TotemLover

I think itemization really had me lean towards slam. There is three 130dps weapons that are all raid viable. That frees up Rising Tide, Blade of Infamy and the multiple maces for the rogues/enhancement shaman and in turn makes the raid a stronger group IMO. A few drops down the road I may consider going back to fury but at the moment I'm really more interested in the fastest progression our guild can achieve.

On a side note after playing fury from MC-Nax I think it's fun to try a different build.

 

Graul

So am I, and we are not yet in Hyjal, having Vashj and Kael left. And right now, the itemization isn't really there to make such a sacrifice. I could craft a T3 2h weapon or simply grind one in Arena, but not only do I find it more akward to DPS with a 2h, we typically have four physical damage dealers that are outputting a lot of damage, with a smattering of others here and there that bounce around depending on what space there is in a more optimal group as well as the fight. There isn't any weapon I would want from SSC/TK, and not too many others want any weapons from there either when you compare it to what they already have from S2. The only possible exceptions would be Vashj's dagger and bow.

As I said, it's all dependant on your own guild's situation.

 

Tzan

I think this is one of the key issues for the future of DPS Warriors. It appears that the ability to do higher and higher DPS may become less important than the ability to lessen threat. It's pointless to do more damage if you can't do it without pulling aggro. 2H may ultimately be less raw DPS than DW Fury, but if it can deliver high DPS with a lower threat ceiling, then it's much more useful.

 

Nezralix

This is also a design issue with tanks. Tank threat just doesn't scale nearly as well as DPS output does, and there's no particularly good reason for it.

 

Graul

Still waiting to see what the consensus is on the Prism of Inner Calm at higher levels of gear. It also seems like it would become less useful the more haste and armor evasion you replace crit with.

 

Hozz

Yes but there are things your tank can do to help there. There are things your raid leader can do to help your tank via group setups. More Tank DPS=higher threat ceiling.

I think they WANT some fights to be threat capped, but I think those fights are few and far between.

 

Graul

We always give both of the two main tanks Windfury except on a few specific fights, and it makes a noticeable difference in threat. It might mean three or four casters are having to "suffer" the loss of Mana Spring, Tide and Wrath of Air, but threat in general is higher when the tanks have Windfury than when they do not. This is also coming from a Horde perspective where before Paladins were given to us, Windfury was our "Salvation".

 

Calgar

That quote works on so many levels. Thanks for the laugh.

Anyways, I think a lot of warriors are leaning towards 2h build for several reasons.

1. Less obvious threat, from less DPS and less HS spam.
2. Don't have to re-spec for PvP/PvE arena games, and still maintain MS
3. Easier to rationalize your raid spot to guild leaders if you bring 4% more physical DPS as well.
4. Itemization is HEAPS easier. PvP gear is an excellent start for 2H gear, and you don't have to focus on hit virtually at all. Not to mention crafted 2H weapons are....Incredible to say the least.
5. It seems to be FotM for the big guilds. DnT's DPS warrior is 100% MS/Slam specced, as are a lot of the other big warrior names....people are sheep, what can you say
6. WAY less competition on gear. I'd imagine 2H weapons aren't fought over at all for BT guilds (I got my world breaker for like 100 dkp...T5 pants went for 700+ on the same kill). No need to steal "Rogue gear" for more +hit.
7. Less jokes about being a plate rogue.

 

Apate

I disagree regarding itemization. The itemization is definitely available at various levels that supports DW fury.

See you, auntie.

 

TotemLover

From SSC on Fury was viable and does great dps. Lots of gear has 30+ hit on it and you don't even have to socket every item with +8 hit gems. The non-plate of fury overlaps with rogues/hunters a bit more then with 2h's. (1h's, Shadowmoon Destroyer's Drape, rings etc all overlap....) After almost zero plate pieces in Karazhan blizzard has placed a large amount of plate dps items in every zone. All three trees are viable.

 

Emeraude

Definitely should make the suggestion to switch Blood Frenzy and Imp Intercept or some other Fury Talent during WotLK beta when they're listening about talent suggestions, it's silly that the PvE DPS tree is being marginalized by the PvP tree.

 

Hozz

They ought to swap Enrage and Blood Frenzy.

 

TotemLover

I'd rather see them make Fury/Prot viable as a pvp builds. I'd like to see the trees stay the same but a pvp talent added to the fury tree. Maybe something that would reduce resilience far enough down the tree so MS warriors can't get to it. I'm under the opinion Fury and Arms should be both PvE and PvP builds with different talents you chose making them lean in one direction or the other.

 

Natural

I wonder how would the future of a DPS warrior change if windfury were changed to be passive haste...

(Edit: I know they just changed it so it did not proc off of instant attacks; I believe it's more of a PVP related change. I still think a WF overhaul is on the way =)

 

Disrupt

Going to have to disagree with your first point. I'm actually seeing much more positive results swapping to a 33/28 from a 17/44, and not for lack of gear. I have no statistics to show for this statement on hand sadly though.

The rest or your points are pretty spot on and insightful, particularly number 7.

 

MeCh

Incoming nerf.

* Windfury Totem has been fixed (for real, this time) so that instant special attacks such as Slam and Sinister Strike will not trigger its extra attacks. On next swing attacks such as Heroic Strike and Cleave will continue to trigger it.


WoW Forums -> 2.1 Windfury Is Still Bugged!

 

Emeraude

Jesus Christ. They just killed Windfury.

 

Charsi

And it was a hotfix, no less. So it's live now.

 

Cannings

Just read it aswell, will a arms warrior be worth having for blood frenzy for their nerfed rageless dps?, even with slam rotation its going to be pretty bad in my opinion

 

Roflobster

33/28 raid viability has just been thrown out the window.

http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/420/kirbyrl5.gif

 

Natural

It depend on your physical DPS. This will be a big nerf, no doubt, but I don't think they will be terrible.

 

Shinnu

So what now? Do we stick with the slam rotation and rely on white crits for rage? Or is improved heroic strike considering it procs WF still more dps?

 

dr_AllCOM3

It's the same as before, just 10% less for everyone.

 

mikebro

Just read that they hotfixed windfury right before I went to go some people help kill Nightbane. Was just messing spamming hamstring quite a bit with WF to check it out. Looking through my combat log it seems it is still proccing off of hamstring but I don't really have time right now to parse through it and give examples. If anyone cares to check out for themselves, here is the combat log: MEGAUPLOAD - The leading online storage and file delivery service. Sorry for the crappy host, no one better to put it for free as far as I know.

Regardless though, it will happen and it's going to suck a lot for 2h DPS especially for those who went the route of MS, WW, hamstring spam.

 

Roflobster

It wasn't going to be added in a future patch, it was hotfixed and is supposed to be in the game.

This just confuses me now.

edit: Here are some examples

http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/420/kirbyrl5.gif