Halftrack

What 3 major glyphs are you useing in a incite build?

 

Killenation

I'm using the rend glyph, the mortal strike glyph and Execute as my major glyphs, i'll link my Wowhead page.

The World of Warcraft Armory

 

Xarrot

He was asking for an incite build, you don't have one :>

EDIT: Ah guess it's the same anyways ^^

 

Jakoemanou

I notice in the new spreadsheet Imp execute aint talented anymore and Bladestorm glyph gives better dps then Execute glyph.

Did they change anything i missed?

 

zenwolf

I can verify that Sword Spec procs happen on many physical damage attacks, including: Bleed ticks (Rend and Deep Wounds), Overpower, Heroic Strike, etc. I accidentally cleared my Recount before I could total the percent of damage that I received from all combined sword spec procs in ToC-10 and Heroic ToC-10. I cannot remember whether or not Thunderclap also procced it. I suspect that it does, but I will verify it the next time I raid.

 

Krumsha

Hi,

I'm writing for a problem that i'm trying to figure out: I'm around 4k DPS in Arms specc. Rawr says me to gem Str but I've reached the 30% ArP passive soft cap,but I'm around 1340 Str. What should I do? Stay on the ArP Gemming or Switch on Str?

And by the way,I've tried the Incite Build but with a loss around 400/500 DPS

Thanks for Helping me out ^^

 

Brunk

I'm also an Arms war that sits at around 5k consistent dps in 25 mans. I would suggest replacing that gem in your belt for ARP. You're way way over the %8 hit cap needed for arms. If you have gear that has ArP, even if its a bit lower iLVL, swap it for something you have that doesn't. I've found out by switching some 'better' iLVL items with no ArP, to ones with slightly lower iLVL with ArP, I gained a bit of DPS. Only other things I can see is your +8 ArP gems etc etc

Edit: Also, get a polearm/axe. Sword spec is still not as good as Poleaxe/Axe spec. You WILL do better DPS.

 

Alexxcri

I know how the proc looks like, and even to verify I put berserking on Edge of Ruin and it procced within the first minute I started hitting the dummy. When I put the polearm however, 5 minutes on the dummy and no proc, nothing. I think it's bugged, so if you have the Reclaimed Shadowstrike don't put Berserking on it. It isn't a very good weapon anyways.

 

Bokeh

I've tried out a 55/8/8 spec, and - so far - i'm pretty impressed. We usually run with a fury warrior, a warlock and multiple paladins in 25's, so the points spent in fury were generally wasted. Especially on fights like twin valkyrs on 10 hard my heroic strike came out on top of damage done by far, but on a lot of other fights i noticed heroic strike being significantly higher.

Now, i was running with glyph of HS over glyph of execution, and i was seriously wondering if it is actually worth it.

It did seem to smooth out my heroic strike rage consumption a lot, however over a whole run the total amount of rage gained from the glyph is not that much compared to the total rage gained. My guess is that while it makes spamming heroic strike a lot easier, it's still relatively random and the rage gained from the glyph is not that much compared to the amount of rage a lost white swing costs. Ofcourse, in a full 25 man group you'll have significantly more buffs than the mainly caster stacked group we had yesterday, and as such you'll have more rage generation and more crits.

The execute glyph on the other hand also seems to feel pretty lackluster these days, on average i think the glyph works out to somewhere in the regions of a 1% dps gain since i hardly execute below 20% (basically as a filler instead of slam).

So i was wondering, does anyone have any ideas regarding glyph of execute vs glyph of heroic strike, because i am really in dubio what works out to be better. Execute gives you extra flat damage, ofcourse, but glyph of heroic strike effectively allows you to get even more heroic strikes in.

 

• landsoul

If you are dropping the Execute glyphs, wouldn't the argument then go to heroic strike glyph versus bladestorm glyph?

 

Bokeh

I find the bladestorm glyph useful on certain fights which demand high burst multitarget damage (freya 3 keepers, anub) or fights where being able to remove roots/and or being able to become immune to cc is handy. (thorim hard, faction champions hard, hodir hard, etc.) Overall though, i will generally replace a glyph specifically for such fights because i don't really believe that the lowered cooldown gained from the bladestorm glyph will increase your average dps by that much, especially if you do not use bladestorm on the cooldown. I am sure we will see fights that necessitate it in ICC again, but for now i think it's too situational to glyph into it regardless.

