The Mage Equivalent: The Destruction Warlock - Page 54

Grimrage · 03/24/09, 11:34 AM

Originally Posted by tuberqlosis

I was putting together a destro spec that picks up all the possible imp buffs except Unholy Power, and then it came time to decide on glyphs and destro looks like it has a ton of awesome glyphs. I feel glyphing CB and conflag are all but given, as it puts CB on the same CD as conflag, and conflag's usefulness is well-known. My question is what glyph is best for the last slot: glyph of imp, glyph of immolate, or glyph of incinerate?

The Immolate glyph is the best of the three with Incinerate being next and Imp being last. They all fall short when compared to the combination of the Immolate, Conflagrate and Life Tap glyphs, however.

Daimonas · 03/24/09, 8:10 PM

Originally Posted by tuberqlosis

I feel glyphing CB and conflag are all but given, as it puts CB on the same CD as conflag

This isn't exactly true, because the CD of chaos bolt will only begin after the cast.
Ignoring haste ratings you would get a timeline like this:

0.0 : Cast Conflag
1.5 : Begin casting Chaos bolt
2.9 : Chaos bolt is cast (1.4 secs casting time due to backdraft)
10.0: Conflag CD is ready
12.9: Chaos bolt CD is ready

Which means that with the glyph CB cooldown "lags" 1.4 seconds behind the cooldown of conflag (would be 3.4 secs without the glyph). If you want to perfectly synchronize the two spells you will have to postpone casting conflag to cover for that gap.
It's doable, but it means that you dont get backdraft every 10 seconds

On another issue, I'm wondering: why you don't consider glyph of life tap?

Soulzar · 03/25/09, 1:58 PM

Originally Posted by tuberqlosis

I feel glyphing CB and conflag are all but given, as it puts CB on the same CD as conflag, and conflag's usefulness is well-known.

As the posted above me stated, the cast time of CB messes up cooldown sync with conflag and really doesnt work out to an advantage. I have found however that CB syncs extremely well with Immolate. Using it to fill in that gray area where one more incin may end up hitting the target after immo has fallen off, but if you refresh immo you'll be clipping.

Using conflag its actually not looking to hard to keep a large portion inside the 5 second rule for Fire and Brimstone. When conflag is on cooldown I can cast CB, Immo, conflag... when conflag is not on cooldown I can conflag, CB, immo. Just rotate between those two every other rotation.

This may not be the most optimal rotation as while I use conflag on cooldown, chaos Bolt sometimes sits for 2 seconds before being recast, however in terms of your desire to line up cooldowns this is what I have found to work well in my limited testing

AS mentioned the best glyphs seem to be Immolate, conflag and lifetap. This specs best DPET spells are immolate and conflag, of which all 3 of those glyphs will boost. With incin being 50% of my dmg, I did take a look at the incin glyph, but found that 5% increase to my incin came out almost equal in terms of what the spell power of lifetap glyph would give me, however didnt have the side effect of buffing all my other spells as well.

Asmodaeus · 03/25/09, 3:43 PM

Originally Posted by Grimrage

The Immolate glyph is the best of the three with Incinerate being next and Imp being last. They all fall short when compared to the combination of the Immolate, Conflagrate and Life Tap glyphs, however.

I just ran the latest Simcraft with an alternative profile for the destro lock. The only difference was Glyph of Incinerate instead of Glyph of Life Tap. I ran 3 scenarios: the default scenario with t7 gear, a similar one without the 4t7 bonus, and the third with the t8 gear that Simcraft ships with. It turns out that for the first two scenarios Glyph of Life Tap beats Glyph of Incinerate by a small amount, but with t8 gear (and the 4p t8 bonus), the two glyphs yield almost the exact same dps:

   7524  11.6%  Warlock_T8_53_00_18_DG
   7429  11.5%  Warlock_T8_00_40_31
   7213  11.2%  Warlock_T8_53_00_18
   7208  11.2%  Warlock_T8_00_28_43
   7191  11.1%  Warlock_T8_03_13_55_Inci
   7189  11.1%  Warlock_T8_03_13_55
   7076  10.9%  Warlock_T8_00_41_30
   6948  10.7%  Warlock_T8_03_52_16
   6847  10.6%  Warlock_T8_00_56_15

(Warlock_T8_03_13_55_Inci is the destro lock with Glyph of Incinerate)

The choice between Glyph of Life Tap and Glyph of Incinerate seems to depend on gear.
The scale factors are not very different, except for intellect, which is substantially better when using Glyph of Incinerate:

Warlock_T8_03_13_55        intellect=0.30  spirit=0.97  spell_power=1.64  hit_rating=2.83  crit_rating=1.00  haste_rating=1.00  
Warlock_T8_03_13_55_Inci   intellect=0.47  spirit=0.90  spell_power=1.65  hit_rating=2.88  crit_rating=0.93  haste_rating=0.96

RalphusAdolphus · 03/26/09, 3:04 PM

I have a few questions about the 0/28/43 spec in 3.1:
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warl...31051025030000

A) Would points be better spent in places other than master summoner like perhaps improved healthstone? What is the reason behind placing points in master summoner? Is it just to reduce pet downtime?

