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Old 11/02/12, 2:31 PM   #331
Neckface
Piston Honda
 
Undead Rogue
 
Bonechewer
Looks like Power Strikes is back to 20 seconds. Looking better and better.

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Old 11/03/12, 3:05 PM   #332
Netukka
Von Kaiser
 
Human Monk
 
Ravencrest (EU)
Thoughts after clearing 25 normal HoF...

Logs for everything: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis Missed Zor'lok but joke boss.

Zor'lok:
-Joke of a boss in normal.
-Take Leg Sweep for MC'd players (after DK grip), RWS/SPC to break without debuffs.

Tornadobro Ta'yak
-Very easy in normal too.
-Dampen harm + Unglyphed guard makes overwhelming assault 2nd hit non issue.
-Rolling OP during 20% phase.

Garalon:
-Glyph guard, make sure you resummon your statue if you go out of range of it.
-Having proper range from the boss takes a few pulls. Too far away and cleave wont hit you. Too close and youll have issues with purple ring of doom and possible pools on ground.
-Extra damage on legs gives a lot of statue procs.

Windlord:
-Holy mother of batman aoe. Perfect fight for brewmasters. Expect to top both damage AND healing meters. Unglyph guard.
-While you do take quite a lot of damage while tanking boss + 5 mobs, the raid damage is almost non existant so healers can spam you. Go for full damage set.
-Once all adds dead, boss doesnt hit exceedingly hard. Just make sure you dodge the whirling blade, hitbox is a bit weird, sometimes hits behind the boss too. Just take an extra step back.

Amber shaper:
-Nothing really out of the ordinary for tanks. The boss hits for very little damage before last phase. Monstrosity damage is higher, but not massive. Just learn how to play as transformed thingie.

Grand empress:
-Boss hits like a truck. Heavy stamina/mastery recommended.
-Dampen harm and unglyphed guard make dissonance fields blowing up burst non issue.
-Stun works on windblade adds, so get Leg Sweep. Can also kite them around a bit if needed. Their aggro is a bit weird, sometimes after fixate they come back to you, sometimes they dont. If you hear dps crying, go taunt them.

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Old 11/06/12, 12:31 PM   #333
Venyasure
Von Kaiser
 
Venyasure's Avatar
 
Orc Death Knight
 
Sinstralis (EU)
Here's a new spreadsheet :

http://www.filedropper.com/brewmasterspreadsheetcopy_6

Bug fixes :

- a couple of minor bugs were fixed, like an adjusted number of Swift Reflexes, and a miscalculation in the Spinning Crane Kick optimal use (which is often 0 or 1 anyway)

- some time ago, wepon DPS scaling changed ; i noticed that last week while i was doing some tests on my Monk. This was in no patch note, and MMOC's datamining doesn't get weapon DPS scaling for Brewmasters since it was modified in the last weeks of the MoP Beta. I don't know when it happened, but it happened, some time between last week and two months ago. The spreadsheet now has the same scaling as in-game Brewmasters.

New features :

New cells have popped on the second sheet :



Special damage taken :

There is now an option for two sets of additional special damage. You can use it to represent effects such as the Stone Guard's bleed damage. You can select which of your damage reduction work on the special damage. Putting 0 means the damage ignores the corresponding damage reduction, and 1 means it doesn't. And say entering 0.7 for amror would mean it ignores 30% of your armor.

For example, if you want to include the Stone Guard's bleed damage, you would enter its unmitigated DPS in the "Damage per sec" cell, 1 in "Stagger" and "Ox Stance" cells, and 0 in the other cells. You'll notice how the stat weight of Mastery increases.

This damage counts towards your Vengeance in the spreadsheet. However, these cells are never considered as magical damage by the spreadsheet, and are therefore not absorbed by a glyphed Guard.

Off Tanking :

Or more generally, the inclusion of periods when you're not being hit by the boss and are therefore attacking it from the back, stacking Shuffle and Elusive Brew.

These cells activate if you put something superior to 0 in the "Off-tank time" cell. This cell, together with its neighbour "Tank time", are used to choose the duration of the tanking and off tanking periods. The poblem of this new feature is that the calculation of your stat weights is much slower, it could take a dozen seconds.

