Totem, Totem of Wrath, Demonic Pact, Improved Divine Spirit)
(+1% hit chance if you are alliance and have a draenei in your group.)
Stat multiplier 110% (Blessing of Kings)
+64 (or more) spirit (Divine Spirit, Fel Intelligence)
+48 (or more) intelligence (Fel Intelligence, Arcane Intellect)

Self buffs:

Fel Armor: (180 + 30% spirit) spell power
Flask of the Frostwyrm +125 spell power
Bufffood: 36 spell power for the "normal" bufffood.
Professions: Two "good" professions will give about 38 spell power each, so this is another 76 spell power.
Demonic Spellstone: +1.83% haste plus the dot improvement.

Debuffs:

+13% damage (Curse of Elements, Earth & Moon, Ebon Plaguebringer)
+10% crit chance (Improved Scorch, Winter's Chill)
+3% Crit taken (Totem of Wrath, Master Poisoner, Heart of the Crusader)
+3% hit chance (Improved Faerie Fire, Misery)

This changes the stats fully raid-buffed to:

345 / 585 spirit
~2000 / 3004 spell power
15% / 22.7% spell haste
13% / 15.5% hit chance
15% / 18.77% crit chance

Is it just me, or are you counting the moonkin aura twice? You have the base chance to crit here increased by 5% with buffs, yet you add in the moonkin 5% buff again later in your DPCT calculations.

And I mention this, because it makes it look like immolate should be cast below 25% when it really shouldn't. If you adjust your DPCT for immolate and remove the extra 5% crit, the DPCT falls to roughly 150 more than drain soul. But what's not factored in to your calculations is that immolate does not affect soul siphon, and with the mechanics of having to refresh dots along with using a 3 second base tick channel filler spell, immolate becomes more of a dps loss than a help at that point.

I recommend to locks in my guides and in forum posts that they drop immolate below 25% for the above reasons. The DPCT is much closer than what you calculated due to the 5% crit error.

Also, I see you're using a 90% uptime for molten core, so I have to ask what spec you're using? The top dps specs will not have more than 1 point in molten core, which would be closer to a 68% uptime. This is also artificially inflating the number to favor immolate. Factor that in, and I'm willing to bet the DPCT comes almost even with drain soul.

Namnalia · 01/28/09, 10:26 AM

Unfortunately, it is not just you :-)

You are right about the double moonkin stuff, changed it now, thx.

It did not affect Immolate's damage very much as most of its damage comes from the dot. (Even more when you glyph it, and most people do).
I'm still convinced that Immolate is not wasted below 25%. It has higher dpct. The dots have higher dpct, too, so you do not reapply them for soul siphon, you reapply them for damage. Of course it will cost you DS uptime, but DS is still just a filler and has fewer dpct than every other spell but SB.

Edit: Of course, if you spec one point less into MC or do not equip the Immolate glyph, you are right.

Shocktar · 01/28/09, 2:22 PM

Are the gloves of token respect completely off the hand armor list for a reason? I can't believe new calculations have dropped them below 10th best, despite the lack of hit.

Arnath · 01/28/09, 3:20 PM

The gloves are on the list at #4 and #9 respectively ...

Moror · 01/29/09, 5:57 AM

Lots of mention of Doomguards and I just want to post a little clarification as it seems to be missing:

What people have said about the ritual is correct, it does summon the Doomguard for 15 mins, without killing a summoning member and under your control from the get go.
However something people don't seem to have realised is that Curse of Doom was changed recently, possibly with patch 3.0, not sure, and at the moment it has a 100% chance to summon a Doomguard as long as the damage from CoD is the KILLING BLOW.
So of course this means in a typical raid environment its much faster just to summon, plus it saves having to enslave it.

hbalsack · 01/29/09, 10:12 AM

Edit: misread previous post

NinjaSquirrel · 01/29/09, 10:34 AM

When reviewing the specs on the first post of this thread, I have a question about the one labeled highest dps (besides it not being in English). Does having full points into Fel Concentration grant a dps increase over 1 point into Amplify Curse?