What's wrong with his strength?

Sheets continue to say I should socket pure strength even if I put my unbuffed crit to something like 26% in zerker stance. It truly feels wrong to me, but who really knows? I'm personally just trying to keep my crit at least 30% unbuffed zerker. With BT items my crit started going really low, but now with sunwell items it seems to be easy to gain a lot of crit again.

Also I've been running dual executioner mostly since it became available, and I'm not really sure what to do with that. On our first Brutallus kills I had something stupid like 26 executioner procs according to WWS. Our other fury warriors had around 8 executioner procs + 3 mongoose procs. I'd imagine many of my procs overlapped, but I've kinda stopped worrying about which setup is better. Also I had Dragonstrike and they did not, so I'm unsure of what that does to my procs. I think from what I have read, proc rate changes as I gain or lose haste proc, but it's sure hard to explain the ridiculous amount of additional exec procs I get compared to our other warriors. I'm not aware of any solid answer about what is better in regards to exec/exec vs exec/mong.

Crit wont surpass Str in value (for Fury PvE dps) until your AP becomes very large.

Even if your crit is very low, stacking more str is still goign to be better until a very high gear level.

Crit surpasses Str with end-BT-gear.

The jury is still out on whats better, crit or strength. Landsouls spreadsheet and grims spreadsheet have near identical values for expertise, arp ect. But Grims spreadsheet values strength as 90% of crit. And landsouls spreadsheet values crit as 90% of strength. The reason for this is how execute is modelled. Although no definitive model has yet been done of execute mechanics, as it is so complicated and their are so many variables to consider.

My suggestion would be this. If you feel your crit is low, socket crit. If not, socket strength, or go for pyrestones. Its that simple

And my suggestion is, stay at 36% crit fullbuffed / full raiddebuffed boss, to have about 33% crit against a boss. Each third hit will be a crit then, so having a nice flurry uptime and possibly spending the remaining stats in strength would be optimal, at least for me. At over 33% crit, the diminishing returns on flurry uptime increases hardly (read this anywhere here on EJ forums).

Executioner / Mungo is the way to go ... landsoul's sheet has offhand Exec modeled, Grim's too, both show a clearly decrease in DPS compared to Exec/Mungo.

Crit won't surpass Strength in any time. With proper sunwell items your crit will be like 40-45% with normal raidbuffs (no LOTP), so having hard diminishing returns on it. Strength on the other side provides a lot more to bloodthirst and improved zerker stance. Strength is a safer stat too, because it increases damage on every hit, crit is sorta lucky.

edit: grammar.

I wouldn't say my gear is amazing, but raid buffed I'm sitting at 38.xx% crit (with LotP though, without Mongoose up), which gives me a 90-95% uptime flurry, rarely runs off.

Has anyone done any further testing with dual Dragonstrikes? Last person who tested didn't get it to stack anymore, which would be a shame, as it seemed to me it would've been the ultimate combination pre-glaives.

For me gemming crit or Str is base on your usual group makeup. Some guild can have a feral druid in the melee dps group (due to lack of rogue and dps war) and possibly a Ret pally makin an extra 8% crit in raid buff. Also if you have Enchant shaman that can constantly do Totem Twisting (GoA and WF) i would say gem for str is better than crit in this case.

There's no way you will get 90-95% uptime with flurry from a 38% crit rate. It may spike to that if you get lucky, but using the formula below, you can approximate your uptime:

(1-Critrate)^x

where x is the number of attacks that flurry lasts for. For 3 attacks (assuming no instants during the proc), and a 38.5% crit rate, this will give a 23% chance to have 3 non-crit attacks in a row, thereby allowing flurry to fall off. For 4, this gives a 14% chance. Due to the cooldown of BT and WW, I would guess that 'x' would be somewhere around 3.2 (assuming 2 x 2.6 speed weapons, no haste buffs except flurry. With haste buffs, or faster weapons, this value of x would get lower).

Anyway, using these calculations, at x=3.2, flurry uptime would be around 79%.

The spreadsheet report on Double Dragonstrike is not complete because spreadsheets cannot do permutations. Most significantly, it cannot model the stacking proc that produced Warglaive level haste. That makes an enormous difference.

