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10/07/10, 1:18 PM
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#286
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Great Tiger
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Originally Posted by Warlocomotif
Good point.
In regards to the "test" from the person above: Currently Shadow and Flame does not effect incinerate.
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Ah, you are right. That would make Soul Fire get surpassed at essentially all gear levels, and it would also make backdrafted incinerates better than searing pain above 50%.
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10/07/10, 9:12 PM
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#287
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Glass Joe
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Originally Posted by Dastey
Been testing different scenarios of Destruction on the PTR and here are the results:
Glyphs: Incinerate, Immolate, Conflagrate
Filler: Incinerate
DPS: 11800
Glyphs: Incinerate, Immolate, Conflagrate
Filler: Soul Fire
DPS: 12400
Glyphs: Imp, Immolate, Conflagrate
Filler: Soul Fire
DPS: 12100
To me it seems like Soul Fire is the bester filler for Destruction only bad thing about using Soul Fire as filler is that sometimes the instant Soul Fire procc and if you finish the cast its gone. So either stop casting and use instant or continue casting and losing the buff.
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Are you testing on a dummy at or above 80% health? If so you are also getting Improved Soulfire effects that wouldn't be present below 80% target health.
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10/08/10, 2:15 AM
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#288
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Von Kaiser
Worgen Warlock
Neptulon (EU)
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I tested again and nowhere near the same results, I guess I had been slightly lucky with crits and proccs on my soulfire attempts.
Anyhow a question.
What glyphs should destruction be using come patch 4.0.1? Immolate and Conflagrate to me seems like pretty demand, but should the last be imp or should it be incinerate assuming immolate > Conflagrate > Chaos bolt > Instant soulfire > Searing Pain rotation under 50% (including doom ofc)
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10/08/10, 3:40 AM
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#289
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Glass Joe
Orc Warlock
Der Rat von Dalaran (EU)
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Originally Posted by matornot
Since the 3% haste and 9% dot/hot buffs apply to both you and your target, I have a suspicion that you couldn't benefit from 2 different sets of them. I have a feeling that blizzard wouldn't want us to get 18% bonus dot damage. Also they may have added this mutual benefit in response to arcane mages trading FM, instead of giving FM to healers or people who benefit more from crit than an arcane mage (most classes).
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The last time I tried that the 2 Dark Intents do indeed stack. I had 2 DI Haste Buffs, the one from the other lock and my own.
However that was a few builds ago.
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10/08/10, 4:30 AM
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#290
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Glass Joe
Undead Warlock
Burning Legion
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Originally Posted by Nosajtpno
Trying to work out the ideal classes to put Dark Intent on. Sometimes the choice will be obvious, but if not, or another affliction warlock has already taken the good choice, it's good to have an idea of what trumps what.
Death Knight: 2 Diseases, ticks every 3 sec.
4-5 Refresh Chances Per 7 sec
Fire Mage (Fireball): Living Bomb, ticks every 3 sec. Pyroblast, ticks every 3 sec, not gauranteed uptime. Ignite, ticks every 2 seconds after crit. (plus Combustion 1 sec ticks and Flamstrike when AoE) (plus haste ticks)
2-9+ Refresh Chances Per 7 sec (plus haste ticks)
Fire Mage (FrostFire): same as above, with Frostfire glyph ticking every 3 sec. (plus haste ticks)
4-12+ Refresh Chances Per 7 sec (plus haste ticks)
Resto Shaman: Riptide ticks every 3 sec, but is on a 6 sec cooldown, so can't be on too many people at once even in a best-case scenerio.
2-5 Refresh Chances Per 7 sec (plus haste ticks)
Holy Priest: Mastery gives a short term (6-sec) HoT to most spells. Renew ticks every 3 sec plus haste, with a chakara that is focused on allowing spam of it. If the priest is using that chakara the whole fight, it could be pretty good. If the priest is mostly tank healing, it is less good. (The HoTs roll into a single HoT on the target, so you only get it + Renew if applicable)
3-7+ Refresh Chances Per 7 sec (plus haste ticks)
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A few things you overlooked:
-I don't know the Fire Mage rotation, but their new Flame Orb spell is a channeled DoT.