B) Why the point in shadowburn rather than destructive reach? Is shadowburn really raid viable or is it supposed to be used with the change to drain soul that allows you to obtain soul shards while fighting a boss?

angaroth · 03/26/09, 3:17 PM

Originally Posted by RalphusAdolphus

A) What is the reason behind placing points in master summoner?
B) Why the point in shadowburn rather than destructive reach?

Those are both essentially free points. No other +dps talents available at their tier level. Note that Shadowburn isn't included in the spell rotation. Feel free to swap them around. Most of these talent trees are created on the principal that any utility talents will be provided by someone else. I for one will never be going 2/2 Fel Synergy if no one in the raid has ImpHS.

Tinava · 03/26/09, 4:04 PM

I'd call those "throwaway" points. You could technically put those couple of points in demo anywhere to get down to Master Demonologist. Same thing for destro...I tend to put that in destructive reach, but that's just personal preference.

Andoron · 03/26/09, 6:08 PM

Originally Posted by tremble

I tend to find destro does pretty poorly on thaddius, then again maybe I just suck

I always have issues with the damned imp never making it onto the next ledge and have to quickly resummon on the platform.

WWS

Whenever my pet is stuck I command Attack, Follow, Attack (CTL+1 CTL+2 CLT+1) real quick and it always instantly teleports the pet to me. I have found this is an easy solution to this problem, and I normally do it during the GCD of my first dot while I move into position.

Malathar · 03/26/09, 6:39 PM

Thats neat. Definately gonna give it a try. Sure beats having to slow summon on Gluth so I can use fel domination on Thad to not screw my dps.

subtletuna · 03/27/09, 5:11 PM

So... judging by all the hit rating gear available in Ulduar, has anyone thought of specs without using suppression? I was trying to throw one together, but ran into a snag where i only had enough points for 2/3 demonic aegis... So, to fill that gap, what would be the best skill to take 1 point out of? ISL? F&B? Pyroclasm? Destructive Reach?... Here is the spec with taking a point out of F&B.
I would love to take the point out of destructive reach, but i tend to have threat problems right now with 2/2 DR, so i'd rather keep it.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warl...0&version=9733

Malathar · 03/27/09, 5:21 PM

I would say to take it out of ISL. Glyph of Lifetap scales better than Glyph of Incinerate. Therefore you should be lifetapping and have no mana problems at all.

Shodan30 · 03/31/09, 10:40 AM

For anyone actively testing 0/40/31 or full destruction builds on the PTR:

Have you found a cooldown/dot timer that can support everything that we use?

Immolate dot
Coa dot
Corruption dot
Chaos Bolt cooldown
Conflag Cooldown
lifetap glyph timer (a peudo 20 second cooldown timer that runs every lifetap)

I have the dots covered but the cooldowns and the manual lifetap cooldown timer seem to require some manual configuration that I can't do with Timerbuttons and I don't want to have to use more then one mod.

duhwhat · 03/31/09, 10:50 AM

Originally Posted by Shodan30

I have the dots covered but the cooldowns and the manual lifetap cooldown timer seem to require some manual configuration that I can't do with Timerbuttons and I don't want to have to use more then one mod.

For the cooldowns and LT glyph, I use Ghost: Pulse. Conflag and CB should work as normal spell cooldowns. I have a custom "player buffs: expiring" frame for LT which flashes the LT symbol when the glyph buff expires.

Indaria · 03/31/09, 1:27 PM

Originally Posted by Shodan30

Have you found a cooldown/dot timer that can support everything that we use?

/../

ForteXorcist is your friend. Monitors dots, and temporary buffs and gains as well as cooldowns. I also use OmniCC for cooldowns just for some redundancy in case I miss the pulse from the CD monitor supplied by FX.

Kana · 03/31/09, 8:00 PM

I don't think "easy to mange" characterizes Dotimer very well, but it will do everything you want it to.