As I'm already a committed 375 Macesmith with one Dragonmaw who is nowhere near the level of optimized progression raiding, I may well make them anyway at some point.

Looking for a confirmation on whether or not the procs still stack now that this patch has gone live. I remember reading reports earlier that it had been changed.

Well I just tested dw dragonstrike/dragonmaw on live and the haste effect didn't stack, just renewed it. Spent 15 minutes on a servant in BL, The quickest my attack speed went down to was 1.9 from 2.7 (flurry + haste proc)

Admittedly that is not 2 Dragonstrikes, but the buff is identical. Just an FYI.

I also crafted one because I had the gold kicking around. The haste proc rarely falls off -- but even with that being the case, i'm not sure how it would stack up to the DPS of 2x103.1 (Season 3) or 2x103.0 (Badge Fists). =/

even if the buffs dont stack - but just refresh - double dragonstrike is looking awfully attactive for warriors...

According to spreadsheet, if the uptime of the buff is 60%, then the double dragonstrike combo is actually better than s3 + mounting vengeance.

somebody should definitely do some testruns to determine the actual uptime.

Hi guys, looking for some input with itemization over here - I'm below hit cap for 2H at the moment, and I was wondering what I can do about it. I suppose regemming is a possibility, and I also have the [Stormrage Signet Ring]. Should I regem for some hit, and/or switch one of the rings to Stormrage? I'd hate to lose the crit but misses can really screw up my rotations on low-rage bosses like Brutallus.

Also, at what point is crit worse than armor penetration? I'm currently at ~1200-ish armor pen, and going below 32% crit really hurts flurry uptime.

Well, if I assume a ppm of 1.4 and that each proc will give 4 hasted swings (in reality it's 4.2 swings) I get an uptime of 35% for dual DS with overwriting buffs. I calculated it using a quick and dirty python script over 1000 swings and only using white swings. Specials will complicate things quite a lot in my script so I don't have time to add them, but they will of course make the uptime go up a bit, maybe up towards 40+%, but I don't think it's very likely that you will reach 60% uptime.

edit: NB, the script also assumes 0% miss/dodges, i.e. all swings can proc, and no WF.

To my knowledge Stormrage Signet Ring and the Ring of Ruinious Delight is the best ring combo in the game, or have there been any recent loot table descoveries of rings?

The illidan-ring wastes to much item value for hit. the best combo ist badge-ring/twins-ring in my opinion.

Wrong, once you get pimped up in enough Sunwell items, you will have lost so much hit that the hit provided by the Signet Ring (not to mention the extra bit of ArP) greatly outweighs the 'low' agility on the badge ring. Hell, your hit needs to be really high for it to not beat Angelista's Revenge in terms of damage output.

Indeed, I'm having trouble hit capping even when I use Illidari Shatterer, and I'll definitely see more once I replace my gloves(if I ever do) with Immortal Dusk and chest with the BSing one, hit is definitely one of the harder stats to come by, but once our Moonkin is able to play his druid consistently in raids(i.e. on Illidan,etc) I should be fine on hit. That 3% hit FF gives you a lot of room to play with your gear, I'm messing around with a new set up for tonight, but I'll likely have to swap back to my usual set up for Illidans
All in all that was meant to say, Stormrage signet ring is absolutely amazing for warriors

Resocketing for hit and getting a [Hard Khorium Band] will be more DPS than wearing [Stormrage Signet Ring]. But everyone seems to be hell-bent against resocketing, even when it's a DPS upgrade. If you're below hit cap and you have sockets which are not hit gems, you're doing it wrong. A fully utilized [Rigid Dawnstone] is more DPS than [Smooth Lionseye].

-edit-

Sorry Giantlol, with this post coming right after yours, I realized this could seem like a personal attack, but it really wasn't meant that way >_>

Most Warriors going from BT gear to Sunwell probably lost about 80 or so hit, your mileage may vary.

The difference is we all also probably have gained 17 expertise now as well(Assuming Shard/Onslaught Belt). So you have a nice 4.25% cushion(68ish hit rating) and you most likely won't notice a massive drop off until you dip below say 140 or so, in terms of rage generation at least.