- Resto Shamans have the new Healing Rain AoE heal as well as the Earthliving Weapon enchant which, when it procs, places a HoT. Earthliving Weapon, when glyphed has a 40% chance to place another HoT on heal and if I recall correctly, shamans can currently dual wield Earthliving-enchanted weapons. This makes Resto Shamans an appealing choice for lack of Resto Druids, Shadow Priests, or Affliction Warlocks.
- Death Knights: Unholy also gets the Unholy Blight DoT which ticks for 10% of Death Coil's damage every second for 10 seconds. Thinking this might be another opportunity for Dark Intent procs, I tested this on PTR to see if it crits and it does not. So Unholy DK's are no better a target for DI than Frost.
An interesting mechanic presented itself with this though, because Unholy Blight is 10% of Death Coil's damage, perhaps this is the reason it does not crit? I've heard reports from Holy Priests on PTR that their mastery effect does not crit either, and it follows these same rules. This would lead me to believe that Ignite and, by the same token, Burning Embers ticks would also not crit, severely reducing the usefulness of DI on Fire Mages, Holy Priests, and the Imp.
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10/08/10, 11:40 AM
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#291
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Von Kaiser
Undead Warlock
Kazzak (EU)
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Originally Posted by matornot
channeled spells aren't ideal spam spells due to the fact that they can't benefit from spell queuing. i.e. you either clip your previous DL or you leave a lag pocket in between your DLs.
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You're right about spell queuing but there's a macro that last you spam drain life:
#showtooltip Drain Life
/cast [nochanneling:Drain Life] Drain Life
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10/08/10, 12:43 PM
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#292
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Don Flamenco
Human Warlock
Frostmane (EU)
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Yes, the point was that macro is client based and will add a double latency minimum gap between Drain Life casts. While the best way to do would be with a quartz like cast bar that shows latency, no macro and doing the 2nd Drain Life as soon as the cast bar enters the latency area.
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10/08/10, 4:36 PM
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#293
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Von Kaiser
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About that, I'll quote Keldion's post from another forum:
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Originally Posted by Keldion
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I don't expect that to be implemented for 4.0 though. I'm not sure if it is for Mind Flay, but it definitely is not for Drain Life on the PTR.
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10/08/10, 5:40 PM
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#294
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Glass Joe
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Originally Posted by Flamingcloud
The problem with your napkin math conculsion is you forgot that Impending Doom gives you a 15% chance on shadow bolt, incinerate and hand of guldan to reduce the cooldown of metamorphosis by 15 seconds. In reality you could just as often be waiting on demon soul as you are metamorphosis. Since the cooldowns are so close, as long as they stack it is clear that you would want to use them together, as well as any trinkets, potions and other cds.
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Fair enough - the essence of the conclusion will remain the same: cast Demon Soul:FG and Meta at the same time. Can ID proc multiple times per cycle? I've assumed that it can when scoping out talents - but haven't worked out the specific probabilities of n procs given m casts.
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Yes I know I am *way* over hit cap.
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10/09/10, 2:15 AM
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#295
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Von Kaiser
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Originally Posted by Xayide
As for queueing, I would direct you to MMO-Champion BlueTracker | Shadow Priest Concerns for Cataclysm. Mind Flay is the sister spell of our Drain Life, so there is reason to expect to be able to queue it up similar to Shadow Bolt. Nothing is certain, of course.
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That's somewhat reassuring. At least Shadow Priests will finally be able to relax a bit, as long as they clip their Mind Flay between its last 2 ticks (kind of like our UA). Maybe the reason we haven't seen this change in Drain Life is because they aren't planning on changing it the same way. Note that Soulburn still halves the Drain Life duration. But anyway all this is useless to us if we'll be spamming SB instead of DL as Ghostcrawler has "predicted". I want to say that my previous statement excludes affliction's execute phase, but Haunt and BoA won't allow us to benefit from it anyway.
Edit: One nice thing I thought of is that our Soulburn effect for DL will always make DL's duration equal to our GCD, so we'll have no problem spamming another button during that DL because we will literally not be able to clip it with another cast.
Last edited by matornot : 10/09/10 at 2:36 AM.
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10/09/10, 3:49 AM
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#296
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Von Kaiser
Blood Elf Warlock
Moon Guard
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Over the last few days, I have worked on a spreadsheet to illustrate the differences in Drain Life and Shadow Bolt scaling with their respective talents. The context of GC's recent comment about predicting Shadow Bolt filler was clearly centered around Cataclysm PVE; it matters not one bit if he is incorrect only in relation to the 8 remaining weeks in Wrath.
