Taliafears

It's for paladins, so I haven't added it to the list.. but I too have stared enviously at their badge-loot treat. I might toss it on the sheet just to see how it stacks up.

For now I've got a first draft accounting for threat per second. Pay special attention to the bottom right of the stats page.. It's greyed out but there's a little stat-weight calculator that combines tanking value with threat value. Pretty nifty way to obtain the stat values you might want to use on the Gear List sheet.

Fixed a few bugs too, Bonefist gauntlets had 10 more parry than I'd given them credit for, among other little fixes.

The first post has been updated with the new sheet.

 

Sambuca

I had some free time to browse the spreadsheet so I just made a new line for the badges chest and then copied the formula into the AEP column after putting in stats for it. AEP came out to be 3988. So it is above T4 but under the Zul'Jin drop. Hope I didn't mess anything up but if you get around to adding it in it should be close at least

ps
thanks for the effort in making the sheet

 

Taliafears

New version uploaded, see the Intro sheet for changelog. I'll try to be a bit more careful noting changes there.

I did add Stoic Guardian (which I am grudgingly about to purchase), Season 3 gear, and some new Sunwell stuff.

 

Ashlan

Great work!!

On the intro-page you exlpain what TTLWeight, BurstWeight, and ThreatWeight are for - but I'm missing some information about the range of possible values and if these numbers are connected in some way.

Hope you will add the 2.4-badge-items soon.

 

Taliafears

The range doesn't really matter, just their values relative to each other. I have been adding the 2.4 items to the sheet and will release another version soon.

 

Borodin

Great update to a great tool and the defensive stats shown for me look right.

Some suggestions:
1. You will need to include Haste as a Stat as it appears on a few 2.4 Tank items and whether people like it or not it boosts DPS/Threat.
2. In the stat summary please include total Block Value (including the modifier from talents and the new Meta gem!)

Problem:
The TPS figure looks really low because it appears to be made up of threat from white swings and Heroic Strike only - I see no mention of Shield Slam, Revenge and Devastate. I am pretty sure you've built them in somehow but it's not immediately clear and the value looks to be about 60% of my true output.
EDIT: found the cycles so going to dig about and see where it's going wrong.

Also, I note you use a Threat multiplier of 1.45 for Defiance when infact it's generally held to multiplicative and therefore 1.495

 

Taliafears

The next version of the sheet has Haste Rating and Armor Penetration, both on the gearlist and added into the threat calculations. I'm also working on adding the new meta gem and allowing you to choose which one you use (before 2.4 it was a no-brainer).

I intend for the block value on the fitting room sheet to be your true total block value, but I can parrot that over to the stats sheet for clarity.

The TPS figure may look lower than you're used to seeing in omen. There are four primary possible causes for this:

1. I'm not including some things. Darkmoon Vengeance is still on the to-do list, as are curse of recklessness, windfury, enchant gloves - threat, shield spikes, and probably a couple more things I'm forgetting. At the beginning of a fight (which is usually when I'm watching Omen the closest), you may very well have misdirect on you which I can't account for. You may get prayer of mending, thorns, fire shield, etc.
2. Omen shows you a much shorter term average than I do. The human brain will tend to remember the peaks and not the valleys, so from watching Omen you may have an overinflated sense of your abilities.
3. Heroic strike threat is highly dependent on the amount of damage you are taking. I am still working to get boss profiles for different bosses that are accurate, but I don't have any that hit harder than Morogrim. If you've been tanking a lot of T6 content you probably have a lot more rage available than the sheet predicts.
4. Latency can have a pretty significant impact. If your latency is really good, you may be beating the sheet (I kind of doubt it though).

It most certainly is calculating threat from the major abilities, it's only using heroic to consume the excess rage. If you look at the greyed out numbers on the right you'll see that it makes a choice on the cycle to use and has average threat numbers for all the abilities.

On defiance.. I am going off of what I've read in the past which clearly stated it was additive. I've not investigated this in a long time but I did actually notice it is claimed to be multiplicative in the 'The Protection Warrior' thread recently. How well tested is this claim?

 

Edimus

Great update! Thanks!

