3.3 PTR: Conflagrate: Redesigned. This talent now consumes an Immolate or Shadowflame effect on the enemy target to instantly deal damage equal to 9 seconds of Immolate or 8 seconds of Shadowflame, and causes additional damage over 3 seconds equal to 3 seconds of Immolate or 2 seconds of Shadowflame.
The additional time on Immolate will have no effect on Conflagrate's damage.
Idd, that is similar to how it works on live; based on time instead of % dmg which would work better with a longer or shorter immolate. Don't play on the PTR but in the link that guy provided conflag was working on % dmg.
Has anyone tried using Glyph of Quick Decay with the 0/56/15_MC demo spec?
Let me first say that I have somewhat limited experience tinkering with simcraft, so if I've made any obvious mistakes I apologize. With that out of the way... I was curious about this too, so I tested it out with the t9 BiS 56/15 profile included in the latest release. What I found was that Glyph of Quick Decay is a small (just shy of 50 dps) but tangible upgrade over Glyph of Metamorphosis. MC uptime jumped from about 26 to 33% as expected, and I saw a fairly small increase in all scale factors. On top of all that, Quick Decay will likely outshine Metamorphosis even further on fights where Immolation Aura is impractical.
Another thing I noticed was that dropping a point in Improved Demonic Tactics rather than Demonic Empowerment for 3/3 MC yields an additional 60 dps increase while only decreasing Demonic Pact uptime by ~1%. Just eyeballing it, this would seem to be worthwhile - 1% uptime is approximately 4 spellpower over the entire fight, so with an average of, say, 7 caster dps your personal gain comes out ahead of the raid's loss. It's marginal, but is there a reason I've overlooked that the point shouldn't come out of IDT instead of DE?
Let me first say that I have somewhat limited experience tinkering with simcraft, so if I've made any obvious mistakes I apologize. With that out of the way... I was curious about this too, so I tested it out with the t9 BiS 56/15 profile included in the latest release. What I found was that Glyph of Quick Decay is a small (just shy of 50 dps) but tangible upgrade over Glyph of Metamorphosis. MC uptime jumped from about 26 to 33% as expected, and I saw a fairly small increase in all scale factors. On top of all that, Quick Decay will likely outshine Metamorphosis even further on fights where Immolation Aura is impractical.
Another thing I noticed was that dropping a point in Improved Demonic Tactics rather than Demonic Empowerment for 3/3 MC yields an additional 60 dps increase while only decreasing Demonic Pact uptime by ~1%. Just eyeballing it, this would seem to be worthwhile - 1% uptime is approximately 4 spellpower over the entire fight, so with an average of, say, 7 caster dps your personal gain comes out ahead of the raid's loss. It's marginal, but is there a reason I've overlooked that the point shouldn't come out of IDT instead of DE?
Some quick napkin math suggests that you may be right about Demoic Empowerment. Bear in mind that demo isn't a spec I currently play, so please forgive if I'm forgetting something obvious in my calculation. Only 60% of a demo lock's damage seems to scale with crit. Seeing ~45% crit in the OP, if we scale this back to 44% and know that we're doing 9900 dps overall, this means:
.6*(144/145) = .59586
a downgrade of 0.414% from our original build. Since we're doing 9900 dps, this amounts to about a 40 dps loss. The gain from demonic empowerment, on the other hand, just comparing the 0/56/15 FG with the 0/56/15_MC FG, is more than a 100 dps loss. Unless I'm missing something obvious, as I've said, it seems like a switch to Quick Decay and Demonic Empowerment is preferred. Marlucia, is there any way you can paste your results from running this build on the sim?
Some quick napkin math suggests that you may be right about Demoic Empowerment. Bear in mind that demo isn't a spec I currently play, so please forgive if I'm forgetting something obvious in my calculation. Only 60% of a demo lock's damage seems to scale with crit. Seeing ~45% crit in the OP, if we scale this back to 44% and know that we're doing 9900 dps overall, this means:
.6*(144/145) = .59586
a downgrade of 0.414% from our original build. Since we're doing 9900 dps, this amounts to about a 40 dps loss. The gain from demonic empowerment, on the other hand, just comparing the 0/56/15 FG with the 0/56/15_MC FG, is more than a 100 dps loss. Unless I'm missing something obvious, as I've said, it seems like a switch to Quick Decay and Demonic Empowerment is preferred. Marlucia, is there any way you can paste your results from running this build on the sim?
Sorry for any confusion caused by my post, but Imp. Demonic Tactics doesn't affect your personal chance to crit, only your pet's. The tradeoff between a point in IDT and a point in Demonic Empowerment is essentially 3-4% pet crit versus 7% pet haste, which isn't particularly huge.
Sorry for any confusion caused by my post, but Imp. Demonic Tactics doesn't affect your personal chance to crit, only your pet's. The tradeoff between a point in IDT and a point in Demonic Empowerment is essentially 3-4% pet crit versus 7% pet haste, which isn't particularly huge.
Yeah, guess I just showed how long its been since I specced demo. I was still thinking of an older version of Demonic Tactics (not the improved one).
Try to do the same thing without 2xT9 and look at what happens to demonic pact uptime.
Good call, I hadn't considered that. DP uptime drops further to around 97%, but the difference in uptime between 2/3 IDT + DE and 3/3 IDT specs remains on the order of 1% or so. The sim actually shows uptime as equal for both specs, but 3/3 IDT has slightly higher benefit. It seems, again, like the difference in DP uptime is marginal enough that the extra 40-50 personal dps might be worth it. Here are my results again, for those interested:
I'm not doing to say that it theoretically isn't worth it, but lets put it this way; the sim simulates patchwerk. Its very easy to get high Demonic pact uptime in a fight like that. In the real world demonic pact uptime is slightly more touchy, I personally don't really think that it would be worth chasing after that 40-50 DPS.
