I've not had a chance to test, but in the old days (BC) you could sac your pet with Demonic Sacrifice and gain the buff and then summon Infernal/Doomguard and have the best of both worlds. Assuming this is still the case, the question would be:
1) Do you need Demonic Sac to make using Infernal or Doomguard with demonology build worth while?
Of course you are correct some talents don't work with non-standard demons. I've not had a chance to test but I plan on respecing to get demonic sac (going to sack a Felguard) and try running with the combination with a doom guard to see what type of dps I can put out.
So from someones comment about Improved Enslave demon, it sounds like both Fel and Doom start off with the enslavement debuff but by having the talent Improved Enslave increases the dps of the special demons, is that true? If it is, I have to agree with one of the posters above, not sure 2 talent points is worth the short up time that you have those demons...
Okay so I did a quick test last night. Doomguard is 15 mins and after that time (or if you summon a new pet) he just despawns!! So much nicer! The Doom & Infernal start with an enslaved debuff on them so if you do have the Improved Enslave Demon, it will increase these two pets dps.
Despite the fact that imo a demonologist spec warlock should be the best at using these two high end pets, it's currently exactly the opposite.
You lose the master demonologist buff, now if you have demonic sac this might make up for that loss, but you also lose demonic knowledge and I'm going to take a guess that the spell damage loss is not made up by the Doomguards damage. I'll try to get some numbers soonish. If anyone else gathers some dps statistics please post, as I'd be curious what the results are.
So I think summoning a doomguard is more a move for Destruction or Affliction locks (sadly).
Basically they're the same. The only thing that changes is the MC proc rather than ISB and the pet.
Even if the dps difference might be negligible I still wonder whether anyone knows which of these two provides higher dps and why.
Also, which buffs do you use on either the Imp or Felhunter?
Thanks in advance for you help!
In our raids we run with two affliction locks. As long as one lock has a felhunter out for the raidwide Fel Inteligence buff, I have found the imp to be a definate dps gain, and the proper pet to use(as long as you can keep him alive). The dps, and overall dmg seems to be higher on every parse that I have tested between the two pets. Now my only question is and i'm pretty sure it does, but I wanted to verify if my imps fireballs are benefited from Molten core? Right now I have one point invested in the MC talent and wanted to know if another point or two would be worth the investment?
This is offtopic, as I cannot create a New thread - but as well as Which Pet When thread, would a "Demonic Circle Ideas" thread be useful in this forum?
It'd be good to share some Circle tips and tricks for Raid encounters, etc.
I agree that it would be a worthwhile thread.
I use it on Gothik, for one. After my side finishes its first DPS cycle, I port to the other to continue DPS. 4.5 minutes for him to enter, 6 minute duration on the teleport. You have to refresh it before the pull.
Four horsemen (particularly as a ranged tank) also sees it useful: it lets you swap sides on the ranged two pretty easily.
Heigan you could use it to port back up to the platform after the dance, but it doesn't gain you much
I'll answer for the PvE: Affliction:
In terms of raw numbers, your imp will beat your Felhunter. That's not to say "always go with the imp," however.
There are two things to consider here:
1) Do you use dark pact? A lot of warlocks don't due to the fact that at intro-level gear, it gives less mana than an improved Lifetap. If you do use Dark Pact, or maybe you're just using it for a particular fight (Loatheb, for instance), you'll want a Felhunter out. An imp will run OOM quickly if you're stealing from it.
2) Do you have Improved Divine Spirit? If you don't, your Felhunter is going to bring a huge amount of utility and value to the raid. It will also give you more personal dps due to the spirit aura. If you have improved Divine Spirit, you'll want to stick with the imp.
I disagree that the Imp runs OOM to Quickly, yes it doesn't have a great deal of Mana Points, but it's mana Regeneration seems better, admittedly i haven't actually done the maths on this yet.
We do not have a disc priest on our raids with the Divine Spirit/Improved Divine Spirit. Am I right in reasoning out that using the Felhunter for his raidwide spirit buff would help everyone, even if he is on passive the entire fight? I'm sure he wouldn't increase my dps any, as I am specc'd for Imp, but for those times we have 4 warlocks in raid, the affliction 'lock could use his puppy, to help us all out.
So I was curious, for a patchwerk encounter setting for example, Lets say you use an imp the entire fight then switch to infernal for the final minute. Would a doomgaurd for the entire encounter out dps the imp and infernal?
I don't have data to back this up, but if I recall correctly, a doomguard does around 600 dps raid-buffed. But it depends on the length of the fight. For something that lasts one minute where the infernal has 100% uptime, the infernal would be the obvious choice. But the question is at what point does a doomguard beat the infernal/imp combo.
209.2x + 60(994.3) = 600x
209.2x + 59658 = 600x
390.8x = 59658
x = 152.6 seconds
x = 2.53 minutes
x = 2 minutes 32 seconds
This is assuming that my 600 dps value is accurate. So at 2 minutes 32 seconds into the fight, the doomguard becomes better than the infernal/imp combo. But also take into account that this requires perfect infernal timing, which is quite difficult unless your dps is remarkably consistent week to week.