Healt

[Royal Seal of King Llane] - From 10-man Yogg-Saron
[Saronite Animus Cloak] - From 10-man General Vezax
[Fate's Clutch] - From 25-man Thorim (Hard Mode)
[Greaves of the Iron Army] - From 10-man Mimiron (Hard Mode)
[Gauntlets of the Iron Furnace] - From 10-man Ignis the Furnace Master
[Furnace Stone] - From 10-man Ignis the Furnace Master
[Seal of Ulduar] -From 10-man XT-002 Deconstructor (Hard Mode) ??? not sure if its from there.

Thanks already by adding them

 

soulsk8r99

I'm currently trying to build my Duel speced tank set and I'm not sure where to gem first. should i gem dodge/parry then stam and if so how much dodge/parry before heading to stam?

 

todemax

I'm going on a whim here, but you could check the spreadsheet. In general you should only aim for avoidance if your healers are having mana issues.

 

ZorbaTHut

A little confused about some aspects of the spreadsheet - hopefully I can ask some questions and get them cleared up

The "parry flag" on the bosses is a bit unclear. It seems like it's a flag that says whether the boss doesn't parry, as per Stats.C14 and the calculations therein. What I don't understand is what the overrides on the GearList are meant to represent. Expertise is doubled if the boss doesn't parry. Why? I'm not sure. In all cases, hit is doubled and defense is multiplied by 1.25. I'm really not sure what this is meant to represent.

Can you enlighten me?

 

Ayekaramba

I think this flag describes parry haste. More Expertise reduces the chance of it.

 

ZorbaTHut

Right, but then what's going on with C14?

=IF($Bosses.$G$13;1;(1-0.24*$Bosses.$C13*C48*(2/3+1/C58)))*$Bosses.$C13

Bosses.G13 is the parry flag. So it's saying "if the parry flag is on, then the boss's attack speed is exactly the boss's normal attack speed, otherwise it's something complicated involving chance-to-parry". So that's why I'm saying it seems to be the "parry doesn't happen" flag.

But then look at GearList.Q3. If the Parry Flag is on - meaning the boss *doesn't parry* - then multiply the value of Expertise by two. Why two? Why are we multiplying the value at all, since the effect of boss parry is already calculated and accounted for, whether the boss parries at all? Why is that adjustment needed at all? And then why are we only multiplying when the boss *doesn't parry*?

Similar questions with GearList.O3 and GearList.I3, which are also making weird seemingly-arbitrary adjustments.

The spreadsheet is dedicated towards objectively figuring out how useful stats are given certain situations and sets of equipment - tossing in an arbitrary adjustment like this seems like saying "well, my spreadsheet says expertise isn't really all that useful, but I really like it so I'm going to toss in a multiplier", and that seems to be somewhat against the spirit of things.

I'm not pulling this stuff out of nowhere, this is derived from looking deeply into the spreadsheet and untangling how it works. I really don't get what the calculations are meant to mean.

 

• Tibor

The parry flag doesn't mean the boss doesn't parry, it means the boss's next attack following a parry isn't hasted. I don't read Excel macro, so I can't offer a clarified or alternate interpretation of that cell, but it seems reasonable that Expertise's relative weight would go down as a result of no parry haste, as Expertise is therefore not a mitigation stat in that scenario.

 

Healt

is the host of this thread totally died or how come he havent updated the sheet in 23 days :o

 

ZorbaTHut

But then why is Expertise's value doubled in that situation?

 

Taliafears

I haven't died, but I've been spending all my free time coding up a new website for my guild. I just launched it last week so hopefully I'll have some time to look at the sheet soon.

As for the parry flag, setting it to TRUE means the boss CANNOT parry haste. So if you turn off the parry flag, it means the boss CAN parry haste and the value of Expertise goes UP. I know it can be confusing if you look at it the wrong way, but I went with the phrasing used in blue posts, where the parry flag is turned ON for a few hard hitting bosses like Patchwerk and Maexxna (and god knows what in Ulduar).

As for the adjustments in the "Overrides" row of the gear sheet, typically I use these to help capture things that the spreadsheet is utterly incapable of. For instance, the need for 540 defense. The sheet is not very good at that. Another instance, the smoothness of threat generation. The sheet cannot take smoothness into account, but it is probably the #1 reason for losing threat on a boss these days (streak of 2 or 3 misses at the beginning of the fight and you have a dead ret pally, in my case).

If you'd prefer to take smoothness and 540 defense into account all on your own, you're free to do that, which is why there's a handy overrides row in the first place. It's easy to empty it out.

 

Taliafears

Hell, I'm up early, here's a new version. Mainly just necessary upkeep:

- added several new items from Ulduar
- updated all remaining “Unknown” sources
- updated price for all Emblem of Conquest items (looks like there was a price increase)
- added Glyphs of Shield Wall and Last Stand (though they don't affect any calculations)
- removed concussion blow from the rotations, it's back on GCD
- changed “Stalwart” gems to 8dod/8def rather than 8dod/8exp
- adjusted Ironbark Faceguard to 62 def (was 68)
- fixed a bug where meta gem special abilities were being multiplied by the value assigned to crit rating
- updated Spiked Deathdealers (looks like they got changed bigtime from PTR)
- reduced max ranks of Spell Reflect to 2

 

Xav

You didn't update the tanking items to their new stats, and many of them changed, so I can't really list them all. Also, some new loot (a new tanking breastplate) was discovered from 10 man Algalon by ensidia, http://www.ensidia.com/media/upload/..._alg_loot2.jpg

However, thanks for doing this, I've been manually editing this stuff in just so I can see stats and such myself.

 

todemax

Shouldn't Q3 at the Gearlist tab then read "=IF(Bosses.G13=0;Q2*2;Q2)"? (0 instead of 1). Right now it seems like the value of expertise is doubled for a patchwerk fight.

 

Glory

This line is correct. Expertise is doubled so that you gear for it and don't get parry gibbed on other Bosses. If the Boss has hasted attacks after a parry the value of Expertise is about 4times higher. The adjusted values are there to ease the use for Tanks who are new with the spreadsheet.

I like to multiply defense with 1.1 (no defense items being lower in value) and Stamina also with 1.1 because a dead Tank can't hold a Boss a long time on him.

 

bryn88

Has anyone come up with newer boss models? I've been working on a couple, but I don't want to reinvent the wheel.

 

Taliafears

That override was written for the express purpose of adding value to expertise for its ability to smooth threat.

When the boss parry hastes, expertise doesn't need any help becoming super valuable, so I only gave it a boost on bosses where it would otherwise look like a very poor stat.

 

Healt

nerffed [The Leviathan's Coil]

 

Cosa

There is one small problem - Boreal Guard is properly listed with 2 gem slots on "GearList" tab, but there is only one gem slot in the "Equip" tab. Just wanted to note that. I would love to change it myself but I am not that experienced about Excel.

 

todemax

Here you go. Haven't tested it much, so there might be errors, but looks ok.

boreal wotlkwarr20090524.ods

 

Reforminded

Like many others here, this spreadsheet has been my bible going through wrath, although now that I am deep into Ulduar 25 I find myself a bit confused as to some of the stat weightings, particularly as they pertain to different boss profiles. I un-hid the boss tab and tried to makes some changes to the weighting, but I really do not understand what the different numbers (.3, .25, etc...) mean and as such am unable to make educated estimations. The main reason I was looking into making changes was that it seemed like in all the boss profiles far too much weight was put onto block, excepting the "filler" where there is an extreme bias towards threat.

MY questions are as follows:

1) Why is there such a bias towards block value and rating?

2) Are any of the current profiles suitable for "filler ulduar boss"?

3) Can you give some explanation of how to adjust the TTL, Burst, and Threat modifiers so I can make educated adjustments to the weighting?

4) What would you changes these modifiers to on the bosses tab in order to best approximate the hard hitting, movement oriented boss fights in ulduar (keeping in mind my 25 man raid has 75% of our DPS over 5k)?

 

janaka

Alright, actually i wanted to double-check these, but didn't have the time lately. So since some people ask for new boss profiles, I'll just post them now. They should be pretty accurate regarding melee damage and constant magic damage, but I'm not absolutely sure about the attack speeds, as Jayde mistrusted them recently.
Also, keep in mind that bosses like Thorim or Hodirs Frozen Blows are pretty hard to impossible to model in this sheet, so i just left them be.

But for what it's worth, here you go:

The Hodir numbers are completely ignoring Frozen Blows.
As always, the weight values do strongly depend on the personal situation.

 

forklift

The DPS column--what is that supposed to be, the boss's damage per second on the tank assuming 0 armor and 0 avoidance? Raw unmitigated damage?

Steelbreaker hits for something like 77k on tank #4, which many guilds just starting on him will have to be prepared for. That's ~275k unmitigated damage per hit, which assuming 1.8s swings, is still over 150k DPS. Are you factoring in the previous tank phases, or like fusion punch casts, or something?

 

janaka

That's right.

Oh, I should have mentioned it: These are all Normal modes, so for Steelbreaker it's his damage without any buffs.
Also ignoring casts; DPS is (Raw unmitigated damage)/(debuffed attack speed) in a melee-only-period.

 

Carnathagia

First off, thank you Taliafears for your hard work on this spreadsheet. It has been invaluable. Also, thank you to Janaka for the new boss information.

I have been attempting to use it to approximate the usefulness of higher levels of block rating and block value against Ulduar 25 bosses once 3.2 hits and block value is increased. I have changed Equip! N69 to:
=ROUND(((SUM(N$4:N$67)*2)+F69/2-10),0)
to model block value from gear only doubling in value. However trying to do this on Equip! N70 is giving me trouble due to the comma separated nature of the formula in this cell:
=ROUND((SUM(N$4:N$67,Buffs!Q38,Trinkets!O28)+F70/2-10),0)
Is anyone with more Excel formula knowledge able to modify the above formula so that it multiplies the sum of N4$:N$67 by 2 without multiplying the value from buffs or trinkets?

Also on a minor note, if anyone knows how to make the new Ulduar bosses show up in the drop down menu on the talents page that would be cool, but the way I have it currently, typing them in works fine.

Thanks!

 

todemax

Block on shields doesn't double. So basicly you have to modify block value on the items you will be using, and only double the "extra" block on shields if itemization is used for that stat. Under trinkets you can just double the uptime on block value buffs.