EH/s and GU/s modifiers :

These cells modify the rate at which you use these spells while you're off tanking. For example, if you put 0.6 in the "GU/s modifier" cells while you were normally using Guard at a rate of once every 35 sec (GU/s = 1/35) then you'll be using it once every (1 / (0.6*(1/35))) = 58.3 sec while off-tanking. Of course it makes little sense if your "Off Tank time" is 40 sec, it is then just a way to say that sometimes you use it, sometimes you don't.

T30 talents :

Same thing, for Chi Wave, Chi Burst and Zen Sphere. But you might have put 0 in their "Frequency" cells, so they won't be used while off-tanking anyway.

Vengeance ramp :

Now that we have time values, i can include the ramping effect of Vengeance (by the way, these new cells can be used to take into account this effect for a single tank fight with for example 1 in "Off tank time" and 600 in "Tank time"). The ramping up of Vengeance is calculated like in game, with the boss swing timer you enter on the first sheet. Its decrease when you begin off-tanking is represented in the spreadsheet by the following function :

Tanking_Vengeance * [ (9 / (10+mod*T)) + 1/10 ]

where T is time and mod is the "Vengeance ramp" cell. I suggest you don't modify this cell.

Off-healing and Off-Colossus

They work in the same fashion as other similar cells in the spreadsheet like the Statue cell or the GotOx cell. You can use them to tune down the efficiency of your self healing and Colossus while you're off-tanking if you consider that the damage they heal or absorb would have been healed anyway by your healers' aoe healing.

Include off-tanking damage reduction

This cell determines whether or not you want the calculation of the stat weights to take into account the damage you heal/absorb/avoid while you're not tanking. Putting 0 here is mainly about ignoring the Statue and your off healing/absorbing while you're not tanking, since they are your only sources of damage reduction as the boss doesn't damage you. Like the other similar cells, you can put a number between 0 and 1.

Remarks :

- The spreadsheet has become quite complex and it's difficult to search for bugs in the 2156 lines of code. I don't think there are major bugs, but there might remain details that i will fix in time. The kind of detail i'm thinking about is like the latest i've fixed, which was Colossus proccing from "ghost" Swift Reflexes that shouldn't exist while you're off-tanking. It's no big deal, but there could be some more errors like that.

- You don't take the new special damage while you're not tanking.

- In an off-tanking fight, the spreadsheet shows that Chi generators, namely haste, hit and exp before 7.5% are the real winners, because you can use them to stack Shuffle. I'm actually surprised by how powerful they are.

- Agi loses part of its might, since its dodge part is wasted while you're off-tanking.

- I expected crit to be higher because of EB stacking. But i guess the spreadsheet means it's really better to go for haste/hit and stack Shuffle instead of going for crit and stack EB. Besides, if the "Off-tank time" is long enough, you might hit a breakpoint at which you get your 15 stacks and cannot gain more.

- Expertise beyond 7.5% is quite poor since you're attacking from the back in the off-tank periods.

- The Shuffle uptime displayed is the uptime while you are actually tanking, not the overall uptime. Note that the graph might be irrelevant, since if you stack 15 secs of Shuffle and then take the boss for 30 secs, you will have a minimum of 50% uptime, and the graph before that won't represent anything real.

- It's surprising to see that the stacking of Shuffle results into a great increase in the number of Purifying Brew rather than an attempt to hit the 100% Shuffle uptime. It appears it's better to rely on the stacked Shuffle to use PB more often instead of Shuffling more. It obviously increases the optimal uptime a lot, but not as much as i thought.

- Mastery becomes therefore better since you purify a lot. But it's still way behind hit/haste, and even crit.

- I still need to investigate on how the uptime behaves when you spend Chi on the t30 talents after stacking Shuffle.

Last edited by Venyasure : 11/06/12 at 4:40 PM.

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Old 11/06/12, 8:29 PM   #334
Iroared
Piston Honda
 
Draenei Monk
 
Черный Шрам (EU)
Did they hotfix nerf elusive brew or the amount of stacks per swing depends on something other than weapon speed?
I've been always getting 3 stacks per crit with a 2h, including todays raid. But now I'm running 5mans and keep getting only two, even though I'm using the exact same gear as I did before. What could cause that?
E: back to 3. Is there some haste breakpoint when it goes down to 2?

Also, apparently they changed it at some point so switching stances now drops Shuffle, so off-tanking in tiger stance is no longer viable (unless you need to keep aggro down)?

Last edited by Iroared : 11/06/12 at 11:21 PM.


