Mistweaver Healing Compendium - Page 11

Szeretlek · 11/03/12, 7:02 PM

It's also that this is going to be a lot worse on 10 man MW which weren't nearly so far ahead of the curve to begin with.

In 10 man MW are doing similar OP stuff, believe me. 100k hps at Heroic WoE or Stone Guards.
So, that nerfs just tuning from ultra-OP state just to OP state =)

Saregon · 11/04/12, 8:09 AM

As a 10-man raider I'm a bit scared of the renewing mist changes.. I'm going from having 80% of the raid covered to just 60% and I can't even choose them
It's not only a matter of hps.. I think I'll have a lot of trouble keeping people alive for example in a spread situation where uplift will hit only half the raid and eminence has merely a 20 yd range.
Personally I would prefer a healing reduction instead of the targets reduction

Kjeldorian · 11/04/12, 1:01 PM

The renewing mist changes do not seem as significant for 10's in that good usage of TFT will still allow for good RM coverage for bursts, Mindlessly having the 80% of the raid covered using two GCDs is not good gameplay, being forced to time your 45 second CD to respond to predictable damage and keeping track of your timers is good gameplay. In addition, the change to the haste breakpoint mechanics as it is as of PTR 11.4.12 allows for harder healing from RM alone than the current Live RM which is good in allowing to heal for significant damage rather than light AoE damage.

Portrero · 11/04/12, 2:47 PM

Yeah, the RM change is more for 25s so you can't replace 2-3 druids or priests with a monk anymore. I think 10s will still be ok and it will encourage smarter use of TFT instead of using it on cooldown. I'm more bummed out about the Chi Burst change, since although in theory it can heal as much as a 9-10 target uplift (on live), its extremely short range and its poor target selection made the spell really situational already, especially in 10s when it's rare for 6 targets to be grouped up easily. It looks like Chi Wave and ZS will remain useless for healers as well.

I really hope Life Cocoon gets some changes; it has some major problems - the hot bonus only lasts as long as the shield and it interrupts the target's casting being the two major ones. Right now it's the equivalent of 2 PW:Ss every 3 minutes and if there's enough damage to warrant it being cast I generally see it blink on and off immediately.

Has anyone found any use for Zen Meditation whatsoever, besides as a personal dispersion?

Eddaren · 11/07/12, 5:56 AM

Originally Posted by Portrero

Has anyone found any use for Zen Meditation whatsoever, besides as a personal dispersion?

I use Zen Meditation (with glyph) to clear ice traps on Stone Guards, it's quite neat. But that's about it.

Maikro · 11/07/12, 11:24 AM

ZM is quite useful. I use it to help mitigate Voodoo Doll damage on others on Heroic Gara'jal (don't use it while you have Voodoo Doll!), and also for other periods of high damage on a few people at once, Shek'zeer, Ta'yak, Un'sok...If your tanks are the only ones really taking significant damage, it can also be used as a cooldown for them. Definitely an underused ability.

lairpie · 11/07/12, 12:17 PM

I think you may be misreading/misunderstanding what Zen Meditation does. It's a 90% damage reduction for you, but it doesn't magically transfer damage that other people are taking to you, it transfers discreet single target spells to you. Like in pvp if you're playing against a warlock and mage, and the warlock dots you up and the mage goes to sheep your partner so they can kill you, you hit zen med and the sheep spell hits you instead of your partner. In pve though it doesn't even seem to redirect things you would think it does just like grounding totem doesn't work on basically anything in pve because it would be broken powerful. Monks were just hoping that blizzard would forget how they've had to hotfix every time grounding totem worked on anything and let us use Zen med to soak up all the Arcane Resonances on ourselves, or something like that.

Atisha · 11/11/12, 12:41 PM

Has anyone tested the new ReM haste cap on the test servers? I am thinking spirit>=crit>haste ~3200 cap>mastery.

Trying to purchase gear accordingly before 5.1. The benefit of one extra ReM seems so small, and it's rare one would only choose between mastery and haste on a piece of gear. But 50% extra haste.... What's better, 450 haste or 300 spirit (which we may not need with our 5.1 regen)? Looks very appealing on paper.

I am thinking it is an easier choice for raiding, whereas I pvp heal and cannot free-channel soothing mists and rarely SCK.

zeraveth · 11/20/12, 9:37 AM

Originally Posted by Atisha

Has anyone tested the new ReM haste cap on the test servers? I am thinking spirit>=crit>haste ~3200 cap>mastery.

Trying to purchase gear accordingly before 5.1. The benefit of one extra ReM seems so small, and it's rare one would only choose between mastery and haste on a piece of gear. But 50% extra haste.... What's better, 450 haste or 300 spirit (which we may not need with our 5.1 regen)? Looks very appealing on paper.

