It depends on what part of the fight you are struggling.If you are struggling on getting the tendons down on 2 shots (which shouldn't be that much of an issue anymore but well, not everyone raids with 25 fully capable people) then low expertise builds are mandatory.Also, the amalgamation dps is not an issue either till the 6th amalgamation (the amalgamation for the 2nd exposure on the 3d tendon), and if you are having troubles there you should consider using hero and pots at that part of the fight -note that at that part of the fight there is no aoe being done and everyone should be focusing on getting the last amalgamation down as fast as possible-.

Im definatly gonna call bs on those numbers. Ive been using a heavy mastery build with high crit and medium hit, the vp trinket along with 2 piece tier 12(i am able to sub 2 397 tier items for it so no big stat loss) and average 1.9-2.4 per tendon. Maxed out at 1.7 mill on the first half of the tendon. A slightly slower guild on the tendons might up your dps time a tad, but no way you can pull 3.3 million on a tendon without insane luck. Noone ive seen in my guild ever pulls that on a tendon, short of the very occasional mage.

You are using the vp trinket on a masteryc/crit build.If you were using apparatus on mastery/hit build, you would see that getting up to 2.2 per exposure (with hero and pot) is not that hard as you might think. But well, i guess you might not understand that having 6k mastery during burst period might work wonders for you. Just for you info though, raging blow with popped apparatus crits for around 200-240k (120-145k mh 80-100k oh). So, if 1 ability can crit for that much do you still think that doing 1.9-2.2 per each first exposure is that hard?

Well numbers during heroism could easily get to 2.2m during the first exposure, but even if you are getting 1.9m per first exposure when heroism isnt up(not 100% convinced you are) you are not gonna get anywhere near 3.3m per tendon. You really wanna convince me you can do 1.4m on the 2nd half of a tendon with no cds, and what should be a tendon that starts at 35-40% hp? With that level of mastery you would likely be doing even lower damage the 2nd half than the build im using.

Ill try out that build and see how it edits my numbers, but the numbers you are stating would beat even rogues and mages, who should be doing the most imho. Need to see some logs before i believe that.

I want to believe you, but your numbers would put you 1.5-2million above any logs ive seen for a full fight tendon dmg.

Tried out your Mastery/Hit build with Apparatus the 2nd half of our raid tonight.

Completely Unbuffed stats as follows

15513 AP
2.01% haste
16.65% hit
20.74% crit
11/8 expertise
16.8 Mastery

Highest damage I saw on first half of a tendon was 1.8 million, highest for a full tendon was around 2.5million. Average came in at around 1.9 million.


The first half of the raid was done with my former build, Mastery>Crit with Rotting Skull.

14605 AP
2.01% Haste
9.21% Hit
27.48% Crit
11/8 Exp
17.6 Mastery


Highest damage for the first half was 1.7 million, highest for a full tendon was again 2.5 million. Average came out at 2.1 million.



Of course these numbers aren't exact and the peaks are just based on what i observed in around 10 attempts with each build(no lust/heroism was ever used as we aren't getting onto the final tendon yet). While the Mastery/Hit build did seem to have higher burst potential(i saw a couple 200k RBs with 5600~ mastery during trinket, but they were very rare), its damage was less consistent and had an overall lower average due to how low it was on the 2nd half of the tendons. Damage on the fight outside the tendons seemed quite similar, the mastery/crit build had more trouble with rage, but would do more damage when rage management was working out.

There may be other builds that are better than what i opted to use but in comparing these two crit seems better. Another big factor is the trinket, with a 2 minute cooldown Apparatus was not always up(generally it wasn't up for the 2nd part of the 1st tendon, but was up for the 2nd part of the 2nd tendon) wheras rotting skull was 100% of the time.

Hit just doesn't seem to make as much sense to me, pre-stacking executioner and guaranteeing 100 rage going into it I rarely ever had rage issues with the crit build, might get 1-2 more heroic strikes(at most) in with more hit but not enough to justify the loss of 7% crit.

All the numbers above assume not losing dps time on the tendons due to grip.

You can combine both using RS and AoK:
1) use AoK 20-15s before the plate lifts up (in our raid it was 10s before the fourth stun, but it may differ in yours)
2) use DW shortly before AoK wears out (10-5s before the plate lifts up, if your ranges suck you may be stunned during this whole timeframe and then you will deal a lot less damage)
3) use Battleshout 1s after the amalgamation dies for 2pT12
4) BT->CS->[RS+Reck+IR]

Reck, DW and AoK will only be ready for the first half of the tendon.

I was using this with as much Mastery that it is only a little over Crit and Hit>Crit>Haste with as less Expertise as possible.

Last Kill (Fury TG 4er T13)

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Dmg Burning Tendons 6,2m (use no Shattering Throw)

Hit 18
Exp 26
Crit 22

---

With the 15% nerf to the tendon i don't reforge exp to 21.

Hi, I'm a prot warrior OT, trying to maximize my dps for Hagara. Fury seems better by quite a bit because of the burst, but I can't decide between SMF or TG. I have access to N Gurth/H Slicer and N Souldrinker/N No'Kaled/H Hand of Morchok. Given the problems expressed earlier in this thread, I don't really trust simcraft. Feel free to add advice as far as TG/SMF.

The reason I'm posting is that I'm not sure whether Souldrinker was rated accounting for the extra HP with Rallying Cry/Blood DK 4 set. Does Rallying Cry put N SD above N No'kaled or H HoM? Obviously assuming you didn't need Rallying Cry for saving the raid, should it be used with damage CDs or whenever it comes back up?

EDIT: I'm willing to do some tests to find out, but I'm not sure about the best way to test this sort of thing, RNG and all. Any suggestions?

Armsaun, I think I've tried it all and here are my suggestions (not just for haggara, but in general):

Go for N Gurth/H Slicer. 2x H HoM are comparable, may be better for fights where the gurth procs would not be very helpful like Haggara or Spine. N nokaled/ h HoM pair is more or less ok too.
After all, fury spec is not so weapon dependent as arms.

And forget about souldrinker. nothing would put it anywhere near H HoM or even nokaled.

I suppose I could've just done some quick math, had it occurred to me at the time.

Here's the math for those who care:
Heroic Souldrinker - 1.7% of max HP (~165k) is 2800 damage per proc. Even with rallying cry and HP/DPS buffs from madness, you can barely get a 5k proc.
LFR No'Kaled - 6781-10171 per proc.

Both are reported as having a 15% proc rate with no ICD.

SD loses to HoM within every tier because the stats are more valuable than the proc (15% chance of 2800 damage).
SD also loses to HoM of the next tier higher because the extra ilvl gives higher base weapon damage.

Were Souldrinker's proc actually useful, rallying cry could be used to boost dps; as is, you should use any other weapon or just respec to TG.