The blue post was pretty specific, so in all reality, Bloodsurge will probably recieve a modest increase in proc chance. It'd also be nice if the bloodsurge procc'ed slams had something extra like a slight increase percentage to critical something like 10% more. Sometimes, they proc at the worst moment when I'm trying to manage my GCD's, and there should be some incentive to use them instead of letting the proc wear off.
I really hope they don't only increase the chance of bloodsurge proccing. That would only help a tiny bit, as the opportunity to use that increased chance is very restricted, unless new rotation practices were developed where you would weave in bloodsurge in between other instants, which is again another dps loss. If they allowed bloodsurge to stack or have it be an attack not requiring GCD (like lightning overload) then it would be the answer we are looking for.
I really hope they don't only increase the chance of bloodsurge proccing. That would only help a tiny bit, as the opportunity to use that increased chance is very restricted, unless new rotation practices were developed where you would weave in bloodsurge in between other instants, which is again another dps loss. If they allowed bloodsurge to stack or have it be an attack not requiring GCD (like lightning overload) then it would be the answer we are looking for.
If that happened, they would most likely just change bloodsurge to be an automated procced damage. That on one hand would simplify fury even more (1 rotation macro and ONLY watch rage for heroics), on other could have heavy impact on pvp (BT-BS-WW-BS all within 1.5 sec seems like a bit much - its close to double current burst warriors can do. Granted they said they arent afraid to buff fury for pvp but ... , and that burst would be also possible if they forced us to still press BS button).
Yeah the only way increasing Bloodsurge proc % is going to result in any kind of tangible DPS increase is if they make further modifications to the talent or slam itself. As 'boring' as people sometimes portray Fury to be, there isn't a whole lot of room left for Bloodsurge procs at the moment. Mostly because they proc off of attacks that all happen on the GCD (with exception to HS) and the cooldown on our abilities is relatively 'short'. Stacking or Bloodsurge procs off the GCD would really be the only way to milk more DPS out of the talent.
What about simply rearranging talents. By moving 2H Weapon Specialization up to tier 2, and incite swapping with Imp TC, we could free up 3 points in the arms tree, and pick up 15% crit for HS.
Of course, I'm unsure what Blizz has in mind as far as the intended DPS inrease they would like to see, but I think that this would make Fury a little less stuck to the 18 points in Arms. I always hate putting that many points in arms, with so much junk in those first two tiers.
What is people views on Enrage and 2pc T8 uptime?
I placed 1 point in Enrage, that floating point that I normally ended putting in Imp.Execute. And the results are not that extremelly awful but still I wouldnt swap points from Dual Wield Specialization. It procced exactly as follows:
10 times on trash, 1:31, 1% uptime
1 time at Razorscale, 0:12, 3% uptime. Dark Rune Watcher's Chain Lightning
3 times at Ignis, 0:34, 13% uptime. Flame Jets
0 times at XT-002 Light Sparks on Hard mode proc Enrage
1 time at Iron Assembly Uninterrupted Chain Lightning
0 times at Kologarn Rubble Rumble can proc it
3 times at Auriaya, 0:36, 12% uptime. Sonic Screech
1 time at Hodir, 0:12, 3% uptime. Freeze (Frost nova thingie)
1 time at Thorim, 0:12, 3% uptime. An add hitting me.
10 times at Freya, 1:20, 19% uptime. Any adds hit, Sunbeam, Detonating Lasher, Ground Tremor
4 times at Mimiron, 0:17, 3% uptime. Junk Bot, Hand Pulse. Moving to be shot with Hand Pulse can guarantee quite a decent uptime but is dangerous obviously, aside of possible dps loss from moving
0 times at Vezax No surprise. Searing Flame does proc it though
I can't count it on Yogg-Saron because WWS doesnt split tries but it procs in P1 from Dark Volleys and Shadow Novas when guardians die. Also if you're MCed and someone hit you. Sara's psychosis and Crusher tentacle if you survive it.
That's all I've got for now. Results on Ignis, Auriaya and Freya are not too bad. I would like to see other people trying since a 30% chance still holds much randomness and maybe we can develop some tactic like mouseover mocking blow or taunt macro on not dangerous adds.
Heightened Reflexes the 2pc T8 set bonus uptime relies a lot on random things too. Is a 40% proc chance on a critical strike which is random by around 40-50% on usual crit rate numbers from HS and Slam crits, and Slam is random from bloodsurge procs too.
it's only 150 haste rating so it's uptime is not that important for our dps but I'm still curious to what numbers I should expect on static fights with high HS usage.
