At the Landsouls Excel sheet I found Intercept at the rotation flowchart (f.e. in section (h) at 6.5 sec). Do I understand something wrong, or should I use Intercept in my rotation (I tried it, but I need ~ 2-3 sec to get far enough from the boss, so it seems to be a big dps-lost to me).
Could / should Slam used to fill free GDCs, even, if it not procc?
At the Landsouls Excel sheet I found Intercept at the rotation flowchart (f.e. in section (h) at 6.5 sec). Do I understand something wrong, or should I use Intercept in my rotation (I tried it, but I need ~ 2-3 sec to get far enough from the boss, so it seems to be a big dps-lost to me).
Could / should Slam used to fill free GDCs, even, if it not procc?
They answer for everything is no. Intercept is in every box of the flowchart where the period ends (i.e. there's no arrow leading to another box). That means that you can change target or stay on the same, with this not influencing in any way your rotation.
I have been doing a considerable amount of searching and have been unable to come up with a clear answer or solution to my apparent inability to live up to my warrior's gear level (not BiS but definately not shabby). After plugging my numbers into Landsoul's spreadsheet I am seeing that my warrior falls about 1-1.5k dps (depending on fight) behind what my gear level should pull. I have done significant work on refining my rotation, and still cannot find where I am losing out.
Some fights I do fantastic on, but most fights I am middle of the pack to sub-par at best. I want to be a good fury warrior again, after having done as well as I did pre-wrath, I just cannot seem to catch a break.
Does anyone have any ideas on what I can do differently?
Here is a recent World of Logs parse for my guild. (Before I hear it, yes we are not particularly good. We only mainly do 10 man raids and are pretty limited in our gear level.)
I have good moments, for example when we zerg Ignis and I outstrip the rest of the dps in the raid by a good 5-10% and pull ~5300 dps, but mainly, I dont do well at all.
I actually switched out for my shaman on the last couple bosses because I am trying to gear him up to be ele/resto as a backup.
From what I can see you have 2 options, either change the raid group or setup the spreadsheet to match your raidgroup. If I am not mistaken the spreadsheet is setup with full compliment of raid buffs. Your raidgroup aint giving you all the melee buffs. You get 10%ap from the blood DK, 5% critt and battle shout from yourself and kings from the paladin. You dont have 30% more bleed dmg, 4% more physical dmg, 20% haste, no ret pala for some extra critt and haste? (dont rember atm what the ret gives), no improved strength of earth totem.
All those buffs you aint getting realy affects the way your fury warrior works.
I figured there was more to it than just me. I am still slightly concerned that I am messing something up in my rotation, but Ill look into things. Some of what you mentioned makes sense since when we do the ignis zerg for example, our resto shaman switches to enhance and I get her improved totems, the same goes for hodir hard mode where we switch our shaman to dps again (and until recently our prot pally would go ret.)
I currrently have 25/25 expertise, gemming for that 1 extra point would put me slightly over. Worth it?
From what I have seen with myself in the past, once you hit roughly 24-25 expertise, it's a dps loss to use up a socket slot with a expertise gem, especially if you end up going over 26 expertise which is a complete waste at that point.
You'd get more of a benefit from using a +20 str or +20 ArP gem in place of it.
I just got told that I may have posted this in a wrong thread earlier, so trying it here.
---
I've been using Landsoul's spreadsheet for awhile to make gear decisions - and so many thanks to Landsoul for this awesome contribution.
I've been wondering about something but dont know if I can put it down clearly or even if this is the correct thread, but here it goes.
According to the spreadsheet, with absolutely NO 3rd party buffs, as a fury warrior with 2pc 8.5, 2pc T9 - I should be doing 3652 dps. When put together with a full complement of raid buffs (the default settings on the sheet), it says I should be able to put out 7008 dps.
To test the theory, I use the dummy in org - and I can easily get 3600 (4200 when I put up sunders) during about 3 mins of constant dps.
However, when I'm in my raid, I cant seem to get above 4500-4600. Granted, I know that during a boss fight, one is usually moving and so I will lose some. But does a drop from 7k to 4500 seem reasonable? If this is everyone's experience, thats cool - I just wanted to make sure I wasnt screwing up somewhere. My current rotation is BT/WW - Slam when its up - otherwise, spamming HS (3-4 times during a fight, i'll run out of rage). I'm also responsible for keeping up sunders as I'm the only warrior in our raid.
