Trinket Discussion - Page 20

Xeephran · 03/06/09, 11:01 AM

Originally Posted by Viper007Bond

RoF triggering it per-hit would be crazy OP.

Thats not what Yeda proposed. Read again: "Initial hit" means adding one stack for the first damage component of the channeled spell, much as you yourself suggest right after:

However adding a stack per cast would be reasonable as otherwise casting an AoE or two would pretty much wipe out your stacks, thoroughly nerfing your DPS.

Everyone is pretty much in agreement how this spell should work.

Peppermort · 03/10/09, 1:14 AM

Originally Posted by Viper007Bond

RoF triggering it per-hit would be crazy OP. However adding a stack per cast would be reasonable as otherwise casting an AoE or two would pretty much wipe out your stacks, thoroughly nerfing your DPS.

[Darkmoon Card: Crusade] used to stack from each hit of Seed of Corruption. It was quite a nice trinket for raiding Mount Hyjal since it would be fully stacked after the first explosion. I haven't noticed recently if it still behaves in the same way, and I think I've now sold it to a vendor after upgrading it to IDS. I don't recall if it stacked off RoF or not, since throughout BC, that spell was only for playing around in Ironforge or in the Alterac Valley starting cave. It never stacked out of combat through Life Tap or Health Funnel, though.

Viper007Bond · 03/10/09, 2:54 AM

Originally Posted by Xeephran

Thats not what Yeda proposed. Read again: "Initial hit" means adding one stack for the first damage component of the channeled spell, much as you yourself suggest right after:

Everyone is pretty much in agreement how this spell should work.

Ah, I did indeed misread the post. My apologies.

Eph · 03/10/09, 10:46 AM

Originally Posted by Delc

(dmg * (1-crit_rate) + (dmg *1.5) * crit_rate) / seconds_between_procs = dps
(2000 * 0.65 + 3000 * 0.35) / 50 = 47

The simpler version is

(dmg *(1 + .5 * crit_rate))/time = dps

I've seen conflicting reports of the ICD being 15 or 30 seconds now. Can anyone confirm this?

ssongraistln · 03/19/09, 2:11 PM

Originally Posted by Eph

I've seen conflicting reports of the ICD being 15 or 30 seconds now. Can anyone confirm this?

It's still 45 sec. on PTR atm.

Valora · 03/27/09, 12:12 AM

Originally Posted by Peppermort

[Darkmoon Card: Crusade] used to stack from each hit of Seed of Corruption. It was quite a nice trinket for raiding Mount Hyjal since it would be fully stacked after the first explosion. I haven't noticed recently if it still behaves in the same way, and I think I've now sold it to a vendor after upgrading it to IDS. I don't recall if it stacked off RoF or not, since throughout BC, that spell was only for playing around in Ironforge or in the Alterac Valley starting cave. It never stacked out of combat through Life Tap or Health Funnel, though.

I find it weird that RoF does not work with IDS nowaday because Darkmoon Card: Crusade does and preWotLK I'm pretty sure it didn't, not with RoF or Hellfire. So it confuses me that I can easily get a full stack of Crusade with one RoF cast but not the same with IDS. Blizzard isn't known for retrospective buffing so I'm not sure why Crusade works with RoF all of a sudden, or perhaps it always did and my memory fails me.

Zed · 03/27/09, 12:38 AM

Originally Posted by Valora

I find it weird that RoF does not work with IDS nowaday because Darkmoon Card: Crusade does and preWotLK I'm pretty sure it didn't, not with RoF or Hellfire. So it confuses me that I can easily get a full stack of Crusade with one RoF cast but not the same with IDS. Blizzard isn't known for retrospective buffing so I'm not sure why Crusade works with RoF all of a sudden, or perhaps it always did and my memory fails me.

IDS needs to work with healing spells, so they had to implement different restrictions to prevent it from working with any spell. There were a few iterations when they started changing it and it seems they haven't come up with a better solution yet.

