This is pretty easy. Let's take a combat table for a dw fury warrior attacking a boss from behind as an example:
Assuming you have 0% +hit ...
...25% Glancing
..5,6% Dodge
..0,0% Block
..0,0% Parry
27,6% Miss (8,6% base + 19% dw "penalty")
-------------
41,8% combined hit + crit
This is in fact also your crit cap, since +crit "overwrites" your normal hits. This means, that every point to crit after you reached the 41,8% in this example is useless, because it is simply kicked off the hit-table.
Now if you add +hit to your setup, you will see an increase in the critcap (1% +hit increases your critcap by 1%). Assuming you reach the base +hit (8,6%) wether you go for 2h or dw your critcap is over 50%. This is mostly enough for the standard warrior out there.
Thanks a bunch. I wasn't sure of the exact numbers on the current glancing rate and DW miss rate.
Just wanted to share my experiences from the last few days in relation to haste gear. I bought the swiftsteel shoulders plan and 2 hearts of darkness from the top guild on the server (there goes another 3k gold to em, making over 6k total....at least im financing their raiding, heh).
I was using the crumby leather shoulders from the chess event upto this point, and i have to say that the difference is STAGGERING. I managed something like fourth on DPS on the SSC trash last night just playing around in battle stance, not really working on my rotation at all. The 40+ ap, and 3% haste has made a noticeable difference in my DPS, and i can't wait to squeeze in some more haste gear when we start getting into BT....i imagine it will be INSANE for our DPS scaling.
If we are able to work haste into the rest of our gear without sacrificing too much hit, AP or Crit, it will make fury....interesting later on.
I dont think performance during trash clears is the best "proof" of how effective haste is. I dont have a single piece of haste gear, but I'm easily top 5 on trash with 33/28.
I do agree that haste is great for warriors, but a better grasp on the effectiveness would probably be to do 2 phrases on those unkillable mobs in blasted lands, one with haste gear and one with out.
Short haste buffs aren't necessarily a major factor in overall DPS, but it's *huge* for burst damage situations, which come up pretty frequently. Enrages, multi-stage encounters, vulnerably phases, etc.
So looking up for some advice from someone whos switched from DW to arms hybrid, how much dps can I expect to lose based on my gear? My main focus has been crit all along, but my worries are the item budgets of my gear having spent too much on +hit(rings), and I have the T3 BS mainhand; my 2h would be gorehowl.
Its tough to know what type of gearset people have in mind when discussing the theorycraft.
So looking up for some advice from someone whos switched from DW to arms hybrid, how much dps can I expect to lose based on my gear? My main focus has been crit all along, but my worries are the item budgets of my gear having spent too much on +hit(rings), and I have the T3 BS mainhand; my 2h would be gorehowl.
Its tough to know what type of gearset people have in mind when discussing the theorycraft.
As far as your gear having too much hit, if your going to a 33/28, all you'd have to do would be change your ring to something with less hit on it, and you'd be almost exactly at the 2h hit cap. Something like Mithril band of the unscarred, or one of the several good blue crit/ap rings.
At request of my fellow officer and raid leader I switched over from DW to 2 Handed for constant blood frenzy, I was using Dragonstrike and Glad OH was aiming for Swiftsteel OH, had to adapt my gear quite a lot and decided to aim for haste gear. I got my sword and gloves last night as they finally dropped and this is what i'm using atm:
Before last night though I had the gruul gloves and Torch of the Damned with mace spec (which is obviously not ideal in pve) but here are some of the WWS of our Hyjal clear last night:
As you can see in the stand still and spank fights I was about 200 dps behind our top DW warrior Boomkat and I think I can pull some of that back with sword spec now, Gorefiend tonite will be a nice test
At request of my fellow officer and raid leader I switched over from DW to 2 Handed for constant blood frenzy, I was using Dragonstrike and Glad OH was aiming for Swiftsteel OH, had to adapt my gear quite a lot and decided to aim for haste gear. I got my sword and gloves last night as they finally dropped and this is what i'm using atm:
Before last night though I had the gruul gloves and Torch of the Damned with mace spec (which is obviously not ideal in pve) but here are some of the WWS of our Hyjal clear last night:
As you can see in the stand still and spank fights I was about 200 dps behind our top DW warrior Boomkat and I think I can pull some of that back with sword spec now, Gorefiend tonite will be a nice test
I experienced quite the same, not as a request of raidleaders though, but simply the fact we had a couple of BT/HS 2H weapons drop. I sustain 1100-1300 dps on static fights, if you add the BF damage to these numbers, it is quite impressive. If you run with 2 dps warriors at least 1 of you speccing BF is probably a good idea, if you run with only 1 dps warrior I am quite sure that 33-28 is superior in terms of raid dps. (I still miss a decent MH though to try out fury spec).
I also noticed my dps is kinda "streaky", especially on short fights like gorefiend.
Gorefiend: Wow Web Stats this is our latest gorefiend kill. 1150 dps + ~350 dps from BF are quite ok numbers. A few attempts before, when we wiped below 10% I sustained 1300 dps though. With a slow hard hitting 2H in a short fight the numbers can indeed differ a lot.
re: 2H BF vs. DW Fury
The DPS warriors in my guild are experimenting with 2H DPS also this week. They're reporting that they are much less threat-capped because they do not have to rage dump with Heroic Strike as much with a 2H build, and thus can do about as much damage as a DW Fury build, if not more. And the BF debuff is just the icing on the cake.
