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Old 03/11/11, 2:26 PM   #181
Boddugh
Glass Joe
 
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Dwarf Warrior
 
Ysera
Originally Posted by Nivyan View Post
Yeah, i understand the stats themselves might be of higher value - but I thought the mainhand dmg meant a lot for dps - is this not true anymore?
I would say the slower weapon over the course of a typical boss fight (which I assume Rawr is modeled for) the less impact a slower weapon hitting harder will have.

It all evens out in the end (weapon speed & base damage) which in effect makes the stats more important.

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Old 03/12/11, 4:42 AM   #182
Polemistes
Glass Joe
 
Orc Warrior
 
Daggerspine
What's the Stat priority for Fury-Warriors since the patch?

Server: Daggerspine
Name: Polemistes
Race: Orc

Currently i'm using-

Haste: 9.28%
Hit Chance: 17.95%
Crit Chance: 15.33%
Mastery: 11.87

I've been testing Haste / Hit builds and Crit / Mastery and such but, haven't really seen a dramatic change in DPS. I've been told that the stat priority has changed since the patch but, i'm not sure what to think. I just need some input that'll tell me which stats I really need to focus on (perhaps an up to date spreadsheet).

Thanks to those that are replying.

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Old 03/12/11, 12:09 PM   #183
Raxtus
Glass Joe
 
Worgen Warrior
 
Gilneas
A lot of furys are going for 8% hit and using 20 str and 20 crit gems, doing str>hit 8%>crit>mastery>haste. Can a warrior who has made this work tell me if you aren't completely rage dry? i understand your attacks will do more, but where are your enrages and rage coming from?

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Old 03/12/11, 5:02 PM   #184
Runtime
Piston Honda
 
Troll Warrior
 
Hyjal
The 8% hit is enough to maintain a rotation as long as you don't hit heroic strike too often. If you are practicing on a target dummy it can seem like you won't have enough rage but raid buffs will smooth out your rage income making the rotation much easier. With a low hit build you rely more on berserker rage to keep Raging Blow available.

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Old 03/12/11, 6:44 PM   #185
thebitterfig
Von Kaiser
 
Orc Warrior
 
Steamwheedle Cartel
The current (4.06) system definitely favors mastery over hit, once sufficient rage for the basic rotation is allowed. Depending on conditions (missing the raid haste buff, for example), this might be a little above 8%, and excess hit is still favored over haste. One reason mastery is nearly universally thought superior is the strength of cooldown stacking. Stacking up a strength-use cooldown trinket with a greatly-boosted high-mastery Deathwish, Colossus Smash, and Bloodlust is quite potent. Likewise, the nerfs to HS damage have hurt hit rating's relative strength.

4.1 changes indicate an increase to the relative strength of crit, and likely a slight increase in the relative power of hit. The reason crit is going up (and it was the top secondary stat anyhow) is due to the Colossus Smash nerf, which increases the relative potency Deep Wounds. While the per-point marginal strength of Mastery is going up (going from n+2 mastery to n+3 mastery is a bigger gain than going from n+6 mastery to n+7), the benefits of cooldown stacking decrease and it is likely that the Precision buff will bring white hit slightly ahead of mastery. Haste will probably remain the poorest stat. However, this has not been conclusively demonstrated at this time, and it is possible that mastery will remain stronger than hit, at least once certain levels of mastery have been obtained.

Also of note: hit often seems stronger in dummy testing than in actual raid use, since the stability and predictability of dummy testing allow for more efficient use of HS, while the more-hectic actual raid conditions (as well as damage taken) greatly increase the chance of rage capping and diminish hit rating's effect in practice.

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Old 03/13/11, 11:20 AM   #186
Raxtus
Glass Joe
 
Worgen Warrior
 
Gilneas
so wont i take some damage reduction from the lack of raging blow constantly being up? Yes, the extra crit and mastery will help other moves, but raging blow is your strongest move with decent mastery.

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Old 03/13/11, 11:37 AM   #187
Runtime
Piston Honda
 
Troll Warrior
 
Hyjal
From personal experience, I find my enrage uptime didn't decrease much because when i had a high hit build, my enrage procs tended to overlap a lot more than they do now. Aka before it was proccing when there was still 6 seconds left on the current duration and now procs rarely overlap each other.

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Old 03/16/11, 12:04 PM   #188
nomopofomo
Glass Joe
 
Tauren Warrior
 
Lightbringer
A hotfix seems to have altered something about expertise.