For me it went like this:
14 times at Razorscale, 1:07, 17% uptime
18 times at Ignis, 1:16, 28% uptime
12 times at XT-002, 0:53, 22% uptime
19 times at Kologarn, 1:14, 33% uptime
10 times at Auriaya, 0:44, 15% uptime
15 times at Hodir, 0:58, 16% uptime
12 times at Thorim, 0:49, 14% uptime
16 times at Freya, 1:08, 17% uptime
11 times on Mimiron, 0:59, 9% uptime. P3 and P4 I use more Cleave than HS
16 times at General Vezax, 1:40, 22% uptime.
13 times at Emalon, 0:46, 24% uptime
8 times at Archavon, 0:37, 24% uptime
On best case scenarios is going between 24 and 33% uptime. Averaged out is worth 38-50 haste rating for me.
It also has to be noted that below 20% health I replace HS for Execute and chances of proccing it are only from Slam which I dont always use.
Heightened Reflexes the 2pc T8 set bonus uptime relies a lot on random things too. Is a 40% proc chance on a critical strike which is random by around 40-50% on usual crit rate numbers from HS and Slam crits, and Slam is random from bloodsurge procs too.
it's only 150 haste rating so it's uptime is not that important for our dps but I'm still curious to what numbers I should expect on static fights with high HS usage.
.
Pretty sure the proc is not 150 haste rating. I could be wrong, as I don't own 2pc yet to verify, but I'm almost certain the tooltip states 150% haste rating, which means the proc gives you 1.5x whatever your haste rating is. Since we don't stack haste, it's really not much of a set bonus. (ex. 200 haste rating...proc would increase your haste to 300) I am curious to know if the proc also applies to windfury and flurry, as that would make it a much more attractive bonus.
Pretty sure the proc is not 150 haste rating. I could be wrong, as I don't own 2pc yet to verify, but I'm almost certain the tooltip states 150% haste rating, which means the proc gives you 1.5x whatever your haste rating is. Since we don't stack haste, it's really not much of a set bonus. (ex. 200 haste rating...proc would increase your haste to 300) I am curious to know if the proc also applies to windfury and flurry, as that would make it a much more attractive bonus.
You might very well be right. I've been reading all over the place for the last half hour, looking for an answer. The wowhead info does certainly look like the buff itself is simply 150 rating.
What about simply rearranging talents. By moving 2H Weapon Specialization up to tier 2, and incite swapping with Imp TC, we could free up 3 points in the arms tree, and pick up 15% crit for HS.
Of course, I'm unsure what Blizz has in mind as far as the intended DPS inrease they would like to see, but I think that this would make Fury a little less stuck to the 18 points in Arms. I always hate putting that many points in arms, with so much junk in those first two tiers.
I really doubt the buff to Fury will have anything to do with HS since it's one of the reasons our dps scales better than other classes.
The easy way would be to reduce TG penalty but according blue words they're trying to do something with other talents.
There are many options, increasing/changing Unending Fury, adding a passive self benefit on Rampage, Bloodsurge adding increased Slam damage/crit, some change on Execute so our sub 20% damage feels like it was before wotlk, merging Booming Voice & Commanding presence and making room for a new talent that increases dps slightly. Or maybe they come up with something different. But for the hints they have given it points towards a change in some talent of the fury tree except Titan's Grip.
On another matter. You only have to mouse over Heightened Reflexes to see the spell link from WoWHead. And I can confirm from in-game experience that is 150 haste rating.
It is most certainly 150 haste rating. There is no % that's just a typical tooltip error. As for the up time I see similar numbers. On my most recent Kologarn kill I hit 40% up time on the 2pc bonus. Its not stellar but its not completely worthless either.
I like the idea of an increased Bloodsurge proc rate, however, I'd like to see them go one step further and make Bloodsurge more rewarding to the Fury Warrior when it procs instead of just giving us something to hit if we have a free gcd. Right now, procing Bloodsurge isn't viewed as a big deal, it's just something that happens once in awhile that lets you fill in an empty gcd when you have one to spare.
I'm thinking change Bloodsurge to increase BT and WW damage while it's up along with making the next slam instant. So whether you miss a slam on a Bloodsurge proc you're still rewarded should you hit BT and/or WW during that time. If you can get all three in (which happens quite often) that would be sweet boost in damage. The kicker is it further promotes a tighter rotation for better dps.
Here has been my best Titan Grip spec, with Betrayers. Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft Solid PVE Fury spec. maxed out with Jewelcrafting and Blacksmithing.
If they allowed bloodsurge to stack or have it be an attack not requiring GCD (like lightning overload) then it would be the answer we are looking for.
At first having it be an instant proc like LO seemed like it would be a bit much for pvp. Then I remembered
Originally Posted by Ghostcrawler
Fury PvP -- not concerned about it being too good
But if they do decide to go with charges, not only would that make the rotation less annoying, but opens up a lot of options for later talents that could affect your damage by how many charges you have. 'Increases damage of (HS and/or other specials) by 10% for every charge you have.' Brings back the ramping up of power that the old, if ineffective, rampage had that gave fury a different feel than arms. Makes you think less about how much rage you have, and more on how to spend it. But I doubt they are thinking that far ahead anyway.