Drain's coefficient took a hit in PTR build 13156, resulting in a more linear DPSC scaling that effectively runs parallel to SB without additional Mastery taken into consideration.
L80 Affliction PTR DL/SB Comparisons
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10/09/10, 4:57 PM
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#297
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Banned
Troll Shaman
Runetotem (EU)
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Originally Posted by Keldion
Over the last few days, I have worked on a spreadsheet to illustrate the differences in Drain Life and Shadow Bolt scaling with their respective talents. The context of GC's recent comment about predicting Shadow Bolt filler was clearly centered around Cataclysm PVE; it matters not one bit if he is incorrect only in relation to the 8 remaining weeks in Wrath.
Drain's coefficient took a hit in PTR build 13156, resulting in a more linear DPSC scaling that effectively runs parallel to SB without additional Mastery taken into consideration.
L80 Affliction PTR DL/SB Comparisons
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Hm, I'm a little surprised it was a basic scaling nerf to DL. While it would most definately settle the issue right here and now, I was a bit worried the Mastery would eventually overcome this, and I mean within reasonable ranges. And that's the problem really. Blizzard can't nerf DL too much, or else it would be a wholly useless spell, something that clearly isn't the intent. But they still want SB to be the filler, while not scaling with Mastery. That's the recepie for conflict. And it seems that the crosspoint is lower than I expected (85 numbers should be somewhat different though). But the cross is actually a fair bit lower since it doesn't take Nightfall into account. The amount of extra procs with DL is non-negliable.
So, either it will be a constant rebalance of SB and DL, something I doubt Blizzard is interested in doing, since the last few attempts at that have been less than impressive. Or, they will even the playingfield between the two spells, either by taking DL out of the Mastery (the boring and perhaps least balanced result) or they make SB scale with certain selfbuffs, SE seems the most suitable candidate.
The problem with taking DL out of the Mastery is obvious, it simply becomes obsolete rather fast.
It's a mess really. And I don't see why Blizzard doesn't at least try DL out as viable. It doesn't have to be the only option. Much like Fire Mages and Fury Warriors get two options, Affliction Warlocks could be tested out with DL. And it wouldn't even have to be through the tree. It could be a glyph that increases DL's damage by X% and reduces the healing by Y% (not that I think it is terribly needed). One of the greatest arguments for DL is that it fits so very nicely, while SB doesn't.
If people are happy with DL, despite it's weakness as a channeled spell (something Blizzard does want to fix due to Spriests), then keep it. If it is unpopular due to those same weaknesses, then it can be shafted in 4.1 or something.
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10/11/10, 2:26 AM
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#298
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<3 Kitty
Blood Elf Warlock
Saurfang
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As there is nowhere else currently to discuss this, I thought here would be best, despite this being related more to the upcoming patch than the actual upcoming expansion.
I currently play Demo on live, and plan to continue to do so in 4.0.1 and in Cata. The L80 Demo spec I have come up with for 4.0.1 looks like this:
WoW Talent Calculator - Sigrie
This also includes glyphs.
Looking at the stats for demo, the stat priority order would probably look something like:
Hit -> Haste -> Mastery -> Crit.
With excess hit and crit being reforged into Haste. Gemming would look like:
Red: +10 Int +10 Haste
Blue: +10 Haste +10 Hit
Yellow: +20 Haste
Any opinions or discussion on this would be greatly appreciated. If this is the wrong place to post this then I apologize and would be happy to take an infraction, but here did seem best.
*Editted because I stuffed up the first time
Last edited by Jmickey : 10/11/10 at 1:55 PM.
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10/11/10, 3:20 AM
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#299
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Glass Joe
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Originally Posted by Jmickey
Yellow: +10 Int +10 Mastery
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I could be wrong, but mastery gems aren't implemented till cata, I think.
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10/11/10, 4:19 AM
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#300
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<3 Kitty
Blood Elf Warlock
Saurfang
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Originally Posted by Lemina
I could be wrong, but mastery gems aren't implemented till cata, I think.
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Is anyone able to confirm this? I don't really have access to PTR due to Australia's lack of internet quota. Even in that case though, you would simply gem Int/Haste in yellow sockets instead.
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