The mind is like a parachute. It works best when it's open.
I'm not doing to say that it theoretically isn't worth it, but lets put it this way; the sim simulates patchwerk. Its very easy to get high Demonic pact uptime in a fight like that. In the real world demonic pact uptime is slightly more touchy, I personally don't really think that it would be worth chasing after that 40-50 DPS.
Actually you can simulate movement etc in simcraft by choosing the Helter Skelter styled fight. I just ran a simulation with the Helter Skelter style fight and it did not change the Demonic Pact uptime, which seems normal to me since most often your pet can keep attacking even though you might be on the move etc.
I'm not doing to say that it theoretically isn't worth it, but lets put it this way; the sim simulates patchwerk. Its very easy to get high Demonic pact uptime in a fight like that. In the real world demonic pact uptime is slightly more touchy, I personally don't really think that it would be worth chasing after that 40-50 DPS.
I'd usually agree on the principle that sacrificing raid buff reliability for personal dps is a bad idea, but I would think that fights in which your felguard can't always attack the boss would skew the numbers in favor of DE, not IDT, since it would be up a greater proportion of the felguard's active time. Also, as Johnneke already pointed out, the felguard is pretty much fire-and-forget on all but a handful of fights, so DP uptime will be a lot closer to ideal most of the time than, say, immolate uptime.
Lets put it more simple; in the real world 98% demonic pact uptime happens super rarely.
To get Demonic Pact up, you need a crit. The chance of demonic pact being up is the [1 - 100/felguard crit chance] ^ [amount of attacks in the past 12 seconds], at any point where the felguard has not been attacking constantly, uptime will suffer.
On shorter fights, or broken up fights, uptime will also suffer. For example; the uptime will drop due to the phase 1 2 and 3 on Northrend beasts, and I know you'll say "Yes but theres also time between", yeah, and what happens is it will be up for a part of that time, and it will be down for the first few seconds into the next fight.
The value of 1% uptime with 10 casters that have an average scale factor of 1.5 at the demo pact lock having 4.2k spellpower is 420 * 0.01 * 10 * 1.5 = 63 DPS.
420- the assumed spellpower you give to the raid, which is neither high nor low. 1.5 is fairly low as far as spellpower scale factors go, but 10 might be on the high side for casters (unless you want to include healers, in which case its very low- healers should be considered, but the value for them can't be quantified well).
Its certainly good to question cookie cutters, I just can't see this change as being worth while.
The mind is like a parachute. It works best when it's open.
Totem of wrath boosts DP power though, since it raises your spellpower before DP procs.
You have to use a macro to remove DP from yourself to get the full benefit, though. (Although that might not be a raid DPS gain?)
But at least a ToW will apply when DP isn't up for everyone. And it adds +3% crit to everything too! (Paladins can't judge many whelps!)
But a rogue can poison mana whelps. Yes Totem of Wrath boosts DP power, no the gain in DP power is not worth the loss of searing totem + 140 spellpower for the Warlock (Worse yet vs the other fire DPS totems). If you want the math, check the appropriate thread for this subject, it's been asked and anwsered a lot.
The mind is like a parachute. It works best when it's open.
A bug was discovered that made MC trigger from non-corruption dot ticks - it's been fixed now, and I put updated numbers in the OP.
Can I ask how simcraft is handling the Conflag dot? Is it factoring in the dots increased chance to crit from talents? I ask because I was worried that the new conflag dot, even though able to crit now, wouldn't receive the 25% crit chance from Fire and Brimstone. (And because honestly I'd loooooove to see destro a weeeeeeee bit closer to Aff)
I went to test, and the dot portion has now been patched and is able to crit. So I tested the crit chance of the dot ticks. Its still a 6 second dot, with 3 ticks:
And it clearly seems to receive the crit boost from F&B. (There is a gap in those shots of a few percent in terms of where the crit chance should be, but trust me it evens out, its just the RNG in the case of these screenshots) The dot crits about the same as the initial conflag crits. I know the screen-shots show a very small sample size but I was there for a while testing, it held true with over 45 minutes of parsing. Im very excited about they got this working right, it officially wont be a damage loss at all on conflag PvE wise as long as the dots 3 ticks are able to run their course which is all that I could ask for. I also tested it extensively with the improved imp buff to make sure the dot ticks weren't consuming it or being effected by it at all, and they were not.
Simcraft does model the conflag dot as benefiting from F&B, and has been since the dot portion was first implemented - thanks for the test, though, we were just guessing before, now we know.
previously, ranks 1 and 2 both increased immo by 0 seconds and had a 0% chance to proc. this change seems to simply filling out MC to include the first 2 ranks as well as rank 3.
presumably they were testing the effect at max rank and have now decided to go with this model.
Just wanted to note, updated the PTR client again this morning. Ruins tooltip does state it increases the imps critical strike damage bonus but it isnt currently working on test. I tried respeccing and dropping all talents the respeccing. Dismissing and recalling the pet and everything just to make sure, but it still isnt working as of this build.
Ideally, if you keep hitting it, you'll get a 2:1 weave. If you break off after the first shadowbolt and cast a different spell, the 3 seconds should elapse and the macro will reset, letting you soulfire again.
Of course, your initial decimate proc has to come from Shadow Bolt (or Incinerate) manually.
I haven't see much in the way of macroing Soul Fire effectively. Thankfully, next patch, we won't have to.
I can't recommend against this macro enough. If you start casting Soul Fire without Decimation up, you're going to lower your dps and burn a soul shard.
10/29/09, 12:12 PM