An example: I have no gear that has been reforged. I reforge my gear and fiddle with the amount of expertise I have. I log out and then log back in. My expertise has now jumped from 26 to 27 or by about 50 rating (change in rating confirmed).

Is this something new?

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Old 03/16/11, 12:21 PM   #189
Ecatombe
Glass Joe
 
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Human Warrior
 
Runetotem (EU)
Originally Posted by nomopofomo View Post
A hotfix seems to have altered something about expertise.

An example: I have no gear that has been reforged. I reforge my gear and fiddle with the amount of expertise I have. I log out and then log back in. My expertise has now jumped from 26 to 27 or by about 50 rating (change in rating confirmed).

Is this something new?
Do you have some of the Throne of Four Winds piece? Those are bugged in the character sheet while you're in a city.

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Old 03/18/11, 5:57 AM   #190
Ssateneth
Glass Joe
 
Undead Warrior
 
Illidan
Should I be using Heroic Throw on cooldown while in a DPS spec if I'm unable to cast anything else at the time, either due to rage or waiting on cooldowns?

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Old 03/18/11, 6:37 AM   #191
_Ikar
Glass Joe
 
Worgen Warrior
 
Dragonblight (EU)
Originally Posted by Ssateneth View Post
Should I be using Heroic Throw on cooldown while in a DPS spec if I'm unable to cast anything else at the time, either due to rage or waiting on cooldowns?
No.
As far as I know, Heroic Throw resets your swing timer so using it would extend your 'waiting for rage' time.

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Old 03/18/11, 6:45 AM   #192
sako
Glass Joe
 
Tauren Warrior
 
Dalaran (EU)
Hi there, I'm a little confused about SMF optimizing.
I wanted to try SMF and I thought Hit > Mastery for that spec but then I was parsing WoL and most of SMF top ranked player favorize Mastery over Hit.
Simcraft also tend to favor Hit so I was hoping for some input about that choice and why it seems to perform better ?

I didn't raid enough in that spec to try it myself yet and I don't think dummies would help me much.

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Old 03/18/11, 2:14 PM   #193
Gowface
Glass Joe
 
Goblin Warrior
 
Hyjal
Originally Posted by sako View Post
Hi there, I'm a little confused about SMF optimizing.
I wanted to try SMF and I thought Hit > Mastery for that spec but then I was parsing WoL and most of SMF top ranked player favorize Mastery over Hit.
Simcraft also tend to favor Hit so I was hoping for some input about that choice and why it seems to perform better ?

I didn't raid enough in that spec to try it myself yet and I don't think dummies would help me much.
It was posted earlier in this thread, the main line of thinking is such - Once you have enough rage generation to use Heroic Strike twice while the the CS debuff is on your target, the value of Hit Rating drops by a fair portion. As well as gaining rage when you hit something though, you also gain rage when something hits you - meaning in some raid environments (many Heroic Mode raids especially), you don't need as much Hit Rating to be able to do those two heroic strikes in the CS debuff window.

The values of Hit and Mastery bounce around from encounter to encounter, but in most fights you will sustain enough incidental damage to push your rage gain to the point where mastery is better.

Another factor that favors mastery over hit is Deathwish uptime - take Atramedes or Conclave, where you're likely to spend more of your time "on target" in Deathwish. So even if hit may sim better, there are many fights in which the scale tips towards mastery.

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Old 03/19/11, 2:08 AM   #194
Kallia_Malf
Glass Joe
 
Gnome Warrior
 
Malfurion
Deferring Haste?

I have a question regarding the great Haste/Hit/Crit/etc discussion.

Is it worth it overall to eliminate Haste in favor of Hit? For example, replacing The Heart of Solace with the Right Eye of Rajh. Both items have the exact same stats EXCEPT the Hit and Haste.

From what my understanding is, Haste is our weakest ability and if we can eliminate it alltogether from our gear, is that efficient? This is speaking from a Titan's Grip DW Fury perspective, under the assumption that hit and xp cap are both hit.

Any info would be greatly appreciated.

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Old 03/19/11, 6:21 AM   #195
Myul
Don Flamenco
 
Human Warrior
 
Eredar (EU)
Originally Posted by Kallia_Malf View Post
is that efficient?
Decreasing your worst rating and gaining better ones should increase your performance, shouldn't it? Haste increases nothing besides white damage over time/rage generation and it's slighty below hit on rating conversions (120 vs 128 iirc) so unless you're in desperate need of more rage to execute the rotation properly you want as low haste as possible in favor of more benefical stats.

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