ricked

In terms of that rotation where would shockwave fit in? whenever its on CD (20 secs), or is TC a better aoe now?

 

Ambika

I'd use shockwave after thunderclap since TC is all around you and Shockwave will stun mobs in a cone. I don't think I want everything stunned as it comes in as chances are your AOE DPS monkies will start casting right as soon as they are in range. DPS that's dumb starts to pull right before you have a chance to do any amount of threat.

I'd place TC in higher priority over SW and make sure you have that Glyph of Sunder(one that puts sunder on 2 targets) on at all times during massive trash pulls.


On a side note: has anyone found Vigilance to be of use yet or is it still on the "We hate this buggy ability" list? The guild wants me to spec it, but I've been hearing and reading that it's still not transferring the full amount of threat it's supposed to: 10%

 

Telomar

Vigilance does work ok now. The use is questionable but given the loss of a lot of threat reduction tools your healer or main dps will probably still approve.

 

Writhe

Ambika, on vigilance is one talent point that hard to come by? It fits into most of my spec variants easily at 70 and 80.

I agree with not using shockwave off the bat. But I think the only reason for that is they aren't in range. I haven't been having any problems with early aoe dps regardless of what i use first, but you want to save sw until all mobs are around you in range and in the frontal cone.. The one you have to watch out for these days are the rogues and retribution paladins

I also would put TC at a higher priority over SW when taking on aoe tanking as that debuff makes an incredible difference (as does demo shout)

Soloman, after having a big rant about how you were wrong and we always had a priority system I wrote out the rotation and realised it wasn't a rotation it was a priority algorithm to be used EVERY global cooldown.

Algorithms:
Prot Spec with SnB:
1: Thunderclap if timer <= 12seconds
2: Demo. shout if timer <= 3 gcd
3: Shield Slam
4: Revenge
5: Devastate

Non SnB:
1: Thunderclap if timer <= 12seconds
2: Demo. shout if timer <= 3 GCD
3: Revenge
4: Shield Slam
5: MS/BT (Spec dependant) -> replace with Sunder/Devastate if < 5 stacks or rage starved.

Notes:
-Each Global Cooldown should start from line 1
-Each line is use where CD is free
-Block, Bash, Spell reflect and others should be considered reactional and used when necessary
-Heroic Strikes and other spells not covered by the gcd including those above, should be used where rage allows or the need is there.
-Could be a good move to throw in SW around revenge if the mob is stunable and you have the rage free to the point it won't stunt your rotation during or after the stun.
-Bloodrage could be used on CD with higher priority than SS/Revenge if rage staring is occurring.
-Start of encounters should use a snap aggro combo for initial threat like always (HS queued and requed, SS -> Dev)

Who pulled the surger with the core hound?

 

Warstehgnome

This is absolutely true and should really be every warriors situation and thinking. We have to prioritize, not just keep shield slam and revenge on cooldown. If shield slam is on cooldown and revenge is not, use revenge. Then if shield slam pops up, start it over.

Really there is not much of a rotation atm, just a series of priorities in an ideal situation.

Tsarurukai, Tank of <OP> Blackrock
www.op-guild.net
Tankspot Member Wars.

 

7Sam

Any chance that this is also the situation of Arms PVE DPS?

 

Writhe

I haven't been following the changes. But I assume so, hearing about the crit stacking and overpower spam.

Just put the gcd restricted abilities in order. Highest damage per rage (dpr) at the top.

If you're playing as buff bitch put TC/demo in the same way it was in the prot list.

more on demo/TC: depending on the situation I would probably debate tc/demo being top priorities even above SS/Revenge. - tanking isn't all about threat and demoshout/thunderclap do some OP amounts of mitigation.

Prot Spec with SnB:
1: Thunderclap if timer <= 12seconds
2: Demo. shout if timer <= 3 gcd
3: Shield Slam
4: Revenge
5: Devastate

edited orig post to reflect

Who pulled the surger with the core hound?

 

• landsoul

As promised, I got a usable sheet ready
FURY DPS, classic or TG style, TADA:

http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t23083-w..._a/#post677532

Has most of the things that you could want to play around with.