There's another fury warrior on our server who has similar gear (Landsoul's sheet says he's capable of about 7300ish dps). However in the WoWlogs of his raids, on the same identical ToC25 bosses, he's able to do 5300-5500.
Is this likely just my playstyle/rotation? If so, why am I able to get the right dps numbers based on the dummy, according to the spreadsheet's prediction of my unbuffed DPS? The only other thing I can imagine is that his raid buffs are totally optimized and ours are not, thus the DPS increase.
simplest thing to remember is that you don't spam HS, you dump rage with HS...
i usually use it only when around 50 rage+
if you are unable to use bt/ww/slam due to using your rage on a damage increase on an already existing swing, then you have gimped your dps considerably. in essence, you have just wasted a GCD or two, in order to increase your melee damage by 495 on one swing.
simplest thing to remember is that you don't spam HS, you dump rage with HS...
i usually use it only when around 50 rage+
if you are unable to use bt/ww/slam due to using your rage on a damage increase on an already existing swing, then you have gimped your dps considerably. in essence, you have just wasted a GCD or two, in order to increase your melee damage by 495 on one swing.
I think this must be the key.. I had always thought I had to spam HS until the next BT/WW/Slam was up.. and you're right, quite a few times they would be up and I would simply be out of rage.
So to be sure I understand, unless you have 50+ rage, you just sit there waiting for the next BT/WW/Slam to be up? So basically just let my white melee damage do the work until I have enough rage to dump into HS.
I think this must be the key.. I had always thought I had to spam HS until the next BT/WW/Slam was up.. and you're right, quite a few times they would be up and I would simply be out of rage.
So to be sure I understand, unless you have 50+ rage, you just sit there waiting for the next BT/WW/Slam to be up? So basically just let my white melee damage do the work until I have enough rage to dump into HS.
yeah basically. now...if i have say...20 rage, and all other attacks are on CD, ie WW has several seconds left, and I just used BT, then I know that I will have at LEAST one more set of melee swings before my next ability, which will give me more rage, then i will use HS, or sometimes even pop berserker rage(2/2) talented, assuming i have no risk of getting feared. This gives me a bit more rage, and i don't mind using the GCD, since I have nothing else to use it on. I use both zerker rage and bloodrage LOTS throughout the fight. Just some more food for thought/experimentation. Its better learned by just practice, rather than typing :P
So to be sure I understand, unless you have 50+ rage, you just sit there waiting for the next BT/WW/Slam to be up? So basically just let my white melee damage do the work until I have enough rage to dump into HS.
Yes, that's it in a nutshell. 50+ is a ballpark, some go with less, but that's close enough.
I use a rage addon (forget the name, sorry) that allows me to have my rage #'s large and moveable, this really helps.
Yes, that's it in a nutshell. 50+ is a ballpark, some go with less, but that's close enough.
I use a rage addon (forget the name, sorry) that allows me to have my rage #'s large and moveable, this really helps.
I think the helmet is the worst part of the five pieces of Tier 9 (item level 245), at least the one that can be replaced with something that is much better - [Helm of Thunderous Rampage].
So if I were you I would choose another piece of Tier 9 and not waste my Emblems of Triumph on the cheap Tier 9 stuff.
If we are discussing ilvl245 and not 258 for a while i really do think that the head is the piece you should go for as offpiece and not the gloves. Why? Because head and glove tier pieces are both itemized the same with hit and crit and their replacements both have crit and apr. Considering all items are at ilvl245 now remember. Thus we want to choose one of the two pieces to go with the better offpiece. My choise is to take the arp/crit head from emblems since the head has more stat points than the glove and thus by taking hit on gloves less of my points are wasted on hit.
I think that the way to go is definitely 4 pieces t9 and one non-set (gloves or helmet).
One question: do you use shattering throw? I know that arms warriros use it as much as they can, but they don't have the stance dance and the subsequent rage loss that we have. I'm a little reluctant to use it, because it means a loss of around 11k personal damage (napkin map: [delay for stance dance + 1.5 sec cast + delay for stance change]*6.5k dps + rage loss). I wonder if the raid dps increase is worth this loss... And if you do, do you also use rend while you are in combat stance?