 

Taliafears

New version uploaded. Finally accounted for parry mechanics, among other things.

 

Punscho

All threat reducing and inducing abilities are multiplicative since well before 2.0. Except perhaps bear form.

 

Taliafears

Well, for a long time after 2.0 people were still including the "except defiance!" everywhere I read.

Anyway, I'll toss it up as multiplicative until I find evidence to the contrary.

 

Sepulture

I noticed that on the stats worksheet in cell B44 you are using the .208% average speed increase from parry (the one you demonstrated in the protection warrior thread). Here's a reprint of the reply (I went back and edited the original).

Long story short, unless I am wrong, which isn't unheard of, I think the value is .24 rather than .208.

 

Taliafears

Ah, we are working on two different assumptions.

You are subtracting 40% of total weapon speed for every parry that comes in the first 40% of the swing timer. Your spreadsheet spends the first 40 rows doing B = A - 40

What I am doing is reducing the REMAINING time by 40%. So if it comes with 80% of the swing left, it will come 80%*.6=48% later. Whereas you would have done 80-40=40% later.

Rereading the parry mechanics thread and Quigon's section on parry, I think it's clear that your way is correct. I'll correct my math on this for the next release.

 

Ashlan

1.) I'm missing "executioner" as weapon enchant

2.) On the gear list, in the weapon section, you specify DPS und speed in one column and then parse the values from this string. Well, when using a excel-version that hat "," instead of "." for the decimals (e.g. german) this will break. What about setting up two columns for weapons: DPS and speed where you enter just the numbers - I assume that excel would convert numbers correctly.

 

Borodin

Thanks for the reply however it does not really explain the discrepancy in recorded Threat vs. estimate Threat.

My figures are not just from Omen but from WWS parses of sustained Threat of for example 1K TPS. The Threatdown spreadsheet elsewhere on EJ also predicts my TPS quite accurately at 1,100 TPS and so on.
This sheet is estimating 654 TPS which is a huge difference.

I've tried adjusting the incoming damage from the Options page but even quintupling the incoming DPS only grants me +100 TPS

I've accurately reflected my gear (right down to all the correct gems) and all the buffs I usually have.

Can anyone else check their estimate TPS on the Stats page?

 

Taliafears

Thanks for pushing me on this.. I looked back over the numbers carefully and found a huge issue with heroic strike threat. You should see much more TPS now. As this is a big fix I'll try to get a new version uploaded today.

 

Taliafears

New version is up.

 

Borodin

The newest version looks a lot more realistic - thanks for rooting out the bug!

 

jon3k

Same here, was pretty upset over the fact that the prot warrior chest drops from zul'jin but pallys can run 5 man heroics and kara for their t5 quality chest.

Ok, enough QQ, fantastic job on the spreadsheet. I've used several of these (for other classes and specs) and this is far and away the easiest and most intuitive. Really great work, thanks, your hard work is definitely appreciated.

 

Taliafears

Thanks, glad to know people are getting use out of it.

Uploading a new version, added a new ranged weapon, and several more stat additions/fixes.

 

Ashlan

If I switch on "Anger Management" in the options I get weird numbers for calculated conversions on the gear list page, e.g. -24,1 for stam.

 

Taliafears

Uploaded a new version. Finally got a few calculations going for BT/MS + Tact. Mastery. All I can find is threat = 1.63 x dmg for 3/3 TM, based on the talent data mined from the client. If anyone can link me to hard evidence/testing, I'd love to see it. This scheme seems to favor BT over MS for offspec tanking, making 31/30 pretty darn attractive.

 

gia

What weapons are you using to determine BT > MS? Will tanking with a 2.6 speed mainhand as MS change this or is it worse because of less heroic strike threat?

 

Taliafears

I only looked with Mallet. That's a good point about getting a 2.6s weapon. BT threat is also very volatile, it scales too well with AP, so a battle shout or blessing of might can make a huge difference. It seems like it would have made a lot more sense to give both abilities a static amount of threat. This is why I'd really like to see some testing to confirm how it works, as the current model seems too unstable.

 

Sambuca

Helm from Hex Lord in ZA got changed from +40 block rating to +40 def