Borodin

Indeed the 1 Second GCD for Rogues (and Cats) is part what makes them Rogues - an inherant advantage in the speed they can deliver special moves or react. But it's also closely tied in with their need to generate and use CPs.

It's not something I see being extended to others though there have been a few examples of talents reducing some GCDs (Affliction Warlocks for example can reduce the GCD of their Curses). So there's the possibility yet of a Prot Talent or Glyph changing GCD for one specific move or circumstance.

 

Nezralix

Unfortunately, there's already a counterpoint: Weap16 - World of Raids Gallery

 

Pyros

Also linked to their Energy system, which comes back as a set amount over time, while warrior rage based mechanics could exploit a lower GCD probably better(not that I'm sure of it due to various cooldowns on every abilities, and the rage dump being on next hit).

About the DK comparison, was just saying, it would be possible to add it without linking it to def stance and make tanking crazy. Don't think they'll add it though, and it's not so much of an issue now that they unlinked pummel from the GCD either. I always thought the biggest advantage of rogues over wars was in pvp, where they could react to spells and kick faster than warriors. The rest is rather balanced imo. DKs will get better GCD in unholy, at the expense of 15%damage on specials, which is a rather big bunch, and they're still limited to the number of abilities over 10secs due to rune system anyway, and in the lot, they're forced to use non talented crappy abilities(blood strike and plaguestrike as frost, icy touch as unholy, oblit as blood). I don't think warriors have such kind of hardcoded limits to balance them around a GCD reduction.

 

Liar

Not really. Protection is the only spec that has a spammable non-CD instant attack (Devastate). Everything else is either tied to getting procs or has a CD. Keep in mind that Hamstring does not do any damage in Beta either so it's really just that.
I am sure DPS Warriors (especially Fury I think) would really like it if they had shorter GCDs because they are clipping too much of their on-proc abilities with the new talents. A faster GCD would fix that. It would also make Sword and Board less shitty.
Again, not really expecting this to happen but I see absolutely nothing that speaks against implementing this either.

Unexpected TankPoints error Clearly someone doesn't understand how EH works. That, or upgrading from T8 to T9 is optional in beating Arthas. Clearly.

 

Faeviactus

What if the compromise was having Haste gear effect our GCD like it does for casters? With all the itemization for haste that is appearing and the new found desire for it with TG, it seems like it would be a nice sense of scale. It would also help guarantee haste's usefulness over other stats as gear levels get higher.

 

Prinsesa

Nice catch. I only scan MMO-Champ, so that one got right past me.

That does seem to indicate that Blizzard still intends for Warriors (and Paladins, since HOTR is normalized now) to use fast tanking weapons.

"We do want Sanctuary to be the tanking seal"

- Ghostcrawler

 

Muggins

It also seems to have pretty much perfect stats for a deathknight, although i believe the consensus at the moment is that two handers will outstrip dual wield in tanking, but I could be wrong. This would cover the homogenisation obsession by making it decently useable by at least 3 classes.

 

Faeviactus

I am not sure if this was covered but I am wondering if the desired weapon enchants will change when we switch to TG? Obviously not all enchants are likely known in beta so we can't really tell for level 80, but what about 3.0 and leveling?

Is Executioner MH/Mongoose OH still superior or will 2xMongoose be better for the speed increase again? Not sure if any testing is being done but kind of doing some forward thinking on my 2-hander collecting.

 

Nyel

I don't know if anyone has posted this yet but, looks like Precision and Intensify Rage are getting a new location:

MMO-Champion BlueTracker - Intensify Rage (23 Fury) mandatory for PvP

Lets just hope they don't cram them down the arms tree.

 

madpeon

Unless I'm reading that wrong, that developer just confirmed that Arms warriors are not supposed to get Intensify Rage. By swapping places with Precision, it's impossible for any deep Arms warrior to get that talent.

 

Nyel

Yeah, I think he meant Change and not Switch.

Or else this doesn't make any sense at all.

 

Darian_TruBlade

I was under the impression that the reason to use Mongoose was for the large amount of Crit it afforded the Warrior, with the minor speed boost a small but somewhat unimportant perk compared to better Flurry uptime. From that perspective Mongoose is slightly worse than it was as Rampage will guarantee a higher level of base crit for Warriors. However, I doubt it's enough to change which enchant is better.

Leveling, I doubt you'll see many Mongoose/Executioner enchants on anyone save for those that have hoarded mats they don't care to simply AH. Whatever cheap/easy AP or Str enchants are available for weapons will rule the day.

I'm fairly certain he meant switch. Moving Intensify Rage up two tiers makes it effectively unreachable. This removes the possibility for Arms specs to grab the talent without passing up on Trauma, Endless Rage and beyond. What you gain from going deeper into Fury is far less useful than what you lose from Arms.

 

Faeviactus

Well I figure if I have late or mid tier6 2-handers. They will last me the time until Wotlk comes out and probably the first bunch of level in Wotlk so I am just sort of looking at the optimal set up for that time.

 

Gellor

With the advent of TG, is Armor Penetration still the best stat to stack after reaching the hit cap (Also does TG change the importance of hit significantly?), or is haste now superior, especially with regards to getting Deep Wounds rolling, and with bleeds ignoring all armor?