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Old 11/07/12, 4:56 AM   #335
Taser
Von Kaiser
 
Pandaren Monk
 
Lordaeron (EU)
Haste has no effect on EB. The stacks are being calculated

3 / 3.6 * weaponspeed for 2h
1.5 / 2.6 * weaponspeed for 1h

You have to take the speed that is shown in the tooltip of your weapon.

Enchant changes coming with 5.1:

Dancing Steel - 2 RPPM
Jade Spirit - 2 RPPM
River's Song - 4 RPPM
Colossus - 6 RPPM

Did anybody find out the proper calcs for the RPPM mechanic?

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Old 11/07/12, 7:43 AM   #336
Crevan
Don Flamenco
 
Gnome Rogue
 
Darksorrow (EU)
There's nothing to find out, since the new formula is posted right in the blue post:

(ppm) * (haste) * (time since last chance to proc) / 60 (sec per min),

where haste means the total char sheet haste you see (that is, including the attack speed buffs, 2H bonus and so on), and (time since last chance to proc) is capped at 10 seconds. The only thing we have to figure out now is by how much, if at all, our uptime on the enchant will go down from current levels (which are quite ridiculous, I might say).

Last edited by Crevan : 11/07/12 at 7:50 AM.

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Old 11/08/12, 4:20 AM   #337
MomysLidlMonsta
Glass Joe
 
Troll Monk
 
Eredar (EU)
Originally Posted by Taser View Post
Haste has no effect on EB. The stacks are being calculated

3 / 3.6 * weaponspeed for 2h
1.5 / 2.6 * weaponspeed for 1h

You have to take the speed that is shown in the tooltip of your weapon.
I get 2 stacks about 6 out of 7 times with a 3.6 weapon and 12.26% haste.

After that I kept pounding the training dummy for a while with different gear setups (about 100 crits per setup, so the numbers might be off a bit):
3.6 2H 12.26% haste: 2.2 stacks/crit
3.6 2H 5.37% haste: 2.2 stacks/crit
3.3 2H 12.26% haste: 1.9 stacks/crit
2.6 1H 12.26% haste 1.5 stacks/crit

Those numbers seem to suggest that the 40% haste for two-handers gets factored in before the elusive brew calculation (that results in 2.14 for the 3.6 and 1.96 for the 3.3 2H). In that case, DW would provide a significant boost in EB uptime that would easily tip that scales in its favor. If no one else has data on the subject I'll do some more thorough testing this weekend.

P.S.: Comparing our logs from our WotE to the top-ranked Brewmaster seems to support that DW gegenrates more EB stacks:

Me: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis
2H, 30% crit with white hits, 720s: 161 EB stacks

Madihaz: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis
DW, 33% crit with white hits, 735s: 283 EB stacks

I know there are many other factors at play there, but none that should impact the result so dramatically.

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Old 11/08/12, 7:33 AM   #338
Venyasure
Von Kaiser
 
Venyasure's Avatar
 
Orc Death Knight
 
Sinstralis (EU)
Originally Posted by MomysLidlMonsta View Post
I get 2 stacks about 6 out of 7 times with a 3.6 weapon and 12.26% haste.
You are using the minor Glyph of Jab in your Brewmaster spec. This glyph is bugged, and makes your 2H weapon count as a 1H weapon as far as Elusive Brew is concerned, thus reducing the number of stacks you get.
Originally Posted by Iroared View Post
But now I'm running 5mans and keep getting only two, even though I'm using the exact same gear as I did before. What could cause that?
E: back to 3. Is there some haste breakpoint when it goes down to 2?
Same answer : you had the Glyph of Jab, and then you removed it.

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Old 11/08/12, 7:36 AM   #339
Tsuki Ko
Glass Joe
 
Human Monk
 
Alleria
Unglyph Jab, it's still bugging EB generation for 2Hs.

Edit: 3min too late, please delete.

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Old 11/08/12, 8:51 AM   #340
Taser
Von Kaiser
 
Pandaren Monk
 
Lordaeron (EU)
Originally Posted by Crevan View Post
There's nothing to find out, since the new formula is posted right in the blue post:

(ppm) * (haste) * (time since last chance to proc) / 60 (sec per min),

where haste means the total char sheet haste you see (that is, including the attack speed buffs, 2H bonus and so on), and (time since last chance to proc) is capped at 10 seconds. The only thing we have to figure out now is by how much, if at all, our uptime on the enchant will go down from current levels (which are quite ridiculous, I might say).
Maybe my wording if the question was bad. I know the formula. A few pages back I posten some calcs to show the difference between the old PPM and the new RPPM. But I am not 100% sure if my understanding of the last chance to proc is correct.