Anyone else having this experience? That DW Fury is just too threat capped in most situations?
DW Fury (1534 DPS), Anetheron, perfectly threat capped (pulled aggro at moment of death) : Loading...
The 2H MS warrior (33/27) is usually closer. Example: Najentus: Wow Web Stats
Teron Gorefiend kill, good example where I was close to threat capped: Wow Web Stats
If the MS warrior gets in the enhancement shaman group with me, he is usually pretty close in damage. His blood frenzy definitely brings his total raid contribution above mine. I usually sit in the enhancement/rogue group because I have Solarian's Sapphire - Items - World of Warcraft
So I did my first KZ raid this evening as DPS. I've tanked up to curator fine in the past but since I'm focusing on PvP a bit more they've put me down as DPSing warrior for the guild. I need to keep my build for PvP so I'm 32/25/3 mace spec (not a huge help to my dps anyway) So I found myself on par with a hunter and an arcane mage (not fire, he was using missles and blast) who werent doing that great in the dpsing departs. Which means I wasnt either.
A lot of my gear is PvP now such as Vet stuff and High Warlord gear so as a DPS 2h Warrior what do I need to keep up half-decent DPS?
So what am I looking for gear-wise and stat-wise for dpsing with a 2hander? (I do have imp. slam which i was using after my normal swing).
So I did my first KZ raid this evening as DPS. I've tanked up to curator fine in the past but since I'm focusing on PvP a bit more they've put me down as DPSing warrior for the guild. I need to keep my build for PvP so I'm 32/25/3 mace spec (not a huge help to my dps anyway) So I found myself on par with a hunter and an arcane mage (not fire, he was using missles and blast) who werent doing that great in the dpsing departs. Which means I wasnt either.
A lot of my gear is PvP now such as Vet stuff and High Warlord gear so as a DPS 2h Warrior what do I need to keep up half-decent DPS?
So what am I looking for gear-wise and stat-wise for dpsing with a 2hander? (I do have imp. slam which i was using after my normal swing).
Just looking at your gear/spec. the first thing I'd say is get some blue gems in those there sockets! Your under hit cap, but if you could snag doomplate gloves/shoulders you'd be fine there, and trade some resil for more AP/crit as well. Additionally, unless your married to full TM, I'd say drop it for points in flurry, and if you raid a lot, consider even changing second wind to Blood Frenzy, for better personal and raid DPS(Note, if you don't do a lot above Kara BF isn't as worthwhile.)
Statwise in general, for 2h I tend to prefer a more crit heavy gear set than with fury, but that's sort of a feeling, no numbers to back it up. But get to hit cap! Even if you have to swap in a piece or two of leather or mail, hit rating is by far the most efficient way to improve your DPS until 8.6% or there abouts. Especially if your not running flurry, but even with it.
I'm just not sure how to really maximize my DPS. I've downloaded the warrior spreadsheet and tested a few things out and improved my DPS, but i still seem to be far behind some of you other guys. I can't really push past 700-900 DPS (depending on the fight), and if I'm lacking lotp/WF, I drop down more. I don't think I'm optimizing my rage usage, but i use a BT/WW cycle with hamstrings in between and heroic strike as a rage dump (or cleave when theres multiple mobs/adds). My gear, compared to the rogues, is not that great considering i've spent most of my dkp on tanking items and just recently respecced fury by request of one of our officers.
Am I choosing the wrong stats? Here is my armory: The Armory
Anyone have any advice about how to more effectively DPS? Should I stack more AP and crit? Should I focus on major agil pots, or flasks of RA? I use the str food and sharpening stones. What kind of DPS should i be doing with this kind of gear?
also, anyone notice BT crit rate being significantly lower than other attacks? my white crit rate was above 30% the other night, but BT crit rate was like 21%. That just seems ridiculously low.
With glancing blows reduced by 15%, I would like to know who in God's name is hitting the crit cap, so why is this topic even coming up? I suppose maybe someone is thinking to themselves how their overpower just isn't efficient....
btw, I just thought I'd report back how switching to 33/28 went...
On Gruul today, with Windfury, I was between 1100 and 1400 dps, which is an increase from 17/44 for me. Not to mention the 4% from blood frenzy for the raid. I also did that much dps without pulling aggro, something I couldn't do spamming HS for max dps.
Question: Why is it assumed that you need to rage dump with HS? In my 17/44 I spec imp. cleave.
Because using Cleave to dump rage is even worse than using Heroic Strike. Cleave has higher Threat per Damage than Heroic Strike. So if Hamstring is not dumping your rage fast enough (and it usually isn't), Heroic Strike is your only option. http://elitistjerks.com/388900-post252.html
Also, my comments above comparing 2H MS/BF and DW Fury assume that the DPS warrior is in a shaman group.
@Natural, How in the HELL did you do 1500 DPS on Anetheron?!? Our gear is very very similar, but you are doing close to double my damage somehow.
Were you buffed like mad? food/flask/sharpening stone/3 pally buffs/enhancement shaman?
Does anetheron have extremely low armor?
Is there something you are able to cleave/WW the crap out of? (doesn't look like it from the logs)
07/19/07, 1:14 PM
