Originally Posted by Arantis
Having bloodsurge procing from more than BT and from hits instead of crits brought 1) unlinking slam from crit and therefor making crit rating worthless for the ability per se to proc and 2) seeing slam procing more often. The problem is that the latter didnt offer an upgrade - at least not that significant that worths talking about it- on the percentage of total dps slam represents. Even going from 6% to 10-12% which is double doesnt mean that you gained 4-6% more dps on that fight because simply you used slam more. This could happen for many reasons like prioritising by mistake slam over the other cds and i dont think i have to explain more.
Moreover, none can guarantee that you will actually utilise all your procs and this mainly comes from the fact that still slam is GCD. Scenario: You are sitting middle rage bar, you use HS, you get a proc, you see slam procing but on the same time BT and WW are ready for use. Of course the examples of how a proc can be wasted are numberless. BUT if slam was out of gcd.....that would solve many things and i really really doubt it would be so OP in pvp..
The fact that i dont like the choice of slam instead of lets say VR is personal preference indeed and my reason for that is simple. The last time i used slam in tbc was in gruul with a pug where i was just sitting full rage and on a dangerous threat position and i opened my spellbook to use it...( funny eh?) But now i am forced to use that ability in my fury rotation although blizzard actually listened after some years and moved improved slam talent to arms.....But if they had chosen VR instead like many players suggested it would offer balance around TG ( as they stated its their goal) and actually freeing 1 keybind (lol), besides the background of the tree was always connected with pure AP instead of weaponry like arms, at least untill TG was implemented.
Furthermore i cant follow you on that 'remarkable' scale with gear and / or temporary cds or even flurry uptime. Hasted attacking will boost the ratio of procs by its 1/3 since only the HS will be used more often and nothing else and assuming no execute usage.Also the chance to proc has nothing to do with gear besides more rage gaining aka more HS spam- a difference to proc which you wont even notice. As i said i cant see any worthy scale or significant increase to what that proc brings. Throw this to an era of ridiculous encounters, short lasted where bloodlusted dps is like 1/3 of total time and a personal rng covering crits to glancings that made my rng from +-100 in tbc to +-1500 and you get my picture.
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The unlinking of slam from BT crits that you speak of does nothing else but slightly reduce the value of critical strike rating in terms of SEP, although that's not really relevant since it's still a good 2nd and was a good 2nd before the bloodsurge change anyway. Besides, coming from playing a rogue high-end for years where there's less RNG involved (or used to be at least) I felt really stupid whenever the stars were far from aligned and gave me a real low critrate on BT's. I always found it strange that that small number of attacks had such a huge impact on your overall dps pre-3.0.8. If we're considering the total raw damage that one BT crit dealt pre-patch that would be:
BT crit + 48 % weapon damage + Slam and if critted + 48 % additional weapon damage on that.
Nothing strange about that, but imagine that you would see all that damage instantly the moment you're critting BT. What you will see is something that reminds of the old days when you could chain sword spec procs and so forth. That is quite some damage dealt and there's no skill whatsoever involved, just rolling the dice right, and the damage dealt in total swiftly outshines that of a non-crit BT by a
huge margine. So, rolling the dice right every 10th attack (if my napkin math isn't destroyed by WWS discrepancies on 10 % of all attacks made) = over-the-top dps and rolling the dice wrong every 10th attack = slightly above rogues. Now, where's the fun in being completely left out to RNG the way to the top? And yes, old bloodsurge was way more to play the RNG than the current version.
Also the ability's usage that you are mentioning right after seeing increased slam procs is my interpretation that in the hands of a good warrior this is a good talent, and in the hands of a bad one the dps probably ends up lower by chasing slams that doesn't fit into the rotation. Practice and knowledge, that's all it takes. And keep in mind that the bloodsurge change was in a patch that had no intention whatsoever to buff (goodgeared) pve warrior damage (although it did slightly buff damage for all I can see), all it did was to add some versatility to the talent and letting it be more flexible although it doesn't really show yet, as you say, during our 1:30-2:00 bossfights.
And, for the record, the scenario you mention above isn't one where slam gets wasted; If you see slam proccing the same time WW and BT are up on cooldown you'd have 2 seconds after those two attacks are put on cooldown again to slam with 0 ms, and realistically somewhere between 1.8-1.9 seconds on a somewhat lagfree night.
The "remarkable scaling" I'm talking about is the extreme burst damage warriors can provide with the new bloodsurge + a heroism coupled with death wish usage. During this window of time we'll see an increased number of procs due to a rage gain that shoots through the roof allowing alot of HS, and not to mention the increased hs-dropping with all that haste. This will prove really useful on encounters where you need good burst dps and can't afford to wait with heroism until execute phase (which is why I mentioned Ulduar since pretty much only Sartharion 3D is where you can pop heroism before execute phase in the current content).
However you are probably correct about that overall flurry uptime increases with gear upgrades, thus increasing procs, is somewhat irrelevant in the long run due to the low amount of absolute procs generated.
02/01/09, 8:17 AM
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