SimulationCraft for Warlocks (4.0.3a numbers at 80 and 85) - Page 10

Naforce · 02/27/09, 6:13 PM

Originally Posted by nuibank

In the spec you provided there are a number of places that point could be take from that dont even come close to comparing to the single point benefit of the felguard.

The only places I could actually change that one point would be taking one from devastation (and freeing up 3 more) and taking one point from improved demon tactics. Though the first option offers up a lot of variations. I agree with the fact that the FG is a whole lot better then all the others, I'm just trying to find new ways of making warlocks want more crit rating, making us independent from our pet (losing 1100 dps is a heavy loss if the pet should die), sort of like the current affliction spec. The felguard does something, yes, but it isn't much. Still we can top the DPS meters. That is what I'm looking for, except somewhere else. Maybe I'm just shooting blindly here, but I still wanna bring up the discussion.

nuibank · 02/27/09, 6:18 PM

Originally Posted by Naforce

The only places I could actually change that one point would be taking one from devastation (and freeing up 3 more) and taking one point from improved demon tactics. Though the first option offers up a lot of variations. I agree with the fact that the FG is a whole lot better then all the others, I'm just trying to find new ways of making warlocks want more crit rating, making us independent from our pet (losing 1100 dps is a heavy loss if the pet should die), sort of like the current affliction spec. The felguard does something, yes, but it isn't much. Still we can top the DPS meters. That is what I'm looking for, except somewhere else. Maybe I'm just shooting blindly here, but I still wanna bring up the discussion.

Move a point out of MC into Felguard. Keep in mind felguard boosts all your damage by 5% rather than just fire.

Your argument for the Imp also takes a hit because you have a fire boosting MD buff for a spec that would be better DPS using a Shadow spell as a primary nuke since it lacks emberstorm.

Naforce · 02/27/09, 6:24 PM

Originally Posted by nuibank

Move a point out of MC into Felguard. Keep in mind felguard boosts all your damage by 5% rather than just fire.

Your argument for the Imp also takes a hit because you have a fire boosting MD buff for a spec that would be better DPS using a Shadow spell as a primary nuke since it lacks emberstorm.

True about the MC. My bad. Try not to focus as much on the actual spec as on the thought behind it ("how to make a demo/destro do great dps without the felguard").

Would shadow bolt really be the better spell? It's not specced through ISB, and incinerate is glyphed. I haven't tried, so I don't know.

Drison · 02/27/09, 6:26 PM

Originally Posted by Naforce

The imp does however give you 5% crit rating, and is a more versatile pet since it can attack from range.
Also, speccing FG takes that one very important point away from you. I'm just not sure of how good the metamorphisis actually is, specially the glyph. I highly doubt the glyph's worth compared to the other glyphs.
The 0/56/15 spec should do great dps and function well for the raid, I guess you are correct. The creator of the topic should consider taking 1 point from master summoner and putting it in mana feed, since mana feed is a dps buff whilst master summoner isn't (unless you don't know your pet good enough). This goes for all specs having 2p master summoner and 0p mana feed.

Also, in the detailed breakdown, all specs follow "actions=flask,type=frost_wyrm/food,type=tender_shoveltusk_steak/spell_stone/" pattern. Won't most specs have more use of firestone? Or is the massive amount of haste just plain better then +4% direct damage and the crit rating? I know that haste > crit but the direct damage seems very useful.

i dont believe 5% crit is going to make up the 500dps difference for using the imp. I cant see where you put all your talents cause my work broswer wont show the mmo talent calc but since you cant get emberstorm you still spam SB so how is that 5% fire buff going to do you any good when the felguard gives you 5% dmg buff to all spells? Also unless something change master conjour only buffs the rating part of our stone so it still will only be a 1% DD so the spell stone will still be better.

nuibank · 02/27/09, 6:27 PM

Originally Posted by Naforce

True about the MC.

Would shadow bolt really be the better spell? It's not specced through ISB, and incinerate is glyphed. I haven't tried, so I don't know.

It is better unless you have emberstorm.

Naforce · 02/27/09, 6:29 PM

Originally Posted by Drison

i dont believe 5% crit is going to make up the 500dps difference for using the imp. I cant see where you put all your talents cause my work broswer wont show the mmo talent calc but since you cant get emberstorm you still spam SB so how is that 5% fire buff going to do you any good when the felguard gives you 5% dmg buff to all spells? Also unless something change master conjour only buffs the rating part of our stone so it still will only be a 1% DD so the spell stone will still be better.

On the ptr the stones do 4% dot/direct damage buff.

Drison · 02/27/09, 6:30 PM

Originally Posted by Naforce

True about the MC. My bad. Try not to focus as much on the actual spec as on the thought behind it ("how to make a demo/destro do great dps without the felguard").

Would shadow bolt really be the better spell? It's not specced through ISB, and incinerate is glyphed. I haven't tried, so I don't know.

SB has a 85% coeffient incinerate has a 72% coeffient which means without emberstorm SB will far our scale incinerate which is why you SB in a deep demo build.

Drison · 02/27/09, 6:33 PM

Originally Posted by Naforce

On the ptr the stones do 4% dot/direct damage buff.

Nice that may make the firestone better but im a haste freak and being able to get close to 1000 haste may be to good to pass up the spell stone.

Naforce · 02/27/09, 6:34 PM

Originally Posted by Drison

SB has a 85% coeffient incinerate has a 72% coeffient which means without emberstorm SB will far our scale incinerate which is why you SB in a deep demo build.

Does those coefficients account for incinerates bonus damage cause of immolate or the actual spell alone?

Drison · 02/27/09, 6:38 PM

Originally Posted by Naforce

True about the MC. My bad. Try not to focus as much on the actual spec as on the thought behind it ("how to make a demo/destro do great dps without the felguard").

Would shadow bolt really be the better spell? It's not specced through ISB, and incinerate is glyphed. I haven't tried, so I don't know.

if you looking to not use the felguard for what ever reason a deep demo build with demonic power using a succubus wil be closer dps then the imp so you can check that out.

Trickykid · 02/27/09, 6:51 PM

Originally Posted by Naforce

Does those coefficients account for incinerates bonus damage cause of immolate or the actual spell alone?

Immolate doesn't give incinerate any increased scaling, just a flat absolute damage increase if it's up.

Krazen · 02/27/09, 7:48 PM

Run this

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warl...0&version=9626

Dawei · 02/27/09, 10:03 PM

Run this

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warl...0&version=9626

He already did:

Originally Posted by Zakalwe

I've tested 0/22/49, it doesn't beat 5/13/53.

Try to read the whole thread before posting.

cognomon · 02/27/09, 10:48 PM

For 0/41/30 you can take one point out of master summoner and that frees up one point for demonic tactics further down.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warl...0&version=9614

cognomon · 02/27/09, 11:00 PM

Also, from MMO-Champion (I didn't see a link to the blizard post):

Demonology

Enslave Demon has been changed, it is no longer more difficult to control a demon if you repeatedly enslave the same demon.

A little bit of maintenance, but an enslaved doomguard should out dps everything except possibly a felguard. This would buff every spec except for 0/41/30.