EDIT: Clarfiying hit question.

 

Darian_TruBlade

TG doesn't change the hit caps, they should be as they are on Live.

I don't think Deep Wounds will be a big enough factor to sway the Haste vs Arp argument one way or the other. Without numbers from live it's hard to judge how important it is, but I doubt it'll be a significant enough portion of a Fury Warrior's DPS that it'll make a huge difference in any such debate. It will certainly make Haste and Crit better than they are now, but not by leaps and bounds.

 

Machinator

It wouldnt change the cap, but I think hit might be more important than now because of the time it takes to get rage after a miss or two.

"Information is ammunition."

 

• landsoul

I don't think having hit rating would be more important. Maybe the same, maybe less. Also now that 2 classes can put up a haste buff, you can get in more hits in between using specials.

I am testing it now. The rage gen is pretty hilarious. Also, a full rage bar will get you will give you a full 17.5 second rotation, even if you missed that whole time.

Bloodthirst costs 25 and whirlwind costs 20, and you don't have to hit rampage. Even when killing mobs I can hit Heroic strike around 30% of the time and not even worry about rage.

 

Liar

What level are you if I may ask? I am really interested how this spec is playing out at 77+ where the effect of our T6 starts to wear out because of rating deflation at higher levels. Am I right in suspecting that you are TG spec while being 70-73?

About the hit question: I also don't think we will need more Hit than before. I run around with a 2.7/2.6 MH/OH set as Prot DPS (the key part is that I don't have flurry) in live and I am never rage starved either at level 70 (~11% hit). Assuming equal gear but with 2x2h and active Flurry and some mild haste gear, these 2 handers will be at the same speed my 1 handers are at while hitting harder obviously. And if I don't have problems now, then you won't either as TG.

Unexpected TankPoints error Clearly someone doesn't understand how EH works. That, or upgrading from T8 to T9 is optional in beating Arthas. Clearly.

 

Mild Confusion

Heh, that precision change seems rather counter intuative to me. Instead of making bladestorm more desirable and assisting in how vulnrable arms is to disarm and fear.

 

Ultramax

I never had rage problems at 79 grinding out the last bit to 80 and that was using Northrend quest rewards. It's when you don't have something hitting you that rage becomes an issue.

 

mistersix

What's the new hasting class? I'm drawing a complete blank.

 

Liar

Death Knights (and it isn't the only thing they share with Enh Shammies). Improved Icy Talons - Spell - World of Warcraft

EDIT: Damn you for being too fast, Pyros. :P

Unexpected TankPoints error Clearly someone doesn't understand how EH works. That, or upgrading from T8 to T9 is optional in beating Arthas. Clearly.

 

Pyros

It's 20%.

18% is the amount you reduce target's speed by using icy touch(frost fever debuff) on it. However, you gain 20% with icy talons, and you give 20% to the raid with imp icy talons. They're pretty unrelated, besides the fact you can only gain icy talons(and imp icy talons) when you apply frost fever.

 

Lithose

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warr...12253000000000


I wouldn't say that, really...With the above build, you keep MS/Second wind..

You lose..

Endless Rage, Trauma, OP's on bleeds, Enraged Assault procing MS, 10% MS damage, Enrage on crit and Blade storm (Blood frenzy, to.)

You gain.

Flurry, 20 second fear break, 40 second blood rage, 2 minute death wish, 2% hit, 50% disarm resistance and -2% dodge, 20 rage every 20 seconds (If fighting a non-fear class.).

The choice doesn't seem all that clear to me...Flurry is nearly as good for rage gen as endless rage is, the damage increase from flurry is also probably only slightly less than the enrage damage bonus. So, in essence, due to the 20 second and 40 second, on demand, rage jumps, this tree's rage gen looks as good, or better than its arms counter part. Combine that with being able to increase your damage by 20%, with a 25% up time (2 minute death wish) and disarm resistance and it looks like the numbers are still tilted slightly in fury's favor.

The main problem though isn't intensify rage, nor its position in the tree..Its a great talent, its good that arms warriors should have a choice..The problem was, and is, that the upper tier fury talents are still eclipsing the lower tier arms talents. Though its improved in this patch, its still a problem.

In my opinion, most of this has to do with how lackluster blade flurry is..And the additional polish some of the arms tree needs, namely the rigidness of battle stance...If battle is going to be the primary arms stance, then arms needs to either have more "PvP" abilities added to it (I don't like this idea, except pummel.) or the rage loss for stance swapping has to be made less severe through a lower tier arms talent.

They have to be cautious about doing this though..I may be alone here, but I enjoy the concept of stance swapping, and the penalties associated with it. It should remain a tactical decision that is done with thought due to its limitations. On that token though, arms really doesn't have enough PvP "umph" to warrant its full time use.

 

Aeverius

Eh? Wowhead says 20%. Also, don't forget the 3% you can get from a Ret Paladin now: it's a lot less, but it'll be up as long as the Paladin's alive, and it stacks with the Shaman or DK buff.

[e] Quick reply is not so quick.

Improved Lay on Hands is really fucking good: