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Old 12/10/09, 1:32 AM   #2101
ComMcNeil
Von Kaiser
 
Tauren Warrior
 
Azshara (EU)
Originally Posted by alienangel View Post
The hunters tests so far have all come back with AGI/AP/Crit, even after adjusting their gear to have slightly more ArP than crit, so it is looking like it's a fixed trio of stats per class just like Artunias said - RoBoZeO's post was confusing since he said his friend got AGI/ArP/Crit, but he just PM'd me saying it was probably AGI/AP/Crit too, which takes the only outlier out.

I wonder what made blizzard decided to saddle some classes with the ArP proc :/ (if it wasn't obvious, hunters are generally quite relieved to get a crit proc instead of an ArP proc, since we're much further from softcapping crit than hardcapping ArP).
Concerning the new trinket, I do not see what keeps us as treating it exactly like Mjolnir before. Gear until you reach the soft cap of ArP around 55-60% (don't know the exact numbers now) and for the rest, go purely STR.
I suspect we will not have tooooo much ArP if we not gem for it and only use the one thats on the gear itself.


By the way, I got [Bryntroll, the Bone Arbiter] last night. So far, procc accumulates for about 3-4% dmg as a fury warrior in Saurfang battle. Not that bad imho.

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Old 12/10/09, 1:46 AM   #2102
BWarner
Piston Honda
 
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Human Warrior
 
Uldum
The issue with treating Deathbringer's Will like a typical ArP-proccing trinket is that you have a 1-in-3 chance to proc the ArP buff, so the downtime of the buff is buch higher than with any of the other ArP-proccing trinkets.

The Warrior Formerly Known as Aerowyn.

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Old 12/10/09, 1:55 AM   #2103
ComMcNeil
Von Kaiser
 
Tauren Warrior
 
Azshara (EU)
Ok, I agree with you there, but going for a passive 100% ArP is also out of the question I think.

Do we know, how the proccs are distributed? So, does it really "randomly" procc one of the 3 buffs, or do they get procced one after another?

I also think, that the 30sec procc, in comparison with the normal 15sec procc, gives us more possibilities for timing other things with it, like Death Wish. In theory, it should even be possible to time them exactly the same, each CD, because they both should share about 2mins (Fury).

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Old 12/10/09, 2:18 AM   #2104
LtSplinter
Glass Joe
 
Human Warrior
 
Illidan
Is the link for the spreadsheet on the front page the updated link for 3.3 or is it not out yet? Still says its 3.2.2 so im just checkin to make sure, im lost without this spreadsheet lol..some of the new heroics weapons are some pieces are looking fairly decent and would like to check them out

EDIT: And if it is the updated link..when will it be fixed because right now iim getting a page load error when i try to download

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Old 12/10/09, 2:35 AM   #2105
BWarner
Piston Honda
 
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Human Warrior
 
Uldum
What do you mean when you say "going for 100% ArP is ... out of the question"? Do you mean that it doesn't make sense to go for the ArP cap when using this trinket, as any ArP procs are completely wasted? Or do you mean that it's not realistic to shoot for passively capping ArP? If it's the former, then either you cap the stat and the other procs make up for the wasted proc (doubtful), or you use the trinket, gear your passive ArP around the 600/700 ArP proc, and jip yourself out of a load of benefit from more passive ArP. If it's the latter...

It forces a crummy gear setup, either way you slice it. I'm convinced that there's some crucial information that we're missing here, similar to the early reactions to the (now modified) Needle-Encrusted Scorpion.

The Warrior Formerly Known as Aerowyn.

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Old 12/10/09, 3:02 AM   #2106
ComMcNeil
Von Kaiser
 
Tauren Warrior
 
Azshara (EU)
Sorry for not talking clearly. I meant the former.

I see no sense in even gemming for ArP (depending on the coming gear of course), when using the trinket, as I think gemming for STR would yield not that much less DPS, but is usefull regardless of procc.

But you may be right in the regard, that we miss some info here, altough first tests do not suggest such a thing.

@LtSplinter: unfortunatly not updated yet

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Old 12/10/09, 8:44 AM   #2107
Eka
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Warrior
 
Azuremyst
LtSplinter, Landsoul will update his post with the 3.3 version when he is finished with it, is my guess. I've asked him to send me the sheet and I will upload it to my website again.

For the time being, the current 3.2 version is linked underneath the filefront link on the first page of this thread for those that were asking for it previously, and according to my web traffic, it's been downloaded more than a few times .

Here it is again, incase you're lazy and dont want to go back to the first page :P

http://www.ekagaming.com/landsoul/Wa...03Excel07.xlsm

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Old 12/10/09, 8:57 AM   #2108
Brakthir
Von Kaiser
 
Orc Warrior
 
Illidan
Gemming for hard cap on Arp is probably going to be the way to go as far as Fury goes anyway, since so much of the gear in ICC has arp on it.

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Old 12/10/09, 10:46 AM   #2109
landsoul
Myrmidon Champion
 
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Worgen Warrior
 
Alterac Mountains
My guess is the Deathbringer's Trinket will still be better than all other trinkets even with the one and a half wasted procs. It's that silly. 30 second duration 105 second ICD is about under 30% uptime between all 3 procs. That's ~9% uptime for 700 STR, and ~9% uptime for 700 crit.

To reiterate, it's a stupidly good trinket with stupid good procs even if one of them is completely useless. Just think about popping deathwish with over 2k extra AP or 14% extra crit?!?!?

Last edited by landsoul : 12/10/09 at 5:03 PM.

>--Coaching Site--< Private coaching / Warrior Resource
>--Stream--< Tues, Wed, 7 Eastern.

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Old 12/10/09, 10:49 AM   #2110
landsoul
Myrmidon Champion
 
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Worgen Warrior
 
Alterac Mountains
Originally Posted by Slickmove View Post
The formula I am using is
=(INT(1/AA174))/(1/AA174)
(AA174 is CPS in case you changed anything)

I was comparing it to some of my single target WoL's and it seems to be pretty accurate. In most cases due to the no crit rule, your hits per second with deep wounds is the same as your crits per second. On a graph, the closer you are to a number that can round to 1, the higher hits/sec you have with deep wounds



Obviously this formula needs to be tweaked. It will break after you pass 1 crit per second (Although for that to happen you would need a 68% chance to crit and the T9 4pc). It looks like with this formula my T10 set bonus will have a 25% uptime with 407 Average AP!
Hmm I'm pretty Sure I don't want a jagged curve like that. They don't usually give good results. I was looking more for a smooth curve.

>--Coaching Site--< Private coaching / Warrior Resource
>--Stream--< Tues, Wed, 7 Eastern.

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Old 12/10/09, 12:26 PM   #2111
Bociphus
Glass Joe
 
Gnome Warlock
 
Sargeras
The reason the graph is "choppy" is because of teh nature of DW. If your time between crits is an integer value, DW will tick normally (i.e once per second) but at off integer values it will tick at a diminishing rate, thus the peaks at values like .2, .25, .5, etc. If the choppiness of the graph is really a concern, also remember that this is only going to effect those wearing 2 t10 pieces, thus their CPS will most likely be above .5, thus the graph now is fairly linear.

Unless I am missing something in the mechanics of DW and the refreshing of it with later crits, the formula posted should be accurate.

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Old 12/10/09, 12:36 PM   #2112
landsoul
Myrmidon Champion
 
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Worgen Warrior
 
Alterac Mountains
Well let's say we can't use Average Crits Per Second. Let's say you have over 1.0 crits per second. Based on averages, you will never get a single deep wound off, when it's truely the case that there is a chance where you won't crit for more than a second.

Maybe I should treat it like flurry uptime, which is based on the probability of noncrits within the duration of the flurry buff... where instead of the flurry duration I should use 1.0 seconds instead of around 3-4 seconds for flurry. It would look like the flipped version of flurry uptime with crit scaling.

>--Coaching Site--< Private coaching / Warrior Resource
>--Stream--< Tues, Wed, 7 Eastern.

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Old 12/10/09, 2:02 PM   #2113
 frmorrison
Protector
 
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Ashstrike
Human Paladin
 
No WoW Account
Originally Posted by landsoul View Post
My guess is the Deathbringer's Trinket will still be better than all other trinkets even with the one and a half wasted procs. It's that silly. 30 second duration 90 second ICD is about 30% uptime between all 3 procs. That's 10% uptime for 700 STR, and 10% uptime for 700 crit.

To reiterate, it's a stupidly good trinket with stupid good procs even if one of them is completely useless. Just think about popping deathwish with over 2k extra AP or 14% extra crit?!?!?
Will has a 105 second ICD, so about a 28% uptime between the 3 procs. Also, isn't the 264 trinket give 600 of X stat?

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Old 12/10/09, 3:00 PM   #2114
BWarner
Piston Honda
 
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Human Warrior
 
Uldum
Correct, Frmorrison. I'm sort of wondering where you're getting those numbers, too, Landsoul. =P Plus, all of that Crit may be slightly devalued due to Crit-capping at Icecrown gearing levels. Just throwing that out there.

The Warrior Formerly Known as Aerowyn.

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Old 12/10/09, 3:12 PM   #2115
Flaps
Von Kaiser
 
Orc Warrior
 
Al'Akir (EU)
The following video showing the procs, YouTube - Deathbringer's Will can be considered as proof, there's no scene change between the first two and procs from the first guy being showed.

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