For now it seems that while the heroic strike glyph grants a decent amount of rage, i don't know if the damage gain from being able to HS a few times more outweighs the extra damage gained from doing a bit less HS and getting the glyph of execution.

 

rainerx

I am not terribly sold on the Bladestorm glyph and from the spreadsheet it does calculate a slightly higher dps than execute glyph. I still use the execute glyph though.

Now I am currently running about 41.90% crit in battle stance. With 3/3 incite and tier 9 4pc bonus if it is straight additive that's 61.90% crit from Heroic Strike. If that is correct would going with HS glyph instead of execute glyph be worthwhile?

I don't generally get raged starved with this build and this is with dumping liberally with HS but possibly the extra rage from HS might help. Anyone document the results of the 3 glyphs?

 

Essequibo

I think the spreadsheet assumes by default that the fight lasts 360 seconds, hence the Glyph of Bladestorm allows to fit 1 more Bladestorm. If you play a bit with the fight duration, Glyph of Execution seems to be at least just as useful.

On the other hand, when increasing the incoming damage, Glyph of Heroic Strike seem to get better. I'm just wondering, by default the spreadsheet assumes there is 0 incoming damage?

 

Anduryondon

You can set the incoming damage in an extra cell in the spreadsheet (although it seems a little bugged with >2000 incoming DPS). This is very useful in fights like Twins, where you have a steady incoming dps, giving you enough rage for unlimited heroics.

 

Phoenix

As an aside - for Anub i'd use Cleave Glyph over Execute, Bladestorm or HS.

 

Baycon

I feel like people aren't really sold on the idea of an Incite build, especially using Heroic strike glyph.

I've been using it for the last few weeks (Wasn't able to before, since I was playing the utility card, with imp. demo shout and such). Here are a few numbers taken from Tuesday's raid. Also, it must be noted that I keep a healthy stash of Heroic strike / Cleave glyphs, and alternate for fights (In TOC, it seems you only really need the cleave glyph for Anub).

Beast Heroic 25 (DPS ~ 6 000 to 6 500)

High mobility fight here, and we're melee heavy....so we may sometimes get some terrible fire/poison chains. Regardless, heroic strike shines. I'm getting it at 11.9% on this fight. 48 hits, 26 crits. 260 rage generated.

Lord Jaraxxus Heroic 25 (DPS ~7 000 to ~7 500) :

We're looking at Heroic Strike being 10.6% of my damage with 37 hits. 25 out of those were crits...250 rage generated through that. It helps a ton of Portals/Eruptions, since you pretty much seem to have infinite rage and the theorical rage lost isn't as apparent. Also, the high % of crit coming from Heroic Strike often result in awesome burst sequence of crits, making my deep wounds top my own meters.

Twins Heroic 25 (DPS : ~10 000 to ~12 000...no empowered buff):

High RNG here it seems. I probably should switch to Execute glyph for this fight, however I had none on me. I keep cleave to a priority for this one, so the cleave glyph is useless, and so is the heroic strike glyph. (However : heroic strike on single target bursts like bubbles). Again, high % crit on cleave is amazing, and makes my deep wound once more tick for amazing amounts....fighting to top my meters with cleave.


I don't have a parse from heroic Anub, unfortunately (we raid on a casual schedule, so we're getting there this week). I can say however that by using the glyph on normal, and using a similar-ish strat with the adds, I'm getting 12.3% damage from Cleave, and 68.2% crit. Deep wounds end up raping the meters, since it applies to the adds. I can only imagine heroic mode being even higher with the amount of adds / frequency.

I did notice my threat being quite high however, which is I guess a downside of all of this. All the little things add up, even if it's the extra 10 rage you generate on top of higher crit rate for heroic strike (already providing higher threat)...nothing a Salv can't fix I guess. Our tanks are great, but there would be no way to push max DPS if you're in a situation with no constant misdirects/ToTT/ Salv.

TLDR Version : I'm very pleased with the Incite spec, and strongly recommend it to people with "good" gear, or with people free from debuffing. Try it, and feel better about yourself when you start competing again with your fury warriors.

 

Ablimoth

Do you have a log that you can post of both an Incite spec and the "Traditional" spec? I would very much like to examine that and determine where the difference lies (if it is a Cleave/Heroic Strike difference or different buffs/uptimes/targets etc.). If I recall correctly, early in T8 the Incite spec was discussed and discarded as inferior. It should scale better than Improved and Glyphed Execute, but I'd like data.