Knasen · 03/28/09, 4:59 AM

I recently got Embrace of the Spider and is know trying to decide wheter its better than Sundial or not. From a pure theorectical point of view the embrace should beat Sundial by quite alot. Im however specced affliction so with eradiction up and trinket proccing Im suddenly above the hastecap so the trinket proc is partly wasted. Same is of course true during heroism. Anyone input would be thankful

Viper007Bond · 03/28/09, 10:02 AM

Originally Posted by Knasen

I recently got Embrace of the Spider and is know trying to decide wheter its better than Sundial or not. From a pure theorectical point of view the embrace should beat Sundial by quite alot. Im however specced affliction so with eradiction up and trinket proccing Im suddenly above the hastecap so the trinket proc is partly wasted. Same is of course true during heroism. Anyone input would be thankful

Spider hands down. The constant spell power is better than hoping the Sundial procs while you're applying DoTs and not casting SB's.

And the haste cap is 1639, so I don't think you have to worry about too much haste.

calderstrake · 03/30/09, 2:41 AM

Originally Posted by Valora

I find it weird that RoF does not work with IDS nowaday because Darkmoon Card: Crusade does and preWotLK I'm pretty sure it didn't, not with RoF or Hellfire. So it confuses me that I can easily get a full stack of Crusade with one RoF cast but not the same with IDS. Blizzard isn't known for retrospective buffing so I'm not sure why Crusade works with RoF all of a sudden, or perhaps it always did and my memory fails me.

Just to offer supporting evidence; IDS doesn't work with Hurricane either. It seems the heart of the matter is whether it should proc on AoE spells or not. I can see reasons to support both sides.

Aykazar · 04/03/09, 4:28 AM

Originally Posted by trismegistus

Just to offer supporting evidence; IDS doesn't work with Hurricane either. It seems the heart of the matter is whether it should proc on AoE spells or not. I can see reasons to support both sides.

When you consider that Health Funnel works with IDS (which is a very cheap way to pre-stack it) and if I recall correctly, the first stack of hellfire also procs IDS I would say that rain of fire not proccing it most likely a bug in the way it procs.

Paks · 04/03/09, 5:03 AM

Originally Posted by Viper007Bond

Spider hands down. The constant spell power is better than hoping the Sundial procs while you're applying DoTs and not casting SB's.

And the haste cap is 1639, so I don't think you have to worry about too much haste.

Haste cap is 1639, but with Eradication (655.8 Haste Rating on Proc) and Embrace of the Spider (505 Haste Rating on Proc) both up at the same time, you only need 479+ Haste Rating to be over the cap. Given that I know fresh-80 Warlocks with more Haste than that, it's a legitimate concern.

I agree with you that Embrace is the way to go, but when taking procs into account, haste cap is rather easy to reach and exceed, and would in fact impact the usefulness of Embrace.

Thorough · 04/03/09, 5:08 PM

I have noticed no one has mentioned [Majestic Dragon Figurine] at all. With Fel Armor currently granting 30% of my spirit as spellpower and the new glyph in 3.1, Glyph of Life Tap (20% of my spirit to spellpower when I tap), is this trinket truly undeserving of any mention? In the current patch it is approximately 56 spellpower and in 3.1 it will be 90 spellpower. Is this a trinket worth considering while I wait for [Illustration of the Dragon Soul]?

Arnath · 04/04/09, 12:38 AM

Firstly, it's worse than the other epic trinkets you can get (like Sundial, Embrace of the Spider, etc). Secondly, it's MUCH better for a healer than it is for you. You taking that trinket is effectively the equivalent of a healer taking Illustration.

Warlocomotif · 04/04/09, 7:20 AM

Originally Posted by Arnath

Firstly, it's worse than the other epic trinkets you can get (like Sundial, Embrace of the Spider, etc). Secondly, it's MUCH better for a healer than it is for you. You taking that trinket is effectively the equivalent of a healer taking Illustration.

I think thats a pretty heavy understatement, Illustration of the Dragonsoul is far better for healers than the Majestic Dragon Figurine is for DPS.