Originally Posted by Dominico
Here has been my best Titan Grip spec, with Betrayers. Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft Solid PVE Fury spec. maxed out with Jewelcrafting and Blacksmithing.
So guys, I recently finally got my Val. helm, replacing my Spiked Titansteel. This threw me DIRECTLY onto the hitcap with 3/3 Precision. (armory: Armory Lite - The WoW Armory Alternative: Torrn of Boulderfist). So with this new piece I just hit up some Vault 25 and noticed a bit of rage starvation, and only did about 3400DPS. I'm guessing this is normal and I realize Archy/Emalon aren't the best DPS tests, but does anyone have any insight into why this might be?
This would be the alternative with 5/5 Commanding Presence.
There are 3 spare points which I put in Enrage, though, I'm not really sure, if it is worth it, or if I should go with 2/2 Execute, 1/1 Heroic Fury or 2/2 Execute, 5/5 UW. What is more efficient in the long run?
@Origence: I made almost the same notice with 2PC T8 bonus-uptime. This lowers the value of the T8 set - in landsouls spreadsheet it's ~100 DPS worth, with a uptime of about 50%. Therefore it's only about 50 DPS worth with a uptime of 25%, which brings me to the question again: is 4PC T8 really BiS for Fury?
This lowers the value of the T8 set - in landsouls spreadsheet it's ~100 DPS worth, with a uptime of about 50%. Therefore it's only about 50 DPS worth with a uptime of 25%, which brings me to the question again: is 4PC T8 really BiS for Fury?
As with almost all questions about BiS, the answer is 'it depends.' A spreadsheet provides guidelines for gear, and if you don't think the sheet accurately reflects your play then you are the only person that can answer the question. :P
i have stormedge berserking enchant but im not using it as my expertese drop to a minimum if i do, and ive tried resocketing swapping gear to meet exp cap, but dps sucks biggy.
so my 1st question is. would it be better to enchant berserking on jawbone as im sticking with it OR stay with 110ap as i realy feel i can relie on more consistend dps flow with that enchant.
second, im a jc. should i spend those 27gemslots on arp or stick with strenght?
those were my starters:p
learning a lot in here! keep up the good work!
PS! also would not mind a tip on what addons are imba for dps flow. im using NUI atm, and i wonder if there is a post i can find somwere that i can read more about it?
This would be the alternative with 5/5 Commanding Presence.
There are 3 spare points which I put in Enrage, though, I'm not really sure, if it is worth it, or if I should go with 2/2 Execute, 1/1 Heroic Fury or 2/2 Execute, 5/5 UW. What is more efficient in the long run?
@Origence: I made almost the same notice with 2PC T8 bonus-uptime. This lowers the value of the T8 set - in landsouls spreadsheet it's ~100 DPS worth, with a uptime of about 50%. Therefore it's only about 50 DPS worth with a uptime of 25%, which brings me to the question again: is 4PC T8 really BiS for Fury?
Enrage is not worth it go for the imp zerker rage.
Even on the few fights where using Berserker Rage is timing dependent, it's still a better bang for your buck than Enrage. The only fight where I know I'm monitoring my Berserker Rage usage is Auriya. Other than that, I pop it regularly for extra rage when taking AoE dmg and the extra 20 rage on demand has helped a ton with my dps throughout Ulduar.
I am new to these forums and have been looking for some info on DPS comparison's.
Well I have been playing around with AoE spec as in using cleave to dump rage or nuke mobs with WW. The reason therefore is that most pulls are AoE based so if you wanna reach top of DPS in a raid u need to produce something more than just WW. I have been playing in my current spec for a while now and so far I have been impressed.
Now we have 1 other Fury DPS in our guild and I beat him on DPS Single and AoE Targetting.
I have spent points in improved cleave as well as the glyph of cleave for the extra 3rd target hit. I have also been stacking up on Armor Penetration and have a mere 29% buffed. I reckon this is where I really started threatening our other DPS. Since buffing myself with Armor Pen I have been in top 5 DPS always. Where previously I was closer to 10 with 8 at best.
Now I am using the standard Rotation BT, WW, and Cleave to dump and Slam when BS procs. (AoE)
On single targetting I use heroic strike instead.
Now I was wondering how I can improve my DPS and want to know how far off I am of the Best. What should a DPS like myself aspire too or should I say what is the best I can do?
I haven't seen alot of Fury DPS on my server but the ones I have seen I have beaten. Not saying I am good but want to know is it Armor Pen stacking that is beating them or do they just not know how to DPS... Could be any of the 2.
As all other people I want to aspire to be the best in my guild or at least try and improve as much as I can so please have a look at my spec and gear. Feel free to comment even if it is negative.
05/20/09, 5:15 PM
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