I am thinking it is an easier choice for raiding, whereas I pvp heal and cannot free-channel soothing mists and rarely SCK.

Done any math on the benefit of even aiming for 3200cap?, and since when is mastery better than crit for raidhealing? Even on 25m mastery seem unable to compete with crit. Also we don't really have any mana regen issues at all at current time(going all int bufs/gems, etc possible), and seeing how 5.1 should up be rather on pare with current regen, I don't any change coming from capping current haste cap and going crit for the extra mana tea proc too, although, I'm yet to see the theorycrafting on aiming for higher hastecaps.

Spleener · 11/20/12, 11:30 AM

Going from 150 to 3148 haste is a difference of 2998 rating. You are effectively giving up 4.997% crit for 11.758% haste and a 10% healing boost to ReM (10 to 11 ticks.) Relatively speaking, you're sacrificing ~5% healing on your non-haste-scaling spells (T30, UL) for 6.7% healing on your haste-scaling abilities (soothing, SCK, white hits) and 5% healing to ReM.This effectively means that dropping crit to go from 150->3158 haste is a net hps gain if ReM+soothing+AA+SCK's contribution to your total healing is >= CW/CB/UL/Surging/TP/BoK healing and a net loss if it's less than that. Given that the hardest nerfs are happening to your non-haste spells this is very frequently going to be the case.

In practice, of course, you're not going to be able to have a gear set with exactly 150 haste and everything else crit- even if you reforge everything to crit you're probably going to have about 1-2k haste, which means the value of the breakpoint goes up. As an example, at the midpoint between the two BPs (1649) you're giving up 2.5% healing on your non-haste spells for 3.35% healing on your haste spells and 7.5% healing on ReM, so your non-haste-scaling non-ReM healing has to be quite a bit higher for crit to be better.

This rule will continue to hold for the 6146 breakpoint as well, with the exception that you're gaining 9% ReM healing instead of 10%.

So basically, in the average case you're going to want to go for 3148 haste and then stack crit, though there are probably edge cases where ignoring it in favor of more crit or continuing to drop crit for it is the better call.

Spleener · 11/25/12, 11:39 AM

So I updated the code to Valen's calculator with the 5.1 changes, which will go live whenever Valen gets around to merging it in.

EDIT: changes are now live Valen's Mistweaver Calulations

Some notes:

-1 crit rating comes out to roughly 0.05 mana per chi consumed.
-According to the calculator the breakpoint for the 11th ReM tick is 3145, not 3148. This could be due to some rounding error on my end since how I'm handling the serpent stance haste bonus is a little hack-ey, though, so until someone can confirm I'd go with 3148 to be safe.
-Between the mana cost increase and mana tea change glyphed uplift's hpm is now half the effective hpm of jabx2->uplift for 2.7x the hpct, as opposed to 5.0 where it's roughly 2/3 the hpm for the same 2.7x hpct gain. Glyphing it is probably going to be the right answer in the same situations where it was the right answer in 5.0, you're just going to run dry even faster.
-With the CB nerf combined with the haste buff it's actually possible for RJW->chaining SCK to do more healing than a single CB again. At 3148 haste the difference is very small, though, so unless you can regularly get some nice eminence hits from RJW Xuen is still usually going to be the better choice.

Minister · 11/27/12, 10:23 AM

How did you go about determining when to use Glyph of Uplift? Fight length?

nightlily · 11/27/12, 10:57 AM

Originally Posted by Minister

How did you go about determining when to use Glyph of Uplift? Fight length?

There are two things to consider for this glyph, first being regen. With multiple fights this tier which provide us with extra regen, these fights may end up providing us with excess and otherwise rarely used regen. The other consideration is how you would spend your Chi, which typically means "Are people stacked for Chi Burst?" If not, you'll be relying on lower output chi abilities like Enveloping Mist. So we have to ask, "can I afford it? Can I use my chi efficiently if I use it?" as well as "does this fight benefit much from it?" So for instance, in the Gara'jal fight, when we are stacked the entire time already anyway for chi burst, and when the spirit world GREATLY benefits from uplift spam (because it provides everyone with stacks, and enough regen to more than offset the high cost) we can deduce that not only can we afford to use it quite easily, and that there's a compelling alternative use for chi, but also that the fight mechanics fit uplift spam very well. Personally, that's the only fight I've been using the glyph.

Sasazuka · 11/27/12, 2:39 PM

Looks like an extra change sneaked in:

The healing provided by Enveloping Mists has been reduced by 32%.

Source

Portrero · 11/27/12, 4:07 PM

I assume that's the counterbalance to haste change so that the effective healing of EM stays about the same as it was prepatch.