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Old 11/08/12, 3:14 PM   #341
Netukka
Von Kaiser
 
Human Monk
 
Ravencrest (EU)
Latest hotfix brought along this nerf...

Patch 5.0.5 Hotfixes - Nov 6

* Keg Smash now deals progressively less damage when it strikes more than 5 targets.

After some very quick stockades testing, what this in practice means that no matter how many targets Keg Smash hits, it will deal damage in total as if it hit 5 targets. 50k dmg on single target is 50k dmg on 5 targets or 10k dmg on 25 targets.

Its not a huge raid nerf since there are rarely more than 5 mobs at a time, namely for Windlord which monks were absolutely crazy on.

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Old 11/10/12, 1:11 AM   #342
Iroared
Piston Honda
 
Draenei Monk
 
Черный Шрам (EU)
Same answer : you had the Glyph of Jab, and then you removed it.
I haven't even learned that glyph...

After that I kept pounding the training dummy for a while with different gear setups (about 100 crits per setup, so the numbers might be off a bit):
3.6 2H 12.26% haste: 2.2 stacks/crit
3.6 2H 5.37% haste: 2.2 stacks/crit
3.3 2H 12.26% haste: 1.9 stacks/crit
2.6 1H 12.26% haste 1.5 stacks/crit
Idk about the calculations, I'm ALWAYS getting 3 stacks per crit in raids (I watch them all the time), except for that one time when it started giving 2, and at that time I had some of my items reforged for pvp (that's the only reason I can come up with.. other than pvp power gems).
Interesting info on DW, I'll try to find a couple to see if I get any noticeable increase in stack generation.

Okay got couple more questions:

1. On garajal, does stagger damage the dolls?
Btw does mastery reforging actually help that much here? I'm running hit/exp/crit, and enchanting agility for more dps since that is currently our main concern (and being able to kill all 3 severers by yourself is helpful).

2. Do raidbosses ignore 4.5% of dodge/parry/miss now? This would be kind of relevant since monks can reach 90%ish avoidance already, 13.5% avoidance reduction seems huge compared to what it was in cata.

Last edited by Iroared : 11/10/12 at 1:23 AM.


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Old 11/10/12, 4:40 PM   #343
Fauh
Von Kaiser
 
Pandaren Monk
 
Tarren Mill (EU)
I don't know if it's my computer acting up or if it has to do with Open Office. But the latest edition of the spreadsheet is to me just a blank file.

Also, I haven't seen it being discussed previously here but have anyone else encountered problems with Feng HC and aggro. I do my best to keep up with the other tank but I feel that with his irregularities concerning taunts coupled with vengeance the boss has a tendency to stick to whoever gets the initial threat.

The best thing I've come up with is to go all out on dps and try to stick as many BK and a BoF before I have to channel the spellreflect on the other tank.

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Old 11/10/12, 5:10 PM   #344
• Neux
GTGTPWTW
 
Pandaren Monk
 
Mal'Ganis
Why would you channel the spell reflect while tanking?

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Old 11/10/12, 6:59 PM   #345
Fauh
Von Kaiser
 
Pandaren Monk
 
Tarren Mill (EU)
Originally Posted by Neux View Post
Why would you channel the spell reflect while tanking?
Ah, you must have misunderstood. The "shield"-tank picks up the boss while I nuke the living crap out of the boss. He starts so I can spellreflect off right away to maximize damage and threat. Despite me having the extra damage from Arcane Shock the other tank just soars above me in threat on a lot of the tries and I had a hard time taking the boss of him. When we reversed it (with me starting to tank) he had the same problem, but even worse.

I was just wondering if any other monks had noticed similar problems on Feng HC or any other boss for that matter. We noticed a similar tendency on Bladelord this week as well but not at all as pronounced as on Feng HC.

It's quite a shame because during his Arcane Velocity I have to really maximize the damage I do to not lose too much threat which in turn leads to me not being as helpful on mitigating the damage for the raid via Avert Harm and off-healing.

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