 

Ambika

did they change demo shout to provide more aggro or are we using it mostly for the debuff? I use demo shout rarely due to it's low aggro vs other abilities.

 

Fedaykin

nvm silly post

 

• landsoul

Since when does Endless Fury does not increase damage of cleave? You have a source? Its only Slam, Whirlwind, and BT.

 

Warstehgnome

This rotation would only be true if you were tanking in boss fights and had no one else doing these. If you're survivability is stable, It would be SS, then Rev, then debuffs, then dev in that priority as delaying a Shield slam or revenge cooldown is just not worth it, unless you are bottoming out on survivability.

Tsarurukai, Tank of <OP> Blackrock
www.op-guild.net
Tankspot Member Wars.

 

Fedaykin

Sigh... been a but busy the last few weeks and just saw they actually removed the cleave part together with the hs part from it back when they changed it. Meh jut dont bother then

 

Kcinham

I'm sitting here staring at my talent window. Initially I was going to go TG, but really don't feel like adding so many hit gems plus from everything I've read, seems like Arms is doing better in the raid area.

So i'm going to be speccing 53/8, BUT don't know whether to choose Axe or Sword Spec (Have Cat's Edge and BoH). Are the differences so minor that it's just a flip of the coin? or is Axe really more beneficial because of the crit? And then whenever the SD proc per hit happens, will sword than take over as better? Thanks!!

 

cainor

As far as i could test it. Spec 53/8, use your dw weapons, go into zerker and hit the ms>ww>exe>hs rotation.
I tried variations with rend and overpower but with the one above i did ~2.4-2.6k dps at 70 on the level 70 trainingsdummy.
Hope im not that wrong.
I had to skill sword since I wanted to keep my warglaives. The swordspec-proc was only around 1%, so if you have axes, go for them.
Axes shall be superior to sword, dont know if they even beat the warglaive proc.

 

Dots

If you don't have infinite rage, which really only happens on a few bosses, you might want to use Revenge before Shield Slam if both are off CD and the SS is not free.

 

Soloman

My priority system was very general, I realized that as I posted it. I didn't have the time to sit down and theorycraft out all the math involved.

On your non-S&B rotation one thing to consider is the effect of Unrelenting Assault for arms, with the current build what it does is allow 3 revenges to be thrown each time you dodge parry block due to the shorter than global cooldown on Revenge.

Example:

Mob hits Solo for 10(9001 blocked).
Revenge
Revenge
Mob hits Solo for 4000.
Revenge
Something else like Shieldslam
Mob swings and is parried
rev..etc


Basically when you parry/block/dodge it lights up the Revenge icon for 5 seconds, allowing up to 3 revenges.

I screwed around with it a bit on test before it went live and its scary.

Is it better than Prot? didn't feel like it
Is it better than Fury? leaps and bounds

Basically if your arms you spam SS and Rev and if your lucky maybe toss in a sunder for single targets (HS is a given dependant on rage).

 

Devimus

Has anyone checked to see if the bug went live where you were specced TG, and while keeping the two 2handers equiped, respecced to arms and maintained the two 2handers?

I'd check myself, but I am having serious patching issues (already had to reinstall due to files being too large... wtf...)

 

Mordenthal

Could anyone elaborate on the current Arms rotation?

I suppose you'll be ditching bersker stance and stay in battle stance doing some kind of Overpower/MS/Slam/Execute rotation?

 

shed

It seems to mostly be stay in battle stance and then keep rend up (use a dot timer) and spam MS/WW/OP/Slam. I saw previously someone saying to use a 53/8 build but use DW 1hers, does that end up providing more raid PvE DPS?

 

Bigbazz

Im not sure how many other people have tried this, but on the PTR when testing i got considerably more dps using axe spec, duel wielding in berserker stance with an arms build. I tried all the play styles and while battle-stance with a 2hander worked well i kept coming out with higher dps while duel wielding in berserker stance.