 

Baycon

You can check on wowmeteronline.com.

US - Eonar - <Ascension> - Baycon
WoW Meter Online - Combatlog Replay


I've only started using the spec recently (for reasons mentionned above) so I can't really show really steady week-after-week numbers. However, you can find me in the 25m tries (up to Twins) and the 10m tribute to insanity run.

Took me a little bit to get used to things like using Heroic Striking more often (nearly every 2nd hit...and sometimes more!) and using cleave (which has a considerable rage cost) without starving myself. I think I'll be able to get a better parse next week, now that I got some practice.

I'm sure you can find better warriors than me out there with better parses though, so you might wanna do that instead =)

 

Oliria

With an incite build do you use slam less often? and more HS?

Or do you simply trade imp shouts for more crit on HS/cleave? and do normal rotation

 

Ran Newman

Yes Oliria, at least for single target. Personly i find the spec useful enough (unless you have someone else to provide the buffs, obviously) only if there is more then one target (twins or anub, also realy shines at mimiron but not sure how relevant this fight is) where cleave is big part of your overall dps - on such cases you normaly get more by having cleave over a slam, but fully raidbuffed you can normaly throw alot of slams into there easly enough.

 

Jordanthug

It's good to use heroic strike/cleave when your next gcd has a low rage cost, like overpower, rend, sunder refreshes, or simply when you have the rage able to spare. Dont que up cleave if you have 30 rage, for example. Slam is still an important ability to fill gcd's and will be used as such.

 

bchorn

Onxyia really highlights the AoE strengths of the Incite build...namely Thunderclap.

With the 4 target restriction lifted from Thunderclap at the start of 3.0, Thunderclap is the only unlimited AoE ability a warrior has in their arsenal. That means the power of Thunderclaps scales infinitely with the number of targets in range. So its in the whelp phase of Ony that the power of Thunderclap really shines.

As you can see here, my thunderclaps hit 286 targets for 390,200 damage. Since I had 112 crits from Thunderclap, Deep Wounds added (250 damage x 6 ticks = 1500 per crit) 168,800 in damage as well.

In total, Thunderclap + Deep Wounds crits from TC accounted for 16% of my overall damage. Also, Deep Wounds ticks causes Blood Frenzy to occur which means raid utility is being added as well.

Granted, there aren't many mega AoE situations in ToC right now that call for thunderclap but it is something to keep in mind whenever Icecrown opens up. In Ulduar, Freya's Detonating Lashers and Thorim's Arena are simliar situations where Thunderclap works well in as well.

BTW...we had only 22 people that night so the fight took longer than usual.

 

rainerx

So what I am gathering from Baycon, best to go HS glyph for Beasts, Jaraxxus, Faction.

Then probably swap to possibly execute or bladestorm glyph for Twins. I myself queue up cleave for this fight all the time being that rage is readily available. I have done roughly 10.5k dps on that fight but I hear warriors getting higher numbers. This was with Execute glyph. Anyone try bladestorm glyph for this fight?

For Anub you would definitely want to swap out glyphs again for Cleave.

 

Baycon

I think the bladestorm glyph could probably help you squeeze in another bladestorm. Our last heroic valk took 4:44, so I think the glyph could fit in an extra one? However, I feel like it's my duty to pump as much DPS during the bubble phase, and due to the RNG nature of things, you might be [slightly] better off with execute glyph.

But that's just IMO, no calculation done.


*Edit* Here's the parse from last night.

WoW Meter Online - Combatlog Replay


Our uploader forgot to clear his combat log, and uploaded fights from his 10m too. So please just look at fights #19 to #29.

Glyphs changed in heroic : Whirlwind for Twins, Heroic Strike for the other.

I wasn't able to fully use the Whirlwind's reduced CD however, just because of our strategy. I try to pop shieldwall when a vortex of the opposite color starts, to 1) make sure I live and 2) give the healer an easier time...and other times we need to do an early switch to focus on one target. I will use Execute glyph next week IMO.

 

Oliria

Yes obviously you don't want to rage starve yourself, was merely asking whether or not to prioritize HS over slam. I've found cleave to be superior in most situations compared to slam (multiple mob situation ofcause).

I thank you all for the clarification.