ckaparos

167 hit is alittle to low. You should aim to have 200 as a minimum. Dragonstrike is better in my opinion as the incoming haste nerf will see static haste gear as sub par compared to their equal level counterparts with stats. Dragonstike is proc based and hasnt got internal cooldowns so I think it will be your best bet dps wise.

 

Garre

I know everyone has their own personal gear choices, but I'm curious as to what most of you see as the most powerful trinket combination for raid DPS between the following: [Bloodlust Brooch], [Dragonspine Trophy], [Tsunami Talisman] and [Solarian's Sapphire] (with Imp BS)

At the present time I'd guess [Dragonspine Trophy] and [Tsunami Talisman], but post-patch I'm not too sure. Even after the haste nerf and hidden cooldown of [Dragonspine Trophy] next patch, is it still worth equipping over anything else?

 

Bliss

DST is still the best for your personal dps, but overall raid dps nothing even comes close to the Sapphire. It's such a massive amount of ap if you are in a melee dps group, 437 with 5/5 Imp BS.

 

Emeraude

I sit on 1931 AP/17.97%/29.56% Crit, and I still have a few issues with rage, I'm not seeing this cut off-point mentioned where too much hit = too much rage.

 

world

With regards to wearing Gladiator's gear while dps'ing, it's not actually as bad as you might initially think. A lot of mobs/bosses do at least some form of raidwide damage that can't be avoided, and the way resilience has been coded, what this means is that this damage can proc things like Enrage (and to a lesser extent Blood Craze).

Against a fight like Gorefiend, as a 33/28 bloodfrenzy spec, i was getting a significant number of Enrage procs from the Shadowbolts flying around.

Now obviously, resilience will be nowhere near as good as offensive stats point-for-point, but it is still better than nothing.

 

suicuique

While the tests did not prove anything, they give an indication.
An inferior OH weapon (by itself) gave (considerably) more total DPS.
Whether this is due to the lower speed (and thus higher flurry uptime - data on this could have helped here) or to synchronized speed ...I don't know.
I think we see both effects at work here.

EDIT: Ahh, on second thought, I finally got your reasoning. That him fighting the mobs (unless someone else tanked) would inevitably result in some parries and as such negating the synchronized weapon speeds. From this you conclude that most (if not all) of his result was due to other criteria (lower speed presumably) and not the matched speed. Hmm, yes that sounds reasonable.

And as to your objection that parrying would negate the syncronized speed: most fury warriors do not tank, and as such do not parry - so this should be not an argument per se against synchronized weapon speed (in a PvE Raid environement).

 

suicuique

I'm pretty sure flurry is consumed be all "next swing" abilities.
That covers all white damage AND cleave/heroic strike, which produce yellow damage.

 

Grymm

Currect, but slam is not an "on next attack" ability. Perhaps my wording was poor. All auto-attack swings (and abilities that augment auto-attack swings) consume flurry charges. Instants and additional attacks (HoJ procs, sword spec procs, WF, slam, BT, MS, WW, Hamstring) do not.

Now, my own question: given the recoding of WF, can the second hit of a cleave proc WF? HS can proc WF and the first hit of cleave should but what about the second? It still falls into the "on next attack" category, but is also of the "aoe" physical school similar to WW. When I'm DPSing 2 trash mobs, there are generally too many numbers on the screen to really know what is going on.

 

Lopert

Davia what is your normal attack sequence. That DPS is jaw dropping.

Also what is the Best enchant for weapons for Dual wielders?

 

Paa

Pretty sure solarians sapphire makes battleshout;

517AP for warriors
470AP for rogues / druids etc

Which means this trinket is insanely good for you and everyone in your party.

 

Charsi

Double heroism tends to do that :P

 

Ercassiel

You bring up a very good point with Enrage.

I am, however, having trouble understanding how would a stat like resilience, which hinders the frequency and damage dealt to you via a crit, lead to a proc of a talent like enrage which is crit driven. Do you mind shedding some light on this "coding" you are speaking of?

 

Charsi

Resilience reduces the chance to be crit. However, the way things seem to have been done, the game has no way of knowing if a regular hit you take was "supposed" to have been a crit (but wasn't due to Resilience). So they do a second roll, for all non-critical hits taken, against your Resilience in order to fudge the "oh, this was supposed to have been a crit" calculation and decide whether to effects like Enrage.

Subsequently, stuff that cannot crit can proc Enrage through Resilience, like standing in fires. Or at least it used to be able to. I still get Enraged occasionally in a raid by NPC stuff, and I think that includes spells which can't crit.