The european realms arent up yet with the new patch but im definately going to do more testing, using a 53/8/0 spec, picking up all of the rend/overpower talents, so its exactly the same build using duel wield. Using mortal strike/whirlwind on cooldowns, slam inbetween and sudden death whenever it procs, basecly trying to maximise sudden death procs by using an attack on every global cooldown. Now i might not have been playing idealy with the 2handed style, because its a lot more complex (having to keep up rend + sunder armor, alongside managing cooldowns/overpowers/slams and sudden death) and obviously that could have skewed things.


After reading about, it seems some of my armor ignore gear that was best in slot (or damn close) is no longer any good. Do you guys think it would be worth ditching the leggings of divine retribution for the legguards of endless rage or brutal gladiators S4 legs? Considering i will be staying arms spec atleast until level 80 where i will have outgrown them anyway.

 

Kysimir

Kara last night yeilded a result (for L70)

Thunderclap is very situational. Usually, it was best to stick to bladestorm or Sweeping Strikes with the occasional Cleave. If I blade stormed the guest group (or shade groups) I typically had significantly higher DPS than the Tclap rotation.

The problem here lies in that Bladestorm has a cool down, making Tclap more readily available. But, since the habit (for me) was to Tclap at all the wrong times, It prolly did a little more harm than good. So I gave up on it. (Even when I Tclapped at ever GCD and had artificially high rage, it still accounted for less than 20%. Regardless of mobs effected. Possible that if I had more mobs it'd come out ahead but *shrug*)

I'll test it in ZA, but so far its looking to be a debuff that doesnt hurt your dps quite as much.

Battle Stance

Rend > Mortal Strike > Slam > Slam > Mortal Strike > Rend (No procs)
Rend > Mortal Strike > Overpower > Slam > Mortal Strike > Rend (OP proc)
Rend > Mortal Strike > Execute > Slam > Mortal Strike > Rend (Execute Proc)
Rend > Mortal Strike > Execute > Overpower > Mortal Strike > Rend (OP and Execute Proc)

Depending on "procced" abilities, you'll use one of those. Always make sure MS CD is at least 3s before executing. Overpower and MS can be swapped, Execute before Overpower, and Slam can be made an Auto Attack based on rage. Plan for MS to be used every CD.

 

mistersix

This might not be the right place for this but I noticed something odd last night while doing a late nite spec test run in Arcatraz. I got crushed (for very minor amounts of damage) by level 72 trash mobs (fleshbeasts and such). Why is that? Crushes should be gone altogether right?

 

• Valoran

Are you sure it was a crush and not an addon telling you it was a crush? Many early combat log iterations were giving the same error (hitsmode, mikscombattext). Best check the standard combat log.

 

Duranthor

Okay, so I did some instances yesterday as 53/8 and I will raid today however here are my initial impressions.

First off, I was raged flushed. I was using MS, Rend, HS, OP, SD, and BS. I will admit I had some trouble controlling the build a little because it was a far more dynamic dps experience than I was used to. I've been a raiding dps warrior for 2+ years and I have never had more fun than I did yesterday. By my recounts I was doing between 1500-1950 dps. 21% of my damage was white, 19% heroic strike Deep wounds were 10% Execute was like 14% and the rest of the moves made up the rest. When I learn how to play the build better I expect my numbers to rise. I should have WWS stat data tonight; we plan on trying for a BT and MH clear tonight so I should have some good data to share.

So I have to say blade storm is awesome. I don’t' know how else to describe it, but when you get your 8-9 attacks in 6 seconds(including white hits) and 4-5 of them crit, the deep wound ticks you see are pretty impressive. Wrecking Crew is ALWAYS up and the synergy of the Heroic Strike Glyph and SD is just really good. I'm kicking myself for passing on the Tier 6 gloves right now, because I suddenly really want that 2 piece bonus. I plan on adding the Execute glyph before I raid tonight, with how much damage I'm doing with sudden death; I think it will pay in dividends.

To sum up, playing arms before it felt like it was all about timing. When you were not perfect, you knew your dps was dropping if you miss timed your slams. Now I feel like if I have rage, I spend it, and I always have rage, and I always have things to do with that rage. I'm thinking that 15-20% white damage for an arms build will not be uncommon.

Anyway, everything else aside, it was fun to play, I'm excited to play wow again for the first time in over a year.