Yeah, I was leaning towards using gloves as the offpiece, unless for months we dont find any of the Anub'arak 25 ones. The question was more pointed at, if I had to pick one piece of these two (helm/chest) to be ilvl 232 while we work on getting more trophies, in order to get the 4pc, was there any current preference as to which I should go for? Both seem to be a DPS upgrade (when paired with other appropriate ToC gear), and I was just having a hard time min/maxing. I suppose in the end it doesnt matter, since like I said, both provide upgrades.
One question: do you use shattering throw? I know that arms warriros use it as much as they can, but they don't have the stance dance and the subsequent rage loss that we have. I'm a little reluctant to use it, because it means a loss of around 11k personal damage (napkin map: [delay for stance dance + 1.5 sec cast + delay for stance change]*6.5k dps + rage loss). I wonder if the raid dps increase is worth this loss... And if you do, do you also use rend while you are in combat stance?
I use Shattering Throw at the start of a fight while waiting a few seconds for the tank to get good initial agro so the stance dance doesn't really eat into my rotation. After the Shattering Throw I switch back to berserker stance and begin to chase the tanks agro to make him work a little.
I don't use Shattering Throw mid fight unless there is a break in the fight were I need to run out for a second, for example some kind of Nova ability, then Intercept back in once it's cast. It really depends on the oportunities that present themselves.
My only exception to this is if the raid leader requests it at a giving point in the fight.
On occassion, I'll time using Shattering Throw at the start of a Heroism. If I'm responsible for 5x Sunders, I'll make sure these are already in place prior to it's use.
According to my sheet anyway, I get more more dps from using helm as off set instead of gloves unless you get Heroic versions of either [Gauntlets of Bitter Reprisal] or [Sunreaver Assassin's Gloves]. Mounting anger are not worth it even on heroic.
However it may be worth picking up the gloves/helm anyway with the limited amount of hit in ToC. Trying to hit all 3 caps (hit, exp, arp) is a huge pain. I am wondering if with all the yellow sockets now if gemming for hit is better than picking up items with hit.
I think that the way to go is definitely 4 pieces t9 and one non-set (gloves or helmet).
One question: do you use shattering throw? I know that arms warriros use it as much as they can, but they don't have the stance dance and the subsequent rage loss that we have. I'm a little reluctant to use it, because it means a loss of around 11k personal damage (napkin map: [delay for stance dance + 1.5 sec cast + delay for stance change]*6.5k dps + rage loss). I wonder if the raid dps increase is worth this loss... And if you do, do you also use rend while you are in combat stance?
Depending on the length of the fight, you should probably be using it early (on a 5+ minute fight) so it will be up twice. On a short fight, use it right before Heroism/Bloodlust. It may be a loss to your personal DPS, but rogues (especially HAT), DK's (esp. Blood) and feral druids will all see a significant damage increase.
I put this set together out of 25-Man Normal and 10-Man Heroic ToC gear w/ no tributes only. Horde Version. Interested if anyone has a horde set with no 25M-H or tribute gear w/ more DPS before I blow EP/GP on these items.
I put this set together out of 25-Man Normal and 10-Man Heroic ToC gear w/ no tributes only. Horde Version. Interested if anyone has a horde set with no 25M-H or tribute gear w/ more DPS before I blow EP/GP on these items.
With 3.2.2's ArP nerf I imagine many gem choices will be changed to hit the soft cap.
If you are going to use the t9 helm and gloves I would recommend replacing the chest with [Titanium Razorplate] since it is better than the t9 chest if you are not using it for the 4p bonus.
If you are going to use the t9 helm and gloves I would recommend replacing the chest with [Titanium Razorplate] since it is better than the t9 chest if you are not using it for the 4p bonus.
Good call, I will plug that in and update accordingly. 8 orbs, ftl. 3.2.2. needs to hurry its sweet ass up.
I wanted to include gloves in the set since I won them in Koralon anyway.
i think its importent to say that even though the crafted chest piece have 4 higher stat points, it won't be better in evry gear set you make. to get those extra points you will have to use yellow gem, and from my own gear (no ArP-proc trinket) i can see its better for me to get 20 ArP insted of getting yellow gem and getting 4 str bonus. on top of that, having the 5 pieces of T9 also gives you more freedom when you are having the options of choosing more clear upgrades.
09/07/09, 10:09 AM
Similar Threads