This is also the reason a "crit that wasn't" doesn't proc Enrage AND Blood Craze - when you're crit, both proc, but ordinary hits, the roll against Resilience is two separate rolls (one for each effect). The chance of both coming true at the same time is pretty small. There's a blue post about it someplace on that cardplace website.

 

world

Yeah thats pretty much exactly how it works.

To simplify it further, assume you had sufficient resilience to "reduce your chance to be crit by 100%" What the game would do is assume that _every single_ attack made against you would have crit, but was prevented by your resilience.

In this case, every single time you take damage, you would receive both enrage and blood craze

 

suicuique

Resilience being able to proc enrage on abilities which usually can't crit (spells, specials, AE effects) or amplifying the proc chance over the original crit chance the mob had (your academical 100% example) seems very very unintended to me.

I wouldn't count on that to be in game for long.

 

Dots

It seems very much intended, for PvP reasons, and it's been like that for quite some time.
Even with this effect, resilience is still a horrible stat to wear in PvE. I don't see any reason to change it, at least not right now. Unless they can somehow prevent this from happening in PvE without changing the effect in PvP.

 

Grymm

The intention of the mechanic is to not devalue talents which are based on crit events (like enrage) with resilience making a PVP warrior who values enrage highly have to choose between his effective talents and his resilience PVP gear. The idea is to maintain crit based events like enrage at their pre-resilience proc rates while decreasing the crit rates through the resilience mechanics. If resilience roll currently has not check for "can crit/crit chance", there will likely be a modification/correction to it. Can a warlock proc enrage in a warrior wearing resilience through dots? That would be an enrage proc that would not normally happen as dots cannot crit. Thus, in the PVP environment, enrage actually gains in usefulness with resilience giving you and unintended proc rate. Now, if you had 50% crit chance reduction through resilience giving you a 50% chance to gain blood craze/enrage but only facing opponents who only natively have ~20-30% crit chance, your resilience has increased your proc rate above what would normally even be possible. This is important because in PVE, mobs/spells usually only have a 5-6% crit rate. It is very easy to surpass that with resilience.

 

Paa

You realise no PvE mobs spells crit ever, No Boss aoe damage ever ever crits.

Resillence in PvE is a totally worthless stat if your DPS'ing.

 

Apate

While I agree with your conclusion, I think you missed the entire point of what was posted above by Charsi and others. When a spell hits you, resilience mechanics say that a roll is made to determine if the non-crit spell would have been a crit, and enrage may be triggered accordingly. Because of one quirk or another, this roll doesn't take into account that some spells cannot crit.

See you, auntie.

 

Paa

I understand what's said reading through it again, I still dont think resillence is a worthwhile PvE stat at all as a dps warrior.

And at some point it may get bugfixed what's been described (Ive never seen it happen)

 

Celthis

It won't be fixed, because it's not a bug. It's the implementation of resilience, to allow players to keep their defensive on-crit procs, while also reducing the severity and frequency of crits.

 

Grymm

If resilience leads to an increase in talent crit based procs even during situations when it is not intended (ie triggering on uncrittable events like Dots), it would seem to me to be incorrectly implemented and not inline with the original intention. As such, I could see the implementation being fixed.

 

Gokey

They can't fix it without re-doing the entire combat system.

 

Charsi

I find it vaguely useful, personally. I wear it for trash clearing sometimes. Occasionally, dumb stuff happens, tanks die, mobs get loose, I pull aggro (usually the latter more than anything) and I find myself "tanking". In resilience gear I can pull on a shield and, while I take a ton of damage, I do feel a little bit tougher than if I was caught in pure dps plate.

It's like a nice middleground set that you can dps in without losing too much and, if something goes wrong, pick up and survive trash adds in a pinch. It's certainly nothing i'd wear full time or to tank anything serious, but I take on trash with Gladiator's gear rather than itemrack in my full tanking suit.

After all it is my highest HP gear I have laying around that renders me uncrittable without gimping my damage or my threat.

I'm pretty sure I have occasionally procced enrage off NPC spells, they've fixed most of the really obvious stuff (like standing near braziers in IF, or fall damage), so it's mostly physical damage and maybe one or two spells they might have overlooked. I'm almost certain i've never procced it off a dot.

 

Clockwise

For me, I wear the season two chest over [Chestguard of the Conniver], which is the correct decision, I think, in the absence of tier 5, for lack of a drop. Also, season 2 gloves were a clear upgrade for T4 gloves imho. As has been well-established